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Anyone need advice about Architecture at Manchester?

Hello

I just finished my second year at MSA (Manchester school of Architecture) and I know I found this website really useful two/three years ago so just thought I would offer to answer any questions anyone has. Ask me anything you like about architecture, University of Manchester or both. I'm 21, took a gap year to travel and did A levels in Maths, Physics and Geography if that helps to know.

I also have experience applying to UCL, Nottingham, Sheffield, Newcastle, Edinburgh and Liverpool (I know that makes 7 uni's but I applied before my gap year, rejected all my offers and then applied during my gap year, swapping Newcastle for Manchester).

Hope I can help,
Jodie

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Reply 1

1/4

Just wondering how you application went to UCL as they insist on having a level art and it doesnt look like you studied it, they told me that i needed it but i chose DT graphics.

Whats the school like at manchester...I need a 5th choice (as we will only be allowed 5 choices in 2008) and dont know between sheffield or manchester...

Thanks.
Adam

Reply 2

Jeck

There was no requirement for A level art when I applied to UCL, but I did do GCSE and AS level art anyway so that must have been enough because I got an offer.

The school at Manchester is great. I think it's a really good mix between "art" and "science" unlike other schools. Picking the course that sounds best for you is way way more important than what the uni is like as a whole when you are picking an architecture course because they really do differ quite a bit.
I really did like Sheffield uni, it was probably my favourite uni right up until I visited the architecture department, from then on didn't want to study architecture there.

I picked Manchester, like I said, because of the course. It was right for me as i'm really not that "arty" of a person (hence not going to UCL). The course really is balanced. You have studio twice a week (6 hours total) to work on your current project (3 complete design projects in first year and 2 in second year) and then lectures for one whole day. A studio lecture (to explain the next part of the project), a humanities lecture and a technology lecture.

Humanities ia a huge range if things and is tested with exams and essays (not many) - my geography A level is relevant and so have other peoples psychology, sociology and many other A levels been.

Technology is all about structures and materials and is tested with exams and case study workbooks (as well as using what you learn in your studio design projects). I find technology easy because of my maths and physics A levels but it's not that difficult as long as you were ok at maths and physics for your GCSE's.

So, overall the course is very balanced and well rounded. An architect who can design a well structured and eco-friendly building as well as understanding their effect on people will always be a better architect than someone who can only design something that "looks good" or needs a whole term of other people to sort out whether your concept will actually work as a building in the real world.

I'm sure other schools travel too, but at Manchester one project a year is based at a site in another country so the project starts with a 5-7 day trip to visit the city and study the site and architecture there (loads of free time too). First year was Amsterdam and second year was Barcelona (last year the first year went to Amsterdam too, so i'm guessing it is following through). These are loads of fun if you like to travel like I do.

Hope this helps, let me know if you have any more specific questions about anything.

Reply 3

1/4

Yeah im not too arty so was thinking of not bothering with UCL...

I really like nottingham so that will probs be my first choice...

Did you have many interviews??? If so what were the general questions, i really need to do some 'homework' whilst i have time over the summer hols...I thought i would try and find a reading list, and found one on cambridge which included 4 must reads...I took them out the library and they are awful...Like 600+ pages each, B&W and little pictures. I much sooner read/look at pictures in a book, way more inspirational for me...What did you do??

Also what did you put in your portfolio...Most of my work is CAD / Graphics...

Thanks For Answering Q's...

Adam.

Reply 4

Jeck

The only place I had an interview was Manchester. I had a really informal "chat" with my interviewer, mostly concentrated on going through the work I had bought with me, talking about it and then questions thrown in at random. The usual "what buildings do you like?/what's your favourite building?" or "who's work do you like?/who's your favourite architect?", so at least be prepared for those.

Tip: don't say a really famous or popular building, use one either known by architects but not necessarily by the "general" public or it could even be a building near where you live or somewhere you've travelled that they will have never seen or heard of (take some photos, taken by you) as it will show an interest in architecture, like your aware of it all around you even when your just driving around, walking in the town centre or something, rather than you just picked a well known building out of a book. Also, whatever you do, don't say Foster's your favourite architect!

All interviews are very different though, even within each school. My friends on my course have described very different experiences at their Manchester interview, more formal ones, with multiple interviewers, staff having older students with them asking questions to really informal chats with no direct questions at all, just more of a "getting to know you" session.

All I did to prepare was to read over my personal statement to remember what I had put (although it was never used or mentioned in my interview in the end) and looked over the work I was taking to try and think through what I could say about each piece if asked. It's worth thinking about what kind of questions you may be asked even if your not asked them, so as well as the above questions, think about why you want to study architecture, what you want to do (not every one wants to become an architect or even study past the first 3 year degree, for them it's just a "stepping stone"), what parts of the course you think you'll enjoy/be good at? Just try to convey as much enthusiasm for the subject as possible, architecture should already be at least a hobby, you should now want it to become a huge part of your life, not just a degree you want to do. Don't over do it though and don't practice answers, just have a rough idea what you want to get across and then talk about it in a normal way like you would in any conversation.

