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Where are the Brexiters' figures? watch

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    We haven't seen as much as a sheet of A4 from the leavers about what would happen to the UK economy if the UK leaves the EU, not one.

    They say we could be like Norway, Canada or Switzerland but they are all different. Leavers have been wanting to leave for years so they had plenty of time to do the number crunching to tell us what the likely outcome will be.

    The fact they have not produced any information that stands up to scrutiny can only mean one of two things.

    1. They haven't done a thing to prove their economic case and rely on emotional and meaningless phrases like sovereignty and migrants.

    2. They have done the number crunching and it is so dire they have buried it because the economy will nosedive when the UK leave the EU.

    I would like to know which one is the real reason.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    We haven't seen as much as a sheet of A4 from the leavers about what would happen to the UK economy if the UK leaves the EU, not one.

    They say we could be like Norway, Canada or Switzerland but they are all different. Leavers have been wanting to leave for years so they had plenty of time to do the number crunching to tell us what the likely outcome will be.

    The fact they have not produced any information that stands up to scrutiny can only mean one of two things.

    1. They haven't done a thing to prove their economic case and rely on emotional and meaningless phrases like sovereignty and migrants.

    2. They have done the number crunching and it is so dire they have buried it because the economy will nosedive when the UK leave the EU.

    I would like to know which one is the real reason.
    They are not meaningless phrases to some people
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    They dont seem to have produced much so far. there are already a lot of surveys out there, but for everyone a lot of what happens is an unknown and eductated guesswork, hence the better the devil you know argument for some.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    We haven't seen as much as a sheet of A4 from the leavers about what would happen to the UK economy if the UK leaves the EU, not one.

    They say we could be like Norway, Canada or Switzerland but they are all different. Leavers have been wanting to leave for years so they had plenty of time to do the number crunching to tell us what the likely outcome will be.

    The fact they have not produced any information that stands up to scrutiny can only mean one of two things.

    1. They haven't done a thing to prove their economic case and rely on emotional and meaningless phrases like sovereignty and migrants.

    2. They have done the number crunching and it is so dire they have buried it because the economy will nosedive when the UK leave the EU.

    I would like to know which one is the real reason.
    I think asking people to show the net benefit or cost of EU membership, or even whether it's a benefit or cost on net, is akin to asking people to predict what interest rates will be in five years. Any prediction is essentially worthless. This is a problem in that it makes decision making harder but I do not think it is a problem exclusive to the Leave side.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    We haven't seen as much as a sheet of A4 from the leavers about what would happen to the UK economy if the UK leaves the EU, not one.

    They say we could be like Norway, Canada or Switzerland but they are all different. Leavers have been wanting to leave for years so they had plenty of time to do the number crunching to tell us what the likely outcome will be.

    The fact they have not produced any information that stands up to scrutiny can only mean one of two things.

    1. They haven't done a thing to prove their economic case and rely on emotional and meaningless phrases like sovereignty and migrants.

    2. They have done the number crunching and it is so dire they have buried it because the economy will nosedive when the UK leave the EU.

    I would like to know which one is the real reason.
    Well, it's quite simple you become an independent country. Last time I checked, every other country in the world except those in the EU is that way.
    Hope this simple fact helped.

    Also, you obviously do not follow politics, or, if you do, you only look at your side. Also, you haven't looked at the number crunching on the in side, take for example the 4.3k figure per household. That is based upon 3 million extra migrants, care to explain how that will happen when we leave?
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    I think asking people to show the net benefit or cost of EU membership, or even whether it's a benefit or cost on net, is akin to asking people to predict what interest rates will be in five years. Any prediction is essentially worthless. This is a problem in that it makes decision making harder but I do not think it is a problem exclusive to the Leave side.
    This. It's about time someone showed some strength and told people asking for a set of completely spurious numbers to grow up.


    (Original post by balanced)
    Well, it's quite simple you become an independent country. Last time I checked, every other country in the world except those in the EU is that way.
    Hope this simple fact helped.

