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    (Original post by LittleMissMay)
    I was as well talking about offline... I actually find online dating a whole new struggle, which is why I don't do it. People are way more shallow online because they've no choice but to go by someone's looks. Anyway, and many times yes men will ask any female with a pulse to be their girlfriend, sadly. "On to the next one" as they say, if they get rejected. And OP can very well be naturally attractive just clueless or crippled by certain insecurities, which is actually kinda normal. I had an ugly duckling phase and then got a clue, but it had nothing to do with makeup and short tight skirts. The best advice anyone can give anyone is to never alter yourself for anyone. Her issue seriously might not even be her looks, and even if it is, the girl still can be attractive and hopeless in the dating world because she still didn't fix her insecurities and still didn't learn how to interact or how to present her personality, which you strangely undervalue in women.

    I guess you could be right about if she is insecure this is putting men off and if she didn't know how to interact with men this could be putting them off, but I am stuggling to think of any "natrually attractive" girls I have encountered that I think have come off this way.

    tbh, it is hard for me to tell what exactly is going in their heads. Possibly you could be right on some girls having issues like this,

    however in this case. I get the impression the guy in question knew how she felt about him so this atleast sugguest some confidence on her part. She mentions she is friendly to people in general as well and has a group of friends so I assuming she isn't socially weird or anything as she can make friends. I am leaning towards that the issue with insecurities is not the main issue in why she got rejected.

    and yes, I underestimate personality [and it's supposide effects on dating] in both women and men. For years I beleived that personality was the most important thing to girls. I was a shy guy and PUA brought me out of my shell a little bit, I got into "PUA" convinced that if i could present a good personality to girls i would be able to bag an attractive girlfriend. But it did not work, I worked hard on my social skills to the point where i could have interesting 20+ minute conversations with complete strangers, i could get girls laughing, smiling, having fun etc ....but at the end of the day when it came to cruch time [them either accepting or declining a date offer from myself" they always would have some excuse. "im not looking to date right now" , "im too busy with uni work" , "i have a boyfriend". I'm not going to lie, the girls i used to go for were usually better looking than me and of a differant race, but that shouldn't really have been such a problem right? if personality was as important as it was claimed. Afterall, EVERYBODY kept saying personality was the most important thing.

    I went speed dating a few times, I got almost no matches. Many women appeared to be flirting with me, but at the end of the day it was obviously fake flirting. I think I actually broke down after the 4th time it happened.

    I started strongly suspecting that my personality wasn't the problem. I conducted a few online dating experiments too, with good looking [mostly white] guys to confirm.

    In the end I finally saw the truth, which was that personality mattered very little to the opposite sex. I was not as good looking as I thought I was, and that race mattered a huge amount, but the thing that mattered the most was TYPE/LOOKS.

    After finally being awakened I decided to take action. I changed my hair/ style and started working out. gradually I started noticing womens reactions towards me change, they were not so quick to instantly claim they were busy or had a boyfriend when i tried to chat them up. A few of them would even give me their number now too. Once ina blue moon i'd even get a bit of unsolicited attention in the street too. Usually the girls were too young though. In nightclubs I started getting approached. At first it was like once in every 4 times i went clubbing. Eventually growing to literally everytime i went.

    on saturday in the club a girl approached me and bought me a drink. I got her number. She seemed nice, I was going to call her ...but then she did something to annoy me so i have decided not to call her. The old me would have HAD to call her. I would put up with girls treating me wrong as i knew i wouldn't be able to find another. But now i have better prospects and know other opperunities are not too far away.

    I am glad my dating life has improved, but sadened greatly by the shallowness of the human species in general. My personality has not changed much, just my style/hair and physique.

    I also cannot bear to see advice about how personality is King.
    It's rubbish, absolute rubbish.
    A persons success in dating literally 80% about TYPE/LOOKS,
    how well to you fit your object of desire's TYPE or LOOKS preferances will ultimately decide how likely you are to get anywhere with them.

    I cannot tell someone or encourage someone to work on their "personality" knowing first hand how little it actually matters. People in general like to beleive that they are not shallow, but they are. Which is why I have reccomended the OP to think about changing her apperance/style. Some of the best advice i've ever heard is not to listen to what women say regarding dating but WATCH WHAT THEY DO. .
    I'm not just trying to say women are shallow, men are shallow too.
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    (Original post by ANM775)
    x.


