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Why are people voting to remain in Europe? watch

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    You're voting away your own control of the borders, when the time comes, don't bother moaning about rampant immigration in the UK.
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    How do you explain the 300,000 non-EU immigrants that legally came to the UK despite a target of 100,000? These are the ones we could turn away tomorrow if we wanted. But we either don't or can't. And why is it that despite record levels of immigration, we still have historically low levels of unemployment? It just doesn't make sense. It is almost as if all these immigrants are actually helping our economy.
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    How do you explain the 300,000 non-EU immigrants that legally came to the UK despite a target of 100,000? These are the ones we could turn away tomorrow if we wanted. But we either don't or can't. And why is it that despite record levels of immigration, we still have historically low levels of unemployment? It just doesn't make sense. It is almost as if all these immigrants are actually helping our economy.
    Immigration is the politicised issue in the EU Referendum debate but! the true issue in this respect, is the control of immigration. I am not denying the positive effects what immigration brings, whether they immigration comes from the EU or non-EU, with the 300K figure you have highlighted. My two law lecturers in my first year both came from Africa and they were wonderful! However, it also cannot be denied of the negative effects of those who don't contribute, those who take advantage of the EU's open-border policy. Now! before it is argued that we have control of our borders and not signed up to Schengen (both true!), the fact we are a EU member, the European Court of Justice has ruled against the UK's decisions at Border Control, to allow non-EU immigrants to enter freely.

    On the issue of employment, the European Commission has admitted there would be high rates of unemployment once the TTIP deal is sealed, that will bring a 'prolonged and substantial' effect, despite the fact 2m Europeans petitioned against it. While the EU does bring jobs, European policies are questionable - even admitted by Brussells' Finance Chief that the European Central Bank's policies are making the 'little people' poorer and that this is the fault of EU leaders not promoting jobs and growth across Europe (http://www.express.co.uk/news/politi...-Merkel-Brexit) so! would it not be beneficial to withdraw from the EU, rejoin EFTA to have access to employment and have the right to refuse laws we don't agree with: confirmed by Full-Fact (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv22aRdLjKY)
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    How do you explain the 300,000 non-EU immigrants that legally came to the UK despite a target of 100,000? These are the ones we could turn away tomorrow if we wanted. But we either don't or can't. And why is it that despite record levels of immigration, we still have historically low levels of unemployment? It just doesn't make sense. It is almost as if all these immigrants are actually helping our economy.
    That one
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    (Original post by HOLA255)
    You're voting away your own control of the borders, when the time comes, don't bother moaning about rampant immigration in the UK.
    We already are in charge of our own borders, as we aren't a Schengen Area member. Why do you think there are so many refugees at Calais? If we weren't in charge, they would be able to pass straight into Britain without passport checks.
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    (Original post by george_c00per)
    We already are in charge of our own borders, as we aren't a Schengen Area member. Why do you think there are so many refugees at Calais? If we weren't in charge, they would be able to pass straight into Britain without passport checks.
    If you read my comment above, I don't deny that the UK has control - on the immigration point (as immigration is not the only reason in the debate) - but! not ultimate control, as the European Court of Justice overrules UK decisions to let non-EU immigrants in without requiring a residence permit
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    Well blame the politicians, the UK did open it's borders to 8 new Eastern European countries in 2004 when they didn't have to.
    Germany, France and other richers EU countries only allowed free movement in 2011. The UK could've applied for an extention of 7 years but they didn't
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    (Original post by _icecream)
    Well blame the politicians, the UK did open it's borders to 8 new Eastern European countries in 2004 when they didn't have to.
    Germany, France and other richers EU countries only allowed free movement in 2011. The UK could've applied for an extention of 7 years but they didn't
    Whether b/w 2004-2016 or 2011-2016, the borders are open, with the UK only having so much control over them. UK Immigration laws and powers of the Home Secretary to ban people, are subject to EU rules. By way of example, it has been campaigned and requested of Theresa May to prevent Marine Le Pen from entering the UK to intervene in the Brexit debate, but told that she could not, despite the argument her extremist views are not condusive for public good
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    (Original post by HOLA255)
    You're voting away your own control of the borders, when the time comes, don't bother moaning about rampant immigration in the UK.

    The only people moaning about immigration are people who know nothing about immigration. EU immigrants are, on average, more educated that natives and fill the skilled roles we need filled. They bring massive amounts of money into our economy.

