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    (Original post by AlmightyJesus)
    but really, after reading what you said after your 2 part intro, I was expressing agreement
    well thanks
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    Yes because the feminist lies are like the civil rights movement.
    At the end of the day think about it. It's the same thing. Discrimination based on physical appearance. Yes, there was slavery etc, none of which has been implemented on women (well, not largely), but really, its discrimination based on the fact that BY 50% CHANCE humans were born with vaginas. Does that change our mental capability???? NO?? So are you therefore implying that its ok for women to be treated differently based on physical attributes which mean absolutely nothing???
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    (Original post by z33)
    Well that's a problem with the culture and the ****tards that are running their mouths. Ofc men have problems no one said they didnt. And that crime is absolutely disgusting, just take feminism out of it and it's women assaulting women for disagreeing with them. That's just plain wrong and should be punished accordingly, but it shouldn't have an effect on the overall goal of the movement here which is for women to reach equality to men. We are very close to this goal now and soon there'll no longer be a need for feminism, but it doesn't mean we have to start going against it now and going backwards, but rather the actual feminists have to speak out and say no that's wrong and I'm sure after that incident twitter went crazy anyway
    "women to reach equality to men" I would argue that this point isn't going to happen with feminism it only focuses on problems 50% of the population has and ignores the benefits they have so equality can not happen without feminists acknowledging they have some advantages.
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    (Original post by hsm998)
    At the end of the day think about it. It's the same thing. Discrimination based on physical appearance. Yes, there was slavery etc, none of which has been implemented on women (well, not largely), but really, its discrimination based on the fact that BY 50% CHANCE humans were born with vaginas. Does that change our mental capability???? NO?? So are you therefore implying that its ok for women to be treated differently based on physical attributes which mean absolutely nothing???
    The difference is that blacks actually were oppressed, pretty much everything I have saw feminists argue have actual causes what isn't to do with their made up "patriarchy" Wage gap is down to choice and rape culture is down to bad statistics used by the feminists looking for problems if you have any other things you want me to prove or want more evidence just ask

    I'm not saying there is absolutely no problems but feminists are looking for huge conspiracies to keep women down rather than looking at the actual causes
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    "women to reach equality to men" I would argue that this point isn't going to happen with feminism it only focuses on problems 50% of the population has and ignores the benefits they have so equality can not happen without feminists acknowledging they have some advantages.
    well it IS for equality, so if we have advantages we'll fight for men to have the same privileges i.e. they are equal to us and we are equal to them
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    (Original post by z33)
    well it IS for equality, so if we have advantages we'll fight for men to have the same privileges i.e. they are equal to us and we are equal to them
    Except that I have never heard feminists talked about men's issues except to show how bad men are and when I mention these problems I get called a misogynist and apparently so is the egalitarian movement.
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    The difference is that blacks actually were oppressed, pretty much everything I have saw feminists argue have actual causes what isn't to do with their made up "patriarchy" Wage gap is down to choice and rape culture is down to bad statistics used by the feminists looking for problems if you have any other things you want me to prove or want more evidence just ask

    I'm not saying there is absolutely no problems but feminists are looking for huge conspiracies to keep women down rather than looking at the actual causes
    oh my, are you really saying that women have never been oppressed??how about the fact that until recently, women could not legally drive in Saudi Arabia?? or maybe how women in the western world today STILL can't serve on the front line in the army?? And yes, or course, feminism is based on women "looking for problems" and trying to keep each other down (whatever that means). And by causes, what exactly do you mean?
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    Feminists are not terrorists. Why against them? Let them run wild.

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    (Original post by hsm998)
    oh my, are you really saying that women have never been oppressed??how about the fact that until recently, women could not legally drive in Saudi Arabia?? or maybe how women in the western world today STILL can't serve on the front line in the army?? And yes, or course, feminism is based on women "looking for problems" and trying to keep each other down (whatever that means). And by causes, what exactly do you mean?
    I mean that now women aren't oppressed that is why I have and will continue to say feminism 100 years ago and even more recently was a good thing but to state today that women are oppressed in the western world is untrue.

    When was the last time feminists talked about Saudi Arabia? I have stated before that countries like Saudi need something like feminism

    I mean things like personal choice working fewer hours.

    I never said 'looking for problems' I have said there are small problems but feminists aren't focusing on fixing these as there are problems both ways what I have said is that they are obsessed with finding a huge conspiracy of a patriarchy.

    When I said keep women down that was regarding the huge conspiracies they are trying to say exists.

    If you are going to disagree with my points actually read and comment on those points don't reword them to completely change the meaning to support your argument please
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    I still stand by my earlier point: 'Feminism is important.' Now more so than ever. For both genders!!!
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    I mean that now women aren't oppressed that is why I have and will continue to say feminism 100 years ago and even more recently was a good thing but to state today that women are oppressed in the western world is untrue.

    When was the last time feminists talked about Saudi Arabia? I have stated before that countries like Saudi need something like feminism

    I mean things like personal choice working fewer hours.

    I never said 'looking for problems' I have said there are small problems but feminists aren't focusing on fixing these as there are problems both ways what I have said is that they are obsessed with finding a huge conspiracy of a patriarchy.