    Didn't read but I agree personality is only a small percentage, I can easily change how I act around someone. I don't think my personality has ever stayed constant. Changing one's looks is harder and I don't believe you can be with someone if you are not physcially attracted to them.
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    let me resolve this once and for all:

    hot girls who are DTF will get the hot guys. whether the hot guys are "bad guys" or not is irrelevant. you don't need to be nice or bad to be hot/****able
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    (Original post by RugbyFighter)
    Didn't read but I agree personality is only a small percentage, I can easily change how I act around someone. I don't think my personality has ever stayed constant. Changing one's looks is harder and I don't believe you can be with someone if you are not physcially attracted to them.
    Idk why you'd respond to say you didn't read but anyway ANM775 I'll definitely read this right now and respond
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    (Original post by ANM775)
    I guess you could be right about if she is insecure this is putting men off and if she didn't know how to interact with men this could be putting them off, but I am stuggling to think of any "natrually attractive" girls I have encountered that I think have come off this way.

    tbh, it is hard for me to tell what exactly is going in their heads. Possibly you could be right on some girls having issues like this,

    however in this case. I get the impression the guy in question knew how she felt about him so this atleast sugguest some confidence on her part. She mentions she is friendly to people in general as well and has a group of friends so I assuming she isn't socially weird or anything as she can make friends. I am leaning towards that the issue with insecurities is not the main issue in why she got rejected.

    and yes, I underestimate personality [and it's supposide effects on dating] in both women and men. For years I beleived that personality was the most important thing to girls. I was a shy guy and PUA brought me out of my shell a little bit, I got into "PUA" convinced that if i could present a good personality to girls i would be able to bag an attractive girlfriend. But it did not work, I worked hard on my social skills to the point where i could have interesting 20+ minute conversations with complete strangers, i could get girls laughing, smiling, having fun etc ....but at the end of the day when it came to cruch time [them either accepting or declining a date offer from myself" they always would have some excuse. "im not looking to date right now" , "im too busy with uni work" , "i have a boyfriend". I'm not going to lie, the girls i used to go for were usually better looking than me and of a differant race, but that shouldn't really have been such a problem right? if personality was as important as it was claimed. Afterall, EVERYBODY kept saying personality was the most important thing.

    I went speed dating a few times, I got almost no matches. Many women appeared to be flirting with me, but at the end of the day it was obviously fake flirting. I think I actually broke down after the 4th time it happened.

    I started strongly suspecting that my personality wasn't the problem. I conducted a few online dating experiments too, with good looking [mostly white] guys to confirm.

    In the end I finally saw the truth, which was that personality mattered very little to the opposite sex. I was not as good looking as I thought I was, and that race mattered a huge amount, but the thing that mattered the most was TYPE/LOOKS.

    After finally being awakened I decided to take action. I changed my hair/ style and started working out. gradually I started noticing womens reactions towards me change, they were not so quick to instantly claim they were busy or had a boyfriend when i tried to chat them up. A few of them would even give me their number now too. Once ina blue moon i'd even get a bit of unsolicited attention in the street too. Usually the girls were too young though. In nightclubs I started getting approached. At first it was like once in every 4 times i went clubbing. Eventually growing to literally everytime i went.

    on saturday in the club a girl approached me and bought me a drink. I got her number. She seemed nice, I was going to call her ...but then she did something to annoy me so i have decided not to call her. The old me would have HAD to call her. I would put up with girls treating me wrong as i knew i wouldn't be able to find another. But now i have better prospects and know other opperunities are not too far away.

    I am glad my dating life has improved, but sadened greatly by the shallowness of the human species in general. My personality has not changed much, just my style/hair and physique.

    I also cannot bear to see advice about how personality is King.
    It's rubbish, absolute rubbish.
    A persons success in dating literally 80% about TYPE/LOOKS,
    how well to you fit your object of desire's TYPE or LOOKS preferances will ultimately decide how likely you are to get anywhere with them.