    (Original post by ByEeek)
    How do you explain the 300,000 non-EU immigrants that legally came to the UK despite a target of 100,000? These are the ones we could turn away tomorrow if we wanted. But we either don't or can't. And why is it that despite record levels of immigration, we still have historically low levels of unemployment? It just doesn't make sense. It is almost as if all these immigrants are actually helping our economy.
    This is also a very good point. People act as if the EU prevents us from controlling immigration, when we can't even control non-EU immigration.
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    It must be all those colouring in books the EU keeps brainwashing us with.
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    (Original post by animus01)
    Immigration is the politicised issue in the EU Referendum debate but! the true issue in this respect, is the control of immigration. I am not denying the positive effects what immigration brings, whether they immigration comes from the EU or non-EU, with the 300K figure you have highlighted. My two law lecturers in my first year both came from Africa and they were wonderful! However, it also cannot be denied of the negative effects of those who don't contribute, those who take advantage of the EU's open-border policy. Now! before it is argued that we have control of our borders and not signed up to Schengen (both true!), the fact we are a EU member, the European Court of Justice has ruled against the UK's decisions at Border Control, to allow non-EU immigrants to enter freely.

    On the issue of employment, the European Commission has admitted there would be high rates of unemployment once the TTIP deal is sealed, that will bring a 'prolonged and substantial' effect, despite the fact 2m Europeans petitioned against it. While the EU does bring jobs, European policies are questionable - even admitted by Brussells' Finance Chief that the European Central Bank's policies are making the 'little people' poorer and that this is the fault of EU leaders not promoting jobs and growth across Europe (http://www.express.co.uk/news/politi...-Merkel-Brexit) so! would it not be beneficial to withdraw from the EU, rejoin EFTA to have access to employment and have the right to refuse laws we don't agree with: confirmed by Full-Fact (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv22aRdLjKY)
    TTIP is still being negociated and once written then has to be formally agreed by governance on both sides of the pond. In fact I believe part of it was recently kicked into the long grass by the US! People talk about TTIP like it is a done deal and that it will be forced on us. Neither is true. Sure it is being negociated behind closed doors but once a text has been agreed prepare to see all sorts of changes or even if it gets agreed at all.
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    Most people would rather stay in something that is flawed and hope for change then push for change on their own terms.
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    The average person is unambitious and hates change, even if it's for their own benefit.

    Personally I'll vote out but I don't particularly care, I can leave any time.
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    (Original post by otester)
    The average person is unambitious and hates change, even if it's for their own benefit.

    Personally I'll vote out but I don't particularly care, I can leave any time.
    And not average people are ambitious and like rapid change, EU has made us from the ill EU country into the growing dominant power.
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    And not average people are ambitious and like rapid change, EU has made us from the ill EU country into the growing dominant power.
    How did they do that?
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    (Original post by otester)
    How did they do that?
    UK was a declining power in 20th Century, since joining EU we healed. We are now on course to become EU biggest and most powerful nation.
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    I've listened to a lot of debate about the EU and whenever people talk about how we can make our own deals to replace the EU's framework, it always seems to be "the EU provides this." "ah yes, but we can just negotiate/setup our own version". Considering the enormous number of things the EU does it seems like a massive waste of time to replace what you already have. Also we would get very unfavourable deals - most countries in Europe but not EU have to accept immigration to trade with EU countries so there would be little difference, just lots of extra bother and political tension. The EU is also a big negotiating power so we can get better deals across the world.

    I'm not a big fan of the EU but if I could vote I would vote remain because the EU does a lot of useful stuff and it's probably the best solution to trade.
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    UK was a declining power in 20th Century, since joining EU we healed. We are now on course to become EU biggest and most powerful nation.
    More thanks to Margaret Thatcher than the EU really, but the EU has definitely helped open up and lower the barrier to trade which plays a big part.
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    (Original post by william91919)
    More thanks to Margaret Thatcher than the EU really, but the EU has definitely helped open up and lower the barrier to trade which plays a big part.
    At first it was ok, then the leftists turned it into the EUSSR.
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    (Original post by otester)
    At first it was ok, then the leftists turned it into the EUSSR.
    1. Between TTIP, the lobbying at the European parliament, and the accepted wisdom of free-market economics, the EU is really not that left-wing.
    2. Using the word EUSSR makes you sound like a child.
 
 
 
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