As for stuff to take, I just took a wide range of work I had done from my AS level Art and GCSE Art and Graphics. They did send a list of suggested work with the interview request which was helpful. Take work in different media, like different paints, pastels, pencils. Still life sketches, of buildings if possible, but anything that shows you can draw accurately will be fine, some abstract/semi-abstract work, 3D work particularly models (take photos if large), if you are good at photography take some photos of buildings (or parts of), take some written work (an essay from school will do - I took my A level geography coursework). I didn't have any CAD or photoshop work, but i'm sure they would be interested in it, just check the list they (should) send you.

When it comes to books I only buy the ones I like (so no boring ones with black and white pictures and too much writing!). When I accepted my place, I got sent (along with all the usual registration stuff) a reading list and equipment list. Out of the 25 books on the list I already owned 10 of them. I've been collecting architecture books for years and was glad that what I was interested in and enjoyed reading was actually relevant to the course. I looked up the rest of the books and found a few more quite interesting so I got those too, the rest I still haven't bothered with or I just got them out from the library for the couple of weeks they were actually needed for. Books I recommend because I have actually used them directly for doing work either by being told in a lecture to read it for the next project or finding it useful myself include:

Architect's Pocket Book by Charlotte Baden-Powell
Architecture: Form, Space and Order by Francis D.K. Ching
Architectural Graphics by Francis D.K. Ching
Building Construction Illustrated by Francis D.K. Ching and Cassandra Adams
A Visual Dictionary of Architecture by Francis D.K Ching
XS: Big Ideas, Small Buildings by Phyllis Richardson
Materials for Architectural Design by Victoria Ballard Bell (Author), Patrick Rand (Author)
Materials, Structures and Standards: All Details Architects Need to Know But Can Never Find by Julia McMorrough (Author)
The Story of Architecture by Norman Foster and Jonathan Glancey(Eyewitness Companion Guides)
Architects Today by Kester Rattenbury (Author),
Green Architecture: The Art of Architecture in the Age of Ecology (Architecture & Design) by James Wines (Author)
Analysing Architecture by Simon Unwin (Author)
40 Architects Around 40 (Klotz) by Jessica Cargill Thompson

(sorry that's about as many as I can remember right now, there's probably more)

Most of these are worth buying. Not all at once but as you go along, buying them as and when you need them. Most in first year, some in second year. The whole lot brand new would cost about £150 but i'm sure you can find them second hand. You will be referencing books all the time so always getting them from a library is not an option, especially if a book is mentioned as needing reading for the next project, 200 students cannot all read a book in the library if there are only 5 copies of it. If you have a general interest in architecture then you will probably find all of the above books interesting anyway. I owned 7 of them before I even applied to go to uni. The ones I bought later were the construction and materials books. There are loads of books to choose from on these topics (these are just the ones I like) and you will probably need at least one in order to complete your work. Any books with lots of pictures of buildings or elements of building that you like are useful because every project needs precedent ideas. However, these can be found in architecture journals as well, which the university library stocks every copy of, so with some books it's just a matter of convenience whether you want them permanently or not.

Sorry, i've gone on a bit (make that A LOT)! Hope I haven't overwhelmed you! Let me know any more questions.

Reply 5

Absinthe

Hey. I've just finished my first year at the MSA, and I have to ask first of all: is the second year as jam-packed and stressful as I've heard it's going to be? I have to prepare myself!

Secondly, I was wondering if you'd drafted a CV yet to apply for work experience and the likes? One of my friends, a jammy individual in the same year as me, managed to land herself a nicely paid position at a Liverpool firm for the summer. She's given me a few pointers as to what to put in a CV for work experience, such as to make it look rather graphical and to include some small samples of your work. I dunno if they start to help you with this kind of thing in the second year, thus I thought I'd ask.

Also, I notice that Manc seem to have dropped their interview policy. We were asked to send in 3 drawings as a response to some prompts, from what I can remember. :confused:

But then, that was only introduced in 2006.

Reply 6

Jeck

yeah, second year is really really packed.

The holidays are shorter (3 weeks each) and you will have loads of work to do during them, portfolio, technology, humanities as well as more exams.
Think I had about one week of holiday work free in the Dec/Jan holiday and about 4-5 days of holiday work free during the April holiday. I had less than 2 weeks combined days "doing nothing" from middle of Feb to 3rd week of May (about 14 weeks) when we had our final hand in. I did loads of all-nighters (all year), sometimes 2 or 3 in a week (only during May). If you follow what we did, like you did in first year, then you will do two projects. The first one will be in Barcelona, so you'll go in October. The second project, Jan to March was much more "free", no being told what to do week by week, apart from a set amount of work the first two weeks (with a crit) we only had one interim crit (with a few minimum requirements) and then a final crit (with final design requirements), basically you could do whatever work you wanted as your design process (applying the techniques you learn during first year and the first semester of second year).