    When I said keep women down that was regarding the huge conspiracies they are trying to say exists.
    If you are going to disagree with my points actually read and comment on those points don't reword them to completely change the meaning to support your argument please
    you literally said "feminists looking for problems" oh dear. Also, yes, the western world is much more developed in terms of equality, and looking at it from a black/white perspective, yes the fundamental and basic human rights have changed for the better. However, to say that men and women have equality in the western world, I'm sorry, is laughable. To be honest, while feminism by definition is equality in all aspects of life, I think theres a bit more to it in that it strives to abolish the social stereotypes that still remain within the genders i.e. only men can do physical work, only women can be in touch with their emotions, and in my opinion, feminism is hugely important today, all over the world, for both sexes.
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    (Original post by z33)
    You don't wanna be treated equal to your male counterparts? You don't want to be paid the same for the same amount of work you do? You don't want to vote? You don't want to have the right to divorce your husband whenever you want to? You don't wanna drive a vehicle? You don't want to become whatever you wanted to? You don't wanna own property for yourself? Well you can go to Saudi Arabia and see how ya like it there, where you're treated like a slave and a sex object. Because that's what feminism has achieved. The bloody definition is:


    it never said women and men are equal or one is superior mentally or physically, it's a movement to get the world to treat women as equal to men. EQUALITY. not SUPERIORITY. So for you to just dismiss everything that women in the past have sacrificed their LIVES to give you, then m8 idek what to say like get off the internet and make a sandwich for your man
    This ^^^^^^^^^^^
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    Feminism is a good idea in principle in my opinion as this is the 21st century- the pay gap is ridiculous. However, the feminist movement is being represented by Feminazis more and more. I also think that the Feminazis need to appreciate that- while women have a right to have time off work on maternity- it is a pain for the employer and some people do take advantage of coming back to work for the minimum amount of time between children simply so that they can continue receiving maternity pay.
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    (Original post by Dandaman1)
    Feminism supposedly fights for gender equality, but only from the perspective of women. That's the key problem with it. Feminists are so carried away with percieved injustices towards women, women's rights, women's issues, and so on, that feminism often becomes incredibly biased and un-equal in its approach. Inequalities men face (sometimes at the hand of modern feminism itself) are frequently ignored, derided, or even encouraged as a result. And now we have a situation where women in the West are running out of problems, so they have to exaggerate or even make them up entirely!
    Its focused on women, given that men have never been oppressed in the same way that women have in the past!! Also doesn't mean we're man haters
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    I consider myself a feminist. The angry, man hating, SJW feminists the media likes to portray are just a minority, most feminists are not like that. Nonetheless, I do think the movement has many faults; third wave feminism has become synonymous with angry women calling everything misogynistic (and it can be like this at times), however completely disregarding it, in my opinion, is misguided. One of the main objectives third wave feminism attempts to achieve is to diminish gender roles, which is only a good thing for society.

    Even if you disagree with modern feminism, disregarding the whole entire movement is just disrespectful to all the women that fought for equal pay, right to vote etc. Without feminism, us women wouldn't have the great prospects we have now, and we would be our husband's slaves.
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    (Original post by hsm998)
    you literally said "feminists looking for problems" oh dear. Also, yes, the western world is much more developed in terms of equality, and looking at it from a black/white perspective, yes the fundamental and basic human rights have changed for the better. However, to say that men and women have equality in the western world, I'm sorry, is laughable. To be honest, while feminism by definition is equality in all aspects of life, I think theres a bit more to it in that it strives to abolish the social stereotypes that still remain within the genders i.e. only men can do physical work, only women can be in touch with their emotions, and in my opinion, feminism is hugely important today, all over the world, for both sexes.
    ok I saw were I said it and well done for taking that way out of contex and twisting it to suit your argument. It was meant that feminists who aren't looking at things objectively and are looking at statistics with confirmation bias and not looking at the statistics objectively and they will always find a problem as that is how they see the world.

    I never said that men and women are equal I said men and women both have advantages and disadvantages and it works both ways and feminists are either ignorant of this fact or have decided these advantages are not relevant to equality. Where did I say we live in a totally equal place?
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    The amount of positive discrimination women have got and the way men have suffered as a result is appalling. It's not right as men have been indirectly discriminated against as well.
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    ok I saw were I said it and well done for taking that way out of contex and twisting it to suit your argument. It was meant that feminists who aren't looking at things objectively and are looking at statistics with confirmation bias and not looking at the statistics objectively and they will always find a problem as that is how they see the world.

    I never said that men and women are equal I said men and women both have advantages and disadvantages and it works both ways and feminists are either ignorant of this fact or have decided these advantages are not relevant to equality. Where did I say we live in a totally equal place?
    the world isn't made of objective statistics either though. The beauty of feminism and in fact any movement is that there are no certified objective answers, which you are clearly looking for. tbh i need to get on with my life, you have your opinion and i certainly have mine
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    (Original post by drowzee)
    I consider myself a feminist. The angry, man hating, SJW feminists the media likes to portray are just a minority, most feminists are not like that. Nonetheless, I do think the movement has many faults; third wave feminism has become synonymous with angry women calling everything misogynistic (and it can be like this at times), however completely disregarding it, in my opinion, is misguided. One of the main objectives third wave feminism attempts to achieve is to diminish gender roles, which is only a good thing for society.

    Even if you disagree with modern feminism, disregarding the whole entire movement is just disrespectful to all the women that fought for equal pay, right to vote etc. Without feminism, us women wouldn't have the great prospects we have now, and we would be our husband's slaves.
    Well this 'minority' of SJW radicals seems to speak for a great many student unions, websites, university faculties, and media outlets accross the English speaking world.

    You can't keep calling them a minority when there are so God damn many. They're the only feminist voices we ever seem to hear. Do you believe in rape culture, the wage gap, and hetero normative patriarchal oppression? Read Jezebel, Salon.com...? Maybe you're one of them. I find most feminists who claim they aren't the 'radical' types that so many people hate actually believe most of the same stuff, anyway.
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    Everyone gets the wrong impression of feminism because of the bad minority of feminists (like the *****y ones on tumblr) rather than the positives of gender equality. The definition posted on the first page IS feminism and thats why I'd call myself a feminist, as such anyone not believing in feminism just doesn't believe in gender equality as they're the same thing.
 
 
 
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