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    (Original post by crana)
    it's good i'm +, though, in case i ever had babies with a - man. I think it's that way round anyway..

    rosie
    I believe the issue is if the mother is Rh- and the father is Rh+ AND the baby is Rh+.

    The mother's immune system starts to throw a tantrum about all the Rh+ antigens about in the baby's blood which generally comes into contact at the point of birth.

    Then, if a second child is born which is also Rh+, the mother's immune system decides to take the baby to war. This is rather unfair as the mother's heavy artillery will batter the poor wee baby!

    Injections are given to mothers (not sure what they do exactly, no doubt I'll have to learn :rolleyes: ) after a first baby which is supposed to keep the second and subsequent ones honky-dorey irrespective of blood group. If the baby turns out to be Rh- she'll need more with the next baby, otherwise she's bouncier than Zebedee on speed..
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    (Original post by crana)
    well of COURSE it won't, but to discuss things like this we have to use vastly simplified models......!
    Yeah but the more complicated the model becomes the less relevant the scenario becomes to analyse. With four genes it's possible; 27 it's unlikely, several million and it's quite simply never going to happen.
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    (Original post by polthegael)
    I believe the issue is if the mother is Rh- and the father is Rh+ AND the baby is Rh+.

    The mother's immune system starts to throw a tantrum about all the Rh+ antigens about in the baby's blood which generally comes into contact at the point of birth.

    Then, if a second child is born which is also Rh+, the mother's immune system decides to take the baby to war. This is rather unfair as the mother's heavy artillery will batter the poor wee baby!

    Injections are given to mothers (not sure what they do exactly, no doubt I'll have to learn :rolleyes: ) after a first baby which is supposed to keep the second and subsequent ones honky-dorey irrespective of blood group. If the baby turns out to be Rh- she'll need more with the next baby, otherwise she's bouncier than Zebedee on speed..
    Wow... never thought of that.

    How do they solve it? With immuno-supressants?
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    (Original post by polthegael)
    I notice some other people have tried to answer the other point...

    My understanding is that mass and energy are interchangeable but I don't have a problem with the statement.

    There are energy levels within nuclei which are roughly equivalent to energy levels electrons can possess. Also, within the nucleus of helium-4, say, the protons and neutrons are further down this potential energy well than they would be in, say, two deuterium atoms. This results in the overall mass of the matter being greater on the left hand side of an equation like:

    D + T ---> He + n

    The "lost energy" (equal to the binding energy of the reverse reaction) is given out in particles (neutrinos and anti-neutrinos, I think) and the speed of the neutron. These leptons (if it is these particles) have zero rest mass. Yes, they have energy and are buzzing around the universe at speeds getting up towards that of light. They therefore have some virtual mass. If a set of neutrino traffic lights turn red, however, our little friends run out of all their energy. Lower an atom to practically absolute zero and it will still have mass as it possesses mass independent to its speed (something to do with that Scarlet Pimpernel of particle physics, the Higgs Boson).

    I'm very interested in this sort of stuff and I was upset and annoyed at my mate Dave for going away to Spain after he finished his theoretical physics PhD at Southampton! We used to stay up till all hours getting utterly wasted and talking about stuff like that (I did more listening!)

    I can't claim to have much knowledge, just interest I await everyone saying I'm wrong!
    Does the Higgs Boson actually exist or is it just a convenient excuse?
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    (Original post by scarlet ibis)
    anyone want to discuss somethimg i can get my head round, like art?
    Nope... I could never get my head round arty stuff at all!

    KHL is right about the platelets/megakaryocytes.

    Not sure if anyone is think dodgy things about the percentage of shared genes with chimps and bananas... Obviously thats not the same thing as sharing alleles within a species :confused:

    I read your late night post Rosie, even if a day after you posted it

    Faboba - immuno-suppressants, I don't know... Would they give life-long immunity (I doubt it). I guess it's something like that though.. As for Higgs - I don't know but if it falls into place with the rest of the theories then chances are it does exist but at a mass which makes it beyond our capacity to create it in any modern-day particle accelerators.

    Don't ask me - I'm only a silly wee Irishman with a bottle of Bucky (my last one )
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    Not wanting to interrupt the scientific discussion going on here (i'm sure i won't!)

    I'll (hopefully) be going to New Hall to study Engineering in October.

    If anyone else is going/goes to New Hall or doing Engineering, PM me, I've got loads of questions that I won't bore everyone else with and we might be able to help each other out.
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    (Original post by Squishy)
    By the way...where's your sig from?
    Lol...a friend of mine said it by pure coincidence....before realising his grave mistake.