    Also, you obviously do not follow politics, or, if you do, you only look at your side. Also, you haven't looked at the number crunching on the in side, take for example the 4.3k figure per household. That is based upon 3 million extra migrants, care to explain how that will happen when we leave?
    Planning on leaving NATO and the UN as well then?
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    (Original post by mojojojo101)
    This. It's about time someone showed some strength and told people asking for a set of completely spurious numbers to grow up.




    Planning on leaving NATO and the UN as well then?
    No, they aren't superseding our laws and controlling our borders lol
    It's also good to leave the EU as it would give us a higher position in both of those organisations, as we have the most powerful 'soft-touch' (political persuasion) and are the 2nd most politically important country. Militarily, we're 4th too, so that will help.
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    balanced open Europe suggests that immigration will continue to rise post brexit as it has in all developed countries eg Canada.

    http://openeurope.org.uk/intelligenc...ide-to-brexit/

    How on earth will leaving the EU improve our standing in the UN and NATO???
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    balanced open Europe suggests that immigration will continue to rise post brexit as it has in all developed countries eg Canada.

    http://openeurope.org.uk/intelligenc...ide-to-brexit/

    How on earth will leaving the EU improve our standing in the UN and NATO???
    Britain has a substantial ‘portfolio of power’ in its own right, which includes membership of the G20 and G8 Nations, a permanent seat on the UN Security Council (one of only 5 members) and seats on the International Monetary Fund Board of Governors and World Trade Organisation.
    -The UK also lies at heart of the Commonwealth of 53 nations. Moreover, London is the financial capital of the world and Britain has the sixth largest economy. The UK is also in the top ten manufacturing nations in the world.-Far from increasing British influence in the world, the EU is undermining UK influence.
    - The EU is demanding there is a single voice for the EU in the UN and in the IMF. The EU has also made the British economy and City of London less competitive through overregulation and negotiates more protectionist and less effective trade deals on behalf of the UK.
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    (Original post by balanced)
    Britain has a substantial ‘portfolio of power’ in its own right, which includes membership of the G20 and G8 Nations, a permanent seat on the UN Security Council (one of only 5 members) and seats on the International Monetary Fund Board of Governors and World Trade Organisation.

    so the EU isn't dragging us down then!

    -The UK also lies at heart of the Commonwealth of 53 nations. Moreover, London is the financial capital of the world and Britain has the sixth largest economy. The UK is also in the top ten manufacturing nations in the world.-Far from increasing British influence in the world, the EU is undermining UK influence.

    again, it sort of undermines your argument saying how good the UK is despite being in the EU.

    No, the UK is twenty kilometres away from France and U.S. In in the continent of Europe. The nearest commonwealth is across an ocean. Yeah we should leave the EU and have closer ties with Uganda and Pakistan. THEY won't trouble us with complying to Human Rights..


    - The EU is demanding there is a single voice for the EU in the UN and in the IMF. The EU has also made the British economy and City of London less competitive through overregulation and negotiates more protectionist and less effective trade deals on behalf of the UK.

    the EU can demand all it wants its up to us. Tbh I think we benefit far more from being in the EU than the UN.

    After the financial crisis I think that's a very good thing.
    responses in italics on the quote
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    But what about my sovereignty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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    (Original post by balanced)
    Britain has a substantial ‘portfolio of power’ in its own right, which includes membership of the G20 and G8 Nations, a permanent seat on the UN Security Council (one of only 5 members) and seats on the International Monetary Fund Board of Governors and World Trade Organisation.
    -The UK also lies at heart of the Commonwealth of 53 nations. Moreover, London is the financial capital of the world and Britain has the sixth largest economy. The UK is also in the top ten manufacturing nations in the world.-Far from increasing British influence in the world, the EU is undermining UK influence.
    - The EU is demanding there is a single voice for the EU in the UN and in the IMF. The EU has also made the British economy and City of London less competitive through overregulation and negotiates more protectionist and less effective trade deals on behalf of the UK.
    1) we control our borders and have not signed up to the Schengen passport free zone
    2) there's a reason we have a strong economy, 44% of our exports go to the EU whereas only 16% of the EU's exports come to us
    3) leaving the EU means re-negotiating a trade agreement like Switzerland and Norway, and guess what price they pay for being part of the European Economic Area, they have to implement EU directives, Implement ECJ rulings and accept the free movement of people, without getting a say in any of the decision making process. Does that sound like a better option?
    4) it isn't such a bad thing that a lot of UK Law has derived from EU directives, would you be happy with the abolition of the Equality Act?
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    But what about my sovereignty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    well you wont have any and i take it you dont want any?...
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    (Original post by Maker)
    We haven't seen as much as a sheet of A4 from the leavers about what would happen to the UK economy if the UK leaves the EU, not one.

