Is it harder to get the grades at Oxbridge?

Jools

You're referring a lot to adults who've been to uni. Back in the day it was a lot different. You didn't have a Prime Minister pressing targets to get more people into higher education than those qualified to do so, for a start.

My mum's in the middle of a degree now. And adults does not necessarily mean ancient.
My cousin (Edinburgh, Chemistry I think) always seemed to be working when I saw him. He'd come over to our house to go to the football, bring his laptop and work on his thesis over lunch. Still got a third though. But as I said he was always beavering away at something related to his degree. To be honest it scared me that I would be too lazy for HE

Oh and these 50% targets are a joke.

Reply 82

aliel

Then at least have similar course structures - essay/coursework/project/module based, at the same level. And just as you have at A-Level, (try to) ensure that the "coursework option" is at the same level with the "essay option".

Reply 83

Coursework...hmph! Sitting some Highers would knock that kinda notion out of you.

Reply 84

Acaila

Well he was in his last year then? Well that is when it all sinks in, perhaps the end of the second year. If you were to ask him how much work he did in his first year (even perhaps his second year), then you may get a different response. I know of students at good universities who leave their assignments to the last minute, and yes, then they have a lot of work to do and have to work very hard...but the amount of work *set* to consistently complete is below that which i think it is.

Reply 85

Acaila

Coursework...hmph! Sitting some Highers would knock that kinda notion out of you.

I have done alot of coursework in my time, but when I manage my time properly, coursework is a more desirable option. If it weren't then the weighting of degrees at top universities would not be the way that they are.

Reply 86

He was either in second or third year of a four year degree. And he's not the sort to be lazy to be honest although I understand what you're saying.

Will continue this later, but my dinner's ready.
A bientot!

Reply 87

aliel

Coursework was great at GCSE as I had nothing else to do, now it's a hassle. 44% of my degree's coursework but I've got no time to do it. Dissertation (22%) is this summer but got internship for 12 weeks, but these are kinda essential for a blue chip career upon graduation these days.

Reply 88

Jools

Not going to happen. Now just because most would agree that a traditional approach to examinations/degrees requires more intellectual effort, it does not mean that the purpose of degrees is simply that- many universities argue (quite rightly) that studying for a degree in modular/ coursework options develops other (considered important by employers) skills- organisation, time management, research skills and so on. Not all graduates are going to be employed by a big city firm which desires a traditional approach, instead rather many graduates will find that skills gained by completing continual assessment may be more valuable for their career.

Reply 89

Jools

Most of my degree is going to be assessed by 3hr examination- swop! :biggrin:

Reply 90

aliel

I know they're like chalk and cheese, I just meant some way of making their value the same even though they're testing very different skills. Ah I give up, time for the pub.

Reply 91

Jools

I know they're like chalk and cheese, I just meant some way of making their value the same even though they're testing very different skills. Ah I give up, time for the pub.

It's a nice idea, but the fact is, you will have "Oxon" after your name and whatever your degree class employers will attach added value to it. This is the same with students at other top universities. If the situation was different, in that employers were clueless of the difference...then standardisation would have more of a case.

Reply 92

aliel

I don't know why I care about this since it's not going to affect me!

But a lot of employers are clueless. Outside the graduate recruitment firms come a lot that think "a degree is a degree". Thus they may not know the difference between Sheffield and Sheffield Hallam, Nottingham and Nottingham Trent, (Oxford and Oxford Brookes in America!), and think that they're all as good as each other outside Oxbridge. And a bit lower down the rankings they may have no idea that one course was a lot more demanding than another.

Reply 93

shiny

Jools

But a lot of employers are clueless.

Or not bothered.

Reply 94

Jools

Not to mention that most job advertisments these days simply state a 2.1 requirement...I understand completely, am just playing devils advocate- if you were arguing against standardisation, i would argue for such a measure...sorry Jools :redface:

Reply 95

shiny

Or not bothered.

Or not intellectual snobs.

Reply 96

Acaila

Or not intellectual snobs.

Or (as Jools mentioned) can't tell the difference

Reply 97

Acaila

Or not intellectual snobs.

Well I'm arguing for change that would make intellectual snobbery non-existent.

Reply 98

aliel

Or (as Jools mentioned) can't tell the difference

The "2.1 required" advertisements you mentioned is a good example of what I'm talking about. How's someone with a high 2.2 from a good uni going to feel knowing that someone not as good as them have accessibility to a job that they don't?

Reply 99