    I spy....with my little eye....a new member!!!

    Welcome to the thread Kath.......don't worry about interrupting the intense scientific debate....it only seems to have come on the last 3 or 4 pages....normally we're talking about random stuff If you have any questions....just post them here....i could use a break from debating rhesus factors :confused:

    I shall add you to the first post

    G
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    no, your interruptions are terrible forum etiquette. THOU ART BANISH-ED

    My only problem is i am not a forum moderator so can't tell anyone what to do, so I'm guess I'm stuck with you, bah. But Kath, nice name. I guess I only think that because the only Kath I know is a really nice person!
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    Welcome Kath! And please do interrupt! This science mumbojumbo is driving me insane
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    Yes! All interruptions welcome!
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    (Original post by gzftan)
    Lol...a friend of mine said it by pure coincidence....before realising his grave mistake.
    Ahhh...I take it you never let him live it down.
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    (Original post by gzftan)
    I shall add you to the first post

    G
    Thank you ... and Hello!

    Well ... I do have quite a few questions, so I'll give you the list and you can pick and choose/ignore which ones you want.

    1. Bikes ... Do we need a bike? It seems cliché, but I'm thinking it could be quite useful if I'm going to be living at the opposite end from the Engineering department and swimming pool (I'm a big swimmer). Does anyone know if we can get hold of 2nd hand ones down there?

    2. This is a bit specialised, but I'll ask anyway, actually I guess it really applies to most colleges and subjects really, so not really specialised:
    - What computer network connections are in college rooms (i.e. what leads do we need and stuff)?
    - How can you transfer stuff between your own computer and the network in college/department (I'm not sure if you need to take stuff to and from the department even - New Hall/Engineering this is) for printing etc.? Or can you print through the college network?

    I was going to go the whole hog and ask everything, but these are the two main questions for which the answers might, in general, be of more use to other people. And as for the rest, I won't bother you with those, I figure that New Hall will give me details of them if and when I get my results.

    Meanwhile ... I have a lot of maths and physics questions to do before I go on holiday. They set us holiday work. That is so unfair. :P

    Thanks
    Kath
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    (Original post by gzftan)
    I forgot this thread consist mainly of natscis....
    Yeah, and they're all bio natscis at that... :mad: Lets get some physicists on the go!
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    (Original post by Kath)
    Thank you ... and Hello!

    Well ... I do have quite a few questions, so I'll give you the list and you can pick and choose/ignore which ones you want.

    1. Bikes ... Do we need a bike? It seems cliché, but I'm thinking it could be quite useful if I'm going to be living at the opposite end from the Engineering department and swimming pool (I'm a big swimmer). Does anyone know if we can get hold of 2nd hand ones down there?

    2. This is a bit specialised, but I'll ask anyway, actually I guess it really applies to most colleges and subjects really, so not really specialised:
    - What computer network connections are in college rooms (i.e. what leads do we need and stuff)?
    - How can you transfer stuff between your own computer and the network in college/department (I'm not sure if you need to take stuff to and from the department even - New Hall/Engineering this is) for printing etc.? Or can you print through the college network?

    I was going to go the whole hog and ask everything, but these are the two main questions for which the answers might, in general, be of more use to other people. And as for the rest, I won't bother you with those, I figure that New Hall will give me details of them if and when I get my results.

    Meanwhile ... I have a lot of maths and physics questions to do before I go on holiday. They set us holiday work. That is so unfair. :P

    Thanks
    Kath
    Aha! Some questions I might actually be able to help with without buggering up

    1. Yeah, I reckon a bike is advisable if you're at New Hall as the Engineering Department is at the other end of Trumpington Street (down The Hill and along a way). You could do it without, but it'd take you about half an hour to walk it I reckon. Yep, you can get hold of second hand bikes although from what i hear they can get quite expensive; if you can get hold of an old crappy one at home and transport it somehow it'd probably be more economical (crappy best for avoiding being nicked).

