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    To all gamers of :tsr2: :
    Mac / Abandonware is defined as a game that is altleast five years old and is no longer sold. Yet abadonware is illegal to host on your website. But, still, many sites like <snip> host entire abandonware sections where you can download full version games like Damage Inc, Shadow Warrior, Doom 1 and 2, Wolfenstein 3D and more. So should abandonware be illegal? In my opinion no. Since no one sells the games, no one is hurt when they are downloaded from the net. In fact, people benefite from abandonware, because they can play classics they they would never get to play, and the younger generation gets to play games they never knew existed. Keeping the old games alive, abandonware is right.
    Should abandonware be illegal to host on your website / full versions freely available for download?

    Look forward to your opinions
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    Yes, I think it should remain illegal. Just because no apparent harm comes of something, does not mean that it should be legal.
    Abandonware sites also have a nasty habit of hosting games that are still being sold. And how can you rigidly define whether a game is still on sale or not? Many titles that most people think are not being sold at retail still are.
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    what estel said. companies like sold out sell games that are over 5 years old. The only way to prove a title was not being sold anywhere would be to go everywhere and check. there's no chance that'll ever happen, so you have to assume the software is still being sold.
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    Of course it should be illegal. That would be like saying if you keep something in your garage for 5 years without using it then it's perfectly legal for someone to come and steal it. Regardless of whether or not they are currently selling it they own the copyright. They might want to re release it in the future.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    Of course it should be illegal. That would be like saying if you keep something in your garage for 5 years without using it then it's perfectly legal for someone to come and steal it. Regardless of whether or not they are currently selling it they own the copyright. They might want to re release it in the future.
    Lol. Despite the fact that programs can be downloaded from websites more than once.
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    Sometimes "abandonware" can help a company. For example I believe you can legally download GTA1 and 2 for free. If people do this it might get them interested in the series and want to buy the latest ones. Of course in a well established series like GTA the effect can't be that great, but in a less established series it might bring in new fans.

    As for the question at hand, I believe it should be up to the developer if they want to release their game for free on the internet. Third party sites could still host them, as long as the developer has deemed the game freely available. It shouldn't be up to a third party site to decide if/when/what can be distributed for free.
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    (Original post by Sephiroth)
    Sometimes "abandonware" can help a company. For example I believe you can legally download GTA1 and 2 for free. If people do this it might get them interested in the series and want to buy the latest ones. Of course in a well established series like GTA the effect can't be that great, but in a less established series it might bring in new fans.

    As for the question at hand, I believe it should be up to the developer if they want to release their game for free on the internet. Third party sites could still host them, as long as the developer has deemed the game freely available. It shouldn't be up to a third party site to decide if/when/what can be distributed for free.
    The difference is that GTA was made abandonware by its owners.

    I think there needs to be some adjustment to the law on games, but 5 years is far too short a period for something to be considered abandonware, and commercially unviable (and still even then, there are 'retro compilations' and the like available). But you can't go against law just because you feel like it.
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    (Original post by Airel)
    Lol. Despite the fact that programs can be downloaded from websites more than once.
    I don't think you got my point exactly. You are still depriving the copyright owner of the ability to make money from their work. In a sense they can't use their game because they can't make more money from it. Yes they can still play the game, but that's not the way I meant it.

