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Why do people want to control EU immigration when we don't control non-EU... Watch

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    I don't understand this. People are upset about overpopulation and think the solution is to limit EU immigration, which means leaving the EU.

    Why don't we just.......... limit non-EU immigration? ~25% of non-EU immigrants are university educated, while ~35% of EU immigrants are. EU immigrants are more likely to fill skilled jobs that we need filled.

    If people are that concerned about overpopulation, why don't they want to focus on limiting non-EU immigration? Why do these people think we'd control EU immigration when we're not even controlling immigration from outside the EU?
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    So your answer is to shut out the rest of the world?

    The fact is, if you live in an EU state, you can come to the UK and live here, no questions asked as long as you don't pose a threat to National security. Convicted peados, domestic abusers and carrot stealers welcome! Otherwise, if you are outside of the EU, you apply for a Visa.

    People who don't want uncontrolled immigration (otherwise known as free movement of people) cite the public services burden. Ask yourself, when you go to your GP's, is it filled with Canadians and South Africans? I dare say the answer is no. People are specific in citing those from the Eastern European blocks as what they perceive to be a drain on resources, and when the government is shown to be lying about the figures, their concerns are compounded.
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    Is the remain campaign losing their nerve?
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    (Original post by ODES_PDES)
    Is the remain campaign losing their nerve?
    (Original post by Michael3C)
    So your answer is to shut out the rest of the world?

    The fact is, if you live in an EU state, you can come to the UK and live here, no questions asked as long as you don't pose a threat to National security. Convicted peados, domestic abusers and carrot stealers welcome! Otherwise, if you are outside of the EU, you apply for a Visa.

    People who don't want uncontrolled immigration (otherwise known as free movement of people) cite the public services burden. Ask yourself, when you go to your GP's, is it filled with Canadians and South Africans? I dare say the answer is no. People are specific in citing those from the Eastern European blocks as what they perceive to be a drain on resources, and when the government is shown to be lying about the figures, their concerns are compounded.
    Oh, there's another lie.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...e-leave-claims

    It simply isn't true. People coming into the UK from the EU need to go through the same border controls as people coming from anywhere else. We CAN and DO refuse entry to convicted criminals. 6000 European Economic Area nationals have been refused entry to the UK in the last 5 years.

    As for shutting out the rest of the world - I never said that. You want to shut out unskilled workers from the EU - in the process, inevitably deterring many skilled workers from coming here - and yet we're already letting in a disproportionately large number of unskilled workers from outside the EU. If you actually cared about overcrowding and too much unskilled labour, you'd be calling for reduced non-EU immigration, because non-EU immigrants bring far, far, far less into the country than EU immigrants do. Can't you see why this is a ridiculous response?

    For your last point, about going to my GP - the only non-British native I've ever seen at my GP surgery (and I go 1-2 times a month), is my GP, who happens to be the best GP I've ever had.
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    1. That 6000 figure is widely thrown around, and widely disputed. But even if you took it at face value, it equates to 1 in 20,000

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politic...endum-36101449 outlines many more facts than a Guardian article, and as I said, it boils down to whether you pose a threat to national security. History has proved (sadly such as the Paris attacks) it is an easy system to beat even if you were inclined to threaten national security. But in terms of more localised "bad apples" entering, it's pretty much impossible to control and to think any other way is, in my opinion based on the facts, naive.

    2. You didn't say it, you inferred it.

    3. Your GP experience seems to be very different to anybodys I know, including myself, and probably anybody reading this if they leave in an urban area. Could you tell me what GP clinic this is so I can do some research of the town / city and see whether your claim is likely to hold up to scrutiny? No offense, it seems suspect unless you are living out in the sticks somewhere and if that is the case, you will hardly be effected by the problems of mass uncontrolled immigration which so many in the UK have grown tired of.
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    (Original post by Michael3C)
    1. That 6000 figure is widely thrown around, and widely disputed. But even if you took it at face value, it equates to 1 in 20,000
    Not entirely sure where you're pulling this number from, using ONS statistics for European immigration, you've got approximately 1,000,000 immigrants over the past five years which equates to a rate of 0.6% (not 0.005%), which is of a similar order of magnitude to the proportion of the population made up of convicted criminals, so it's really not that shocking at all. And if you're going to say that a figure is widely disputed, please actually provide some evidence for that.