    2. You should have a college (and uni) network connection in your room, for which you should need an ethernet card and cable (assuming it's the same across all the colleges, which I imagine it would be). If blissy comes back she'll be able to help you more here as she is at New Hall! All the departments are connected to the uni network too so you should be able to access info from your room; as for printing - you can certainly print from the college network, not sure as regards department transfer stuff (me = technophobe); I'd use a floppy disk or a CD, but I expect there are cleverer ways of transferring information :confused:

    Oh - and just as an aside, from what I hear the Engineering preliminary problems are nasty and none of my year's engineers could do them all. Not sure if you get set the same ones but hold onto that fact if they ARE horrible (they're apparently just to give you something to discuss in your first supo)

    (Original post by polthegael)
    I believe the issue is if the mother is Rh- and the father is Rh+ AND the baby is Rh+.
    yeah, sorry, I meant Rh + for the dad not Rh -. But i dont have to worry because im posssssssssssitive........ wahoo.......i can have everyones babies.

    or not

    rosie

    (Original post by polthegael)
    Faboba - immuno-suppressants, I don't know... Would they give life-long immunity (I doubt it).
    life long immunity? im not quite sure what you mean.

    they dont give people immunosuppressants, apparently:

    Women who are Rh- are routinely given an injection of a substance called Anti-D shortly after the baby is born (or after a miscarriage or termination). This destroys any Rh+ cells that may have got into the bloodstream so that they won't produce any more antibodies. In some areas, Anti-D is given to Rh- women during pregnancy, but this is not routinely done everywhere.

    (Original post by theoffender)
    Yeah, and they're all bio natscis at that... :mad: Lets get some physicists on the go!
    excuse me, we have some medics in on the act too y'know. and we were debating physics as well! centrifugal force and what have you.

    Incidentally, does the sun rotate like the earth? I don't think it does... but if not.. why doesnt it for the same reason as the earth does? do all the other planets spin, or at least the non-gas-ball ones?
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    if i remember correctly, it really isn't advisable for a Rh- mother to have a second Rh+ baby - you'd never know how serious an immune response you mount, no matter what you do to immunosuppress (although if you went the whole way and took out your immune system... :rolleyes: ) i once asked a doctor-relative about this, and iirc, they recommended abortion

    new hall:

    bikes? useful, but only if you are able to cycle up a steep hill - something many people take for granted, but others cannot do. (walking a bike up a hill just makes it more of a liability than anything else.)

    internet connection? get a computer with an ethernet card, (10/100 is advisable), and get a RJ45 cable - that's all you need. The RJ45 cable looks a bit like a normal telephone cable, except the ends are slightly larger, wider. An ethernet card basically is a computer card with a hole that accepts the thing at the end of the RJ45 cable...


    talking about fusion reactions - has anyone seen spiderman 2? i find the scientific basis behind the ending scene in that rundown church... disturbing. anyone tried "drowning" a fusion reaction in a river full of hydrogen atoms before?


    uhhh... crana, about the allele/gene thing, okay, let's put it this way. of the genes that can be different between siblings (i.e. 2 or more alleles in the combined genetic pool of parents), statistically siblings would share 50% of their alleles.

    (Original post by KHL)
    if i remember correctly, it really isn't advisable for a Rh- mother to have a second Rh+ baby - you'd never know how serious an immune response you mount, no matter what you do to immunosuppress (although if you went the whole way and took out your immune system... :rolleyes: ) i once asked a doctor-relative about this, and iirc, they recommended abortion

    uhhh... crana, about the allele/gene thing, okay, let's put it this way. of the genes that can be different between siblings (i.e. 2 or more alleles in the combined genetic pool of parents), statistically siblings would share 50% of their alleles.
    I don't think it's *that* bad, is it?

    From http://www.babycentre.co.uk/refcap/1480.html, "Thanks to new treatments, complications from being Rhesus-negative and carrying a Rhesus-positive baby pose little threat."

    They don't immunosuppress anything, as far as I'm aware. The treatment is an injection of anti-D, which is an antibody that (I think) is complementary to the D-antibodies (i.e. against the Rhesus D antigens) so it binds to the D-antibodies and prevents them from working. No immunosuppression is involved.

    And you do know how "serious an immune response you mount", because your antibody levels are monitored throughout pregnancy and monitored even more closely if you are -ve and have had a +ve baby. If your levels are getting too high, you can be treated with more anti-D if necessary.

    Yeah, I'm OK with what you are saying. That part is pretty obvious. It isn't really what we were discussing to start off with, though.

    I'm sticking with comparing the alleles shared between unrelated people and siblings. That (if it's right; no one seems to have objected yet, anyway) has rather more of a bearing on altruism than your summary, which although it seems to be right, is pretty limited.

    Rosie

    please, everyone, my name is rosie, "crana" is just what I log on with, ok?
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    (Original post by Squishy)
    Ahhh...I take it you never let him live it down.
    Lol..never...i take any chance i have to bring it up..and to this day he stil insists he said it's no big deal...but we all know better

    Kath- personally..i'm not gonna bother with a bicycle...i like walking..but that's just me. From what everyone else has said....it seems as though a bike might be a good idea for you.

    G
 
 
 

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