    They say we could be like Norway, Canada or Switzerland but they are all different. Leavers have been wanting to leave for years so they had plenty of time to do the number crunching to tell us what the likely outcome will be.

    The fact they have not produced any information that stands up to scrutiny can only mean one of two things.

    1. They haven't done a thing to prove their economic case and rely on emotional and meaningless phrases like sovereignty and migrants.

    2. They have done the number crunching and it is so dire they have buried it because the economy will nosedive when the UK leave the EU.

    I would like to know which one is the real reason.
    Just like the remain figures were lies the out campaign simply doesn't want to do it.

    Whatever they say will be wrong as they don't 100% know anything as in who will do the negotiation, how long the talks will last and of course what deal will be done because durr it hasn't been negotiated yet.

    You can only do something on balance of probability


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    (Original post by paul514)
    Just like the remain figures were lies the out campaign simply doesn't want to do it.

    Whatever they say will be wrong as they don't 100% know anything as in who will do the negotiation, how long the talks will last and of course what deal will be done because durr it hasn't been negotiated yet.

    You can only do something on balance of probability


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    So you want people to vote on no evidence that leaving is better for them even if it means they might lose their jobs and have less money?
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    (Original post by Anna0987)
    1) we control our borders and have not signed up to the Schengen passport free zone
    2) there's a reason we have a strong economy, 44% of our exports go to the EU whereas only 16% of the EU's exports come to us
    3) leaving the EU means re-negotiating a trade agreement like Switzerland and Norway, and guess what price they pay for being part of the European Economic Area, they have to implement EU directives, Implement ECJ rulings and accept the free movement of people, without getting a say in any of the decision making process. Does that sound like a better option?
    4) it isn't such a bad thing that a lot of UK Law has derived from EU directives, would you be happy with the abolition of the Equality Act?
    1) we don't control our borders, we can't/don't choose who can come in even if they are a criminal.
    2) Obvious attempt at manipulating figures. still, when you think how much we account for the whole of the EU, that's a huge reason to leave as it gives us a huge amount of leverage as they depend on us.
    3)no it doesn't, but notice how there is no set option, each country gets a different deal. Luckily we are much larger than Norway, and have the most power in political persuasion in the world, which helps a tad bit on these things.
    4) it is bad that they are unelected and I would abolish the act and make one for ourselves
    It seems clear to me that: you trust unelected figures more than elected figures. You also do not think we are an important country.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    So you want people to vote on no evidence that leaving is better for them even if it means they might lose their jobs and have less money?
    Yep

    It's done on probability everything else is a lie


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    Probably because the out campaign wasn't given £11mil extra to spend on a nationwide leaflet campaign. I'll probably vote in on June the 3rd, but the bias is disgusting and amounts to little more than government propaganda to be frank
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    (Original post by Maker)
    We haven't seen as much as a sheet of A4
    I think you mean a sheet of foolscap 😈


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    (Original post by leinad2012)
    Probably because the out campaign wasn't given £11mil extra to spend on a nationwide leaflet campaign. I'll probably vote in on June the 3rd, but the bias is disgusting and amounts to little more than government propaganda to be frank
    What does a leaflet campaign have to do with the utter lack of evidence for their statements? They could've been given £1billion to spend on a leaflet campaign but they'd still have no facts to put in their leaflets.
 
 
 
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