    I cannot tell someone or encourage someone to work on their "personality" knowing first hand how little it actually matters. People in general like to beleive that they are not shallow, but they are. Which is why I have reccomended the OP to think about changing her apperance/style. Some of the best advice i've ever heard is not to listen to what women say regarding dating but WATCH WHAT THEY DO. .
    I'm not just trying to say women are shallow, men are shallow too.
    Well tbh it just sounds like you're jaded based on your own personal experiences. I feel as long as she has the basics like a healthy okay enough physique, healthy skin even if not perfect obviously, healthy clean hair at least even if not luscious shiny and long, and doesn't smell it can't be her looks. I'm sure she'd know it's her looks, or if it's her race, I hope op isn't someone who wants us to brainstorm her issue when she knows it's that she is morbidly obese/anorexic or balding or has horrible hygiene or only goes for a certain race, etc. She can also have friends, but making girlfriends as a girl is not getting a boyfriend as a girl. She probably just doesn't have what it takes to radiate confidence and sex appeal. You don't have to be a stunner to get guys lol then the human population would die out since most people are average if not hideous to someone else.
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    (Original post by LittleMissMay)
    Idk why you'd respond to say you didn't read but anyway ANM775 I'll definitely read this right now and respond

    As I was scrolling past it I saw they said something like personality isnt key
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    (Original post by LittleMissMay)
    Well tbh it just sounds like you're jaded based on your own personal experiences. I feel as long as she has the basics like a healthy okay enough physique, healthy skin even if not perfect obviously, healthy clean hair at least even if not luscious shiny and long, and doesn't smell it can't be her looks. I'm sure she'd know it's her looks, or if it's her race, I hope op isn't someone who wants us to brainstorm her issue when she knows it's that she is morbidly obese/anorexic or balding or has horrible hygiene or only goes for a certain race, etc. She can also have friends, but making girlfriends as a girl is not getting a boyfriend as a girl. She probably just doesn't have what it takes to radiate confidence and sex appeal. You don't have to be a stunner to get guys lol then the human population would die out since most people are average if not hideous to someone else.

    if this girl is conventually average or below average in terms of facial attractiveness then having the "basics" may not be enough though to get non thirsty guys persuing her..
    most guys want a pretty girl not a basics girl, and are more likely to fancy a pretty girl.

    when you go to Sainsbury's do you buy their "basics" range
    or do you reach for the good stuff?.

    personally speaking there are some average girls and perhaps a few unattractive girls I would date, but im far more likely to fancy a pretty girl. I do not think most men think radically differant to me on this.

    and no, she might not know it her was her looks. Most people actually over-rate their looks, i've seen some scienfic articles on it. It's a real phenomenon Don't be fooled by the TSR topic where eveyone is rating themselves like 3/10. The majority of them just don't want to appear stuck up or have someone go into their profile and pull out a pic of them and rip them to peices. Most people actually think they are above average. I know I used to, and it took a long time for me to accept that I wasn't. To this day i am still super critical over the way i look, but perhaps it's better that I don't think im super attractive as it keeps me trying to improve myself.

    and yes, I admit I might be somewhat jaded with the whole looks/personality thing but with my experiences it's impossible not to be.

    and yes, a girl doesn't have to be a stunner to get guys, but if she wants to pick and choose the guys she wants to have relationships with then looking good will help a lot. If you don't look good, it's more likely you will have to just "settle" for whatever comes your way.

    There's never been more pressure for both men and women to look good. smartphones and dating apps have just made everything so much worst and lead to generation "Picky" , where you're only 1 swipe away from the next "buff" girl/boy.

    I'm actually scared for the children of tommorow with where this is headed.

    unfortunately the OP needs to get with the times or get left behind. She needs to wake up and realise just how important apperance is. Trying to be a "bad girl" ain't gonna help at all. OP is hearing the cliche of "women only go for bad guys" and thinking the opposite is true too. tbh, im not even sure i agree with his cliche, but i definately don't think bad girls gets guys hearts pumping
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Oh so you mean sadists who want to abuse them and corrupt their innocence i.e. turn them into their own personal bad girl
    Well, Not to turn them into a bad girl, I think the whole idea is that they want to to do bad stuff to a good girl. I don't think they find bad girls attractive.

    I'm not so sure though I've never met such a person in real life, I've only read about it. :laugh: You should ask the Mr grey types yourself.

    PS I don't advocate abusive relationships
 
 
 
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