Also, the final crits for both projects and possibly the interim crits you will probably have "outside" (from a practice) architects watching as well as your tutor. They are worth impressing if they work for a company you would like to do work experience with. They will come from all over the country as well as Manchester. For example, the architect at my final crit was from Urban Splash which was quite interesting as the project we were working on is a part of a larger "real life" scheme currently being planned and constructed by Urban Splash in Manchester.

Sorry, there is no mention of work experience or CV during second year. Try looking on the intranet, under the third year downloads though. I think I remember looking a few months ago and it had a bit about CV building in the spring term (not that sure though). Look under second year on the intranet too, it'll have the projects we did that you might get to do.

Hope i've helped a little at least. Feel free to ask me anything else.

Reply 7

1/4

Can I just say a huge thanks for all the advice that you have given me, will really be useful in the future weeks...

Many Thanks
Adam

Reply 8

Absinthe

Sorry for the late reply. Everything you've said is really useful: this is a great thread! Thanks :smile:

Reply 9

zfei

Which is better? Newcastle or Manchester?

Reply 10

Jeck

Hey guys
So turns out Manchester is not so great after all, in fact it's terrible and I would not recommend anyone to go there. I left after my second year and I'm actually starting at Sheffield in September instead. My offer still stands though if anyone has any general questions about any of the stuff I mentioned before.

Reply 11

chocotofu

wow that was a huge change in attitude!! Is it ok to ask you what made you change your opinion?! I went to visit the department and really liked it over the environment UCL had. In the end it was a battle between Nottingham and Manchester. My point being, what turned out so wrong that made you to change to another uni after completely TWO years!?

Reply 12

Jeck

It was loads of stuff, that I probably shouldn't go in to on a public board, but it involved many problems they had with organisation, marking, tutors, not following RIBA regulations etc. It's a very long story really, that spans months and months, and affected a lot of people. I wasn't the only one that left and more are leaving after 3rd year and not continuing with part 2 there.

Reply 13

drawmeamonkey

I think any problems there have been at MSA will have happened at most if not all schools. The RIBA visit this year gave unconditional accreditation.

Not exactly sure what Jeck is referring to. I've just finished the BA there. Come along to the degree show if you want to see what MSA is about:

http://www.artdes.mmu.ac.uk/degreeshow/

Reply 14

drawmeamonkey

also have a look at the year books

http://www.msa.ac.uk/publications/

look out for my page :smile:

Reply 15

Jeck

There were/are problems (like I said, I won't discuss them on a public board) that you may not be aware of or are only slightly aware of, as only about 1/3 of the students in the year were affected by the majority of them, so you were probably one of the lucky ones who weren't affected.

Plenty of students do complete great work, as shown by those who are included in the books (yourself included). What was your hybrid programme by the way? Your design reminds me of the residential buildings proposed for the New Islington site we used in 2nd year.

The only reason I updated this thread on my personal situation was because I had included a lot of very positive information about the school previously and I did not want to be responsible in any way (even though it might be very small) for providing encouragement to anyone deciding which school to attend, in case they did find themselves affected by any of the problems later on and regretted their decision.

Of course there is every chance they would not be affected at all and would finish their degree with a positive opinion of the school, like you have.

I personally (just speaking for myself) would not want to take the risk, which is why I said I would not recommended it.

Reply 16

drawmeamonkey

If there are major problems affecting 1/3 of the students, I'm pretty sure I'd have heard about it, could you PM to give me some idea of what it's about?
I don't really see why such major problems with so many students can't be posted on the board.

You are making it look like you've got some major personal issue with the school that you're not willing to talk about properly.

I've not got a glowing opinion of the school, but I've not got a naive view that other schools are perfect either.

Good luck at sheffield though.

(hybrid was modular residential/public space/forum/market)

Reply 17

yeahyeahyeahs

drawmeamonkey

also have a look at the year books

http://www.msa.ac.uk/publications/

look out for my page :smile:

what page is yours?

in the 2008 one, the 2nd year section is abit flat and abit generic...

Reply 18

drawmeamonkey

I'm the only james in year 3 :smile:

Not really looked at the other years yet....

Reply 19

ArchiBoi

drawmeamonkey

I'm the only james in year 3 :smile:

Not really looked at the other years yet....

Every school has bitter students its inevitable.

I've been around, I've seen them - they blame some one else for their failures - it merely becomes a case of sourgrapes.
The fact of the matter is, if you're not getting tutor input - Get off your fat arse and do something about it.

Reality check here - a school of architecture is big organisations and in big organisations mistakes/blunders occur.

There isn't any school in the UK at the moment that is teaching architecture that excites me.

I've spoken to a lot of students at a lot of differenet schools, and its safe to say that these 'problems' are the same no matter where you study.