    Regarding your point about GPs, your anecdotal experience is irrelevant. Even if you take into account the extra pressure on services imposed by immigration from European nationals, the economic effect is still positive.
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    But we aren't talking about economics - which again have two sides to an argument. We are talking about immigration. Let's stick to immigration. You have completely ignored the fact that having a criminal record is not in itself grounds for refusal of entry.
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    Except it is already difficult, strict and expensive for non eu migrants to come to the UK. To get a UK visa for even holidays is hard. Immigrants have to be earning £35,000 iirc to avoid deportation and international student pay upwards of £30,000 per year just to school there.
    Last time I visited the UK, it took nearly a month to get a 1 month visa because the uk border control agency is very meticulous.


    Non EU immigration is already perfectly controlled.
    Maybe you are worried about the refugee crisis? Illegal immigrants and refugees are different from legitimate non eu immigrants. Maybe focus you attention on them.

    I don't think you want to stop all the Americans, Australians, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, wealthy and educated Africans etc from coming to your country because that would lead to a collapse in your economy.
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    So you're saying stop all those horrible non-white people from coming over and "taking out jobs" in favour of bringing over white immigrants regardless of whether or not they're more skilled or qualified?

    I'm Taiwanese, I speak 3 languages, have managed a business and a have a Masters degree. Luckily I'm a British citizen, but if I wasn't it's ludicrous that I would have to jump through hoops to secure a British visa if I wanted to work here whereas a European with not even half the qualifications I have can just waltz through the borders on the sole basis of where he/she's from.

    The current immigration system is disgusting and discriminatory.

    It should be the best qualified gets a visa regardless of whether they are French, African or Asian.
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    (Original post by Michael3C)
    But we aren't talking about economics - which again have two sides to an argument. We are talking about immigration. Let's stick to immigration. You have completely ignored the fact that having a criminal record is not in itself grounds for refusal of entry.
    You can have a criminal record for speeding or for stealing a pack of mints when you were 17. Context is everything.
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    I need to sleep because Idk wtf you people are talking about. I know some scumbuckets who are EU. But whatever.
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    I don't understand this. People are upset about overpopulation and think the solution is to limit EU immigration, which means leaving the EU.

    Why don't we just.......... limit non-EU immigration? ~25% of non-EU immigrants are university educated, while ~35% of EU immigrants are. EU immigrants are more likely to fill skilled jobs that we need filled.

    If people are that concerned about overpopulation, why don't they want to focus on limiting non-EU immigration? Why do these people think we'd control EU immigration when we're not even controlling immigration from outside the EU?
    "The fact that the increase in the proportion of non-UK nationals working in Britain is almost entirely accounted for by an increase in EU migration is bound to fuel the already fevered referendum debate over the impact of Britain’s membership of the EU on immigration."

    Non-EU prospective immigrants are subject to the points based visa system, whilst EU immigrants can come here whenever they wish to and for however long doing a skilled or unskilled job under the free movement EU membership obligation.
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    Jordan, just stop making threads 😂
    You've been routed in pretty much every single one. This is getting to creationist American levels of denial in the face of reason.
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    (Original post by Dez)
    You can have a criminal record for speeding or for stealing a pack of mints when you were 17. Context is everything.
    What's the relevance here? How does it relate to my post at all?
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    (Original post by Michael3C)
    What's the relevance here? How does it relate to my post at all?
    You said that "having a criminal record is not in itself grounds for refusal of entry". I'm pointing out that this is a logical and reasonable thing, since not all criminal records necessarily mean a person should be barred from entry.
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    (Original post by Dez)
    You said that "having a criminal record is not in itself grounds for refusal of entry". I'm pointing out that this is a logical and reasonable thing, since not all criminal records necessarily mean a person should be barred from entry.
    Firstly, I didn't say that, it is a quote from the EU policy of free movement which we adhere to.

    Secondly, whilst I agree with the stance that stealing mints in one's youth shouldn't be grounds for denial: you are very unlikely to get a criminal record for such in the real world. And when we are unable to differentiate between being a a convicted peadophile and stealing a mint, there are big problems.
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    (Original post by Michael3C)
    Firstly, I didn't say that, it is a quote from the EU policy of free movement which we adhere to.

    Secondly, whilst I agree with the stance that stealing mints in one's youth shouldn't be grounds for denial: you are very unlikely to get a criminal record for such in the real world. And when we are unable to differentiate between being a a convicted peadophile and stealing a mint, there are big problems.
    So should we run a DBS check on every holidaymaker and exchange student to keep our borders safe?
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    You've changed the direction of debate completely. A holiday maker / exchange student is a different argument to uncontrolled immigration.
 
 
 
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