    (Original post by Eru Iluvatar)
    The difference is that GTA was made abandonware by its owners.
    I wouldn't say they made it abandonware. They decided to release it for free but they still have the rights to it.
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    No I think it should be legal - if there was any money left to be made from it, the companies would still be selling it. Hence it might as well be given away.
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    (Original post by Cage)
    No I think it should be legal - if there was any money left to be made from it, the companies would still be selling it. Hence it might as well be given away.
    I kinda agree with you Cage, the name 'abandonware' kinda gives it away that it is 'abandoned' by companies because it's simply getting too old / out of date with the new systems to be sold at a price that they will earn profits from. There are some sites out there that are just distributing them to users if they want a reminder of retro gaming. (I don't think I'm allowed to name any sites here, not quite sure about the rules for that.)
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    (Original post by Cage)
    No I think it should be legal - if there was any money left to be made from it, the companies would still be selling it. Hence it might as well be given away.
    It's amazing how much money can be made from old games. You can still buy those things that just plug into the TV and have a bunch of old arcade games on them, there's the possibility of offering those games on digitial TV services, etc. Just because they are not currently making money from it, doesn't mean they won't be able to in the future. For example interest in old games will go up when a sequel is coming up. That's an opportunity to make a bit of money on the old games. ID re-released Doom 1 and 2 just before Doom 3 came out.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    It's amazing how much money can be made from old games. You can still buy those things that just plug into the TV and have a bunch of old arcade games on them, there's the possibility of offering those games on digitial TV services, etc. Just because they are not currently making money from it, doesn't mean they won't be able to in the future. For example interest in old games will go up when a sequel is coming up. That's an opportunity to make a bit of money on the old games. ID re-released Doom 1 and 2 just before Doom 3 came out.
    Well they'll still be able to. Let's face it, the people looking at abandonware sites are mostly not the sort of people who would buy it legally anyway.
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    I'm not sure where that initital definition is from, but 5 years does seem kind of arbitrary, considering that copyright on other works expires after 70 years, if I recall correctly.

    (Original post by Psyk)
    I wouldn't say they made it abandonware. They decided to release it for free but they still have the rights to it.
    I agree, it's not abandonware, but what about Doom and Quake? The source code for those has been released allowing people tomake thinkgs like Quake II AbSIRD? They're not really abandoware either, but it was a nice move from iD.

    So, abandonware should be legal, but only when the software's copyright expires.:p: Otherwise, it's the developer/copyright owner's choice. It would be nice if they did so soon, especially if the company goes bankrupt, but they shouldn't be obliged to.

    Maybe some provision should be made for the fact that computers very quickly become incompatible with old software, but then again it's likely that legal emulators will become possible when the copyright expires on the game, anyway. The first video game to enter the public domain should do so some time around 2020.
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    (Original post by Username Not Supplied)
    I agree, it's not abandonware, but what about Doom and Quake? The source code for those has been released allowing people tomake thinkgs like Quake II AbSIRD? They're not really abandoware either, but it was a nice move from iD.
    The source code has been open sourced, but the game content hasn't. You still legally have to buy the game if you want to play the whole thing.
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    (Original post by Cage)
    Well they'll still be able to. Let's face it, the people looking at abandonware sites are mostly not the sort of people who would buy it legally anyway.
    Exactly. It's fine if you only idly want to play a game, and otherwise wouldn't be buying it. In this case, NO ONE is losing out. This is why I have no moral problem with downloading even newer games / movies - because I couldn't afford them anyway. It's not like I'd go out and buy them if I didn't download them - I'd do without. So the company who made whatever it is loses nothing, and I gain. Good all round :p:.
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    Problem with that logic Toy is that if it were okay to download newer games, more people would do it, and there would be even more pirated copies floating about in car boot sales and stuff. So the guy who might have paid for it even though it wasn't a must have game would be more inclined to get the pirate version. So yeah, they do lose out somewhat with illegal downloads, but not on the scale the music/movie industry suggest. They like to assume every dwnloader would have bought it, when that isn't the case. I'm sure so,e wouldhave however.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    The source code has been open sourced, but the game content hasn't. You still legally have to buy the game if you want to play the whole thing.
    Unless you use a third party engine like AprQ2, Quake2maX, EGL or Quake II Evolved.
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    (Original post by Username Not Supplied)
    Unless you use a third party engine like AprQ2, Quake2maX, EGL or Quake II Evolved.
    Not legally you can't. The game engine is open source so people have developed new versions of it, but you'll still need the original game files to play them.
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    Are you talking about textures, sound files, etc?
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    the game's content, yes.
 
 
 
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