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MrChill
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#7981
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#7981
A more lethal or slightly faster striker playing in place of LaBaguette, would have scored more than once against Fulham imo. But he is the least of our problems.

Anyone noticed the ref bent over backwards to give them everything, while Auba, Bellerin got yellows for their first tackles. Also, how Fulham's Hector didn't get a second yellow after making 3-4 yellow card offences is ridiculous (For one of them he stamped on Xhaka's foot)

We just need consistency and belief and anything is possible. If a relegation fighting Leicester can win title the following season, why can't we at least challenge for the title after getting 8th last season.
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bj27
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#7982
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#7982
you're not challenging for the title. times have changed, how will you be consistent enough to get 90+ points that is needed?
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Zürich
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#7983
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#7983
We will get top 4 I think.

Arteta the modern manager and ticking every box and one of either the PE teacher (Ole) or the plumber/mechanic/plasterer (Lampard) will find themselves behind. Jose now a parody of himself and it's Spurs.

Maitlan Niles also looking like he'll stay and Im very happy about that, great player and seems a great guy too. £20m for Martinez also super business when you consider he's had 10 stand out games at Arsenal at age 28 and years on loan over the years. Need to sell Chambers/Papa/Guendouzi/ El Neny/ now to raise some funds for a new goalscoring midfielder. Maybe a DM if we lose Torreria.
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bj27
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#7984
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#7984
there's positivity but you're a season behind.

Although attacking wise you're as good as anybody, if Gabriel sorts you guys defensively then maybe you could challenge, I just don't see it yet though. Too much squad players/role players instead of absolute quality on the pitch. Depth is also bad imo everywhere outside of the attack.

Chelsea got too much quality, same for United, heck if either one of us don't get top four the manager should be sacked.

Spurs were never relevant imo, they ****ed it the second they sacked pochettino and didn't back him in the market at all. Chelsea got Havertz and Thiago Silva and they buy Doherty and Hojberg lmao.

Take a good look at Everton today, they will be your challengers
Last edited by bj27; 1 month ago
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MrChill
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#7985
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(Original post by bj27)
you're not challenging for the title. times have changed, how will you be consistent enough to get 90+ points that is needed?
I know you must think I am a nutter for saying this. 😄

But how do you know we aren't? We have beaten City, Chelsea, Liverpool back end of last season and strengthened our defence and attack while keeping the best goalscorer in EPL of the last 2 seasons.

Leicester came from nowhere and won. I am not saying we will win it but our defense looks rock solid now and with Auba, Willian, Pepe, Saka, Ceballos going the other way, anything is possible.

Football results and league tables aren't always linear. Here is a die hard gooner believing we can do the unthinkable and ONLY challenge.

COYG. 🙂

ps: Also this keeps the thread alive lol
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MrChill
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#7986
(Original post by bj27)
there's positivity but you're a season behind.

Although attacking wise you're as good as anybody, if Gabriel sorts you guys defensively then maybe you could challenge, I just don't see it yet though. Too much squad players/role players instead of absolute quality on the pitch. Depth is also bad imo everywhere outside of the attack.

Chelsea got too much quality, same for United, heck if either one of us don't get top four the manager should be sacked.

Spurs were never relevant imo, they ****ed it the second they sacked pochettino and didn't back him in the market at all. Chelsea got Havertz and Thiago Silva and they buy Doherty and Hojberg lmao.

Take a good look at Everton today, they will be your challengers
But football isn't linear and how do you know we are a season behind? Take Leicester's title challenge for example.

I think it's arrogant to say Chelsea will be challengers when they still have Kepa in goal and conceded more goals than the worst Arsenal defence in decades. You think a 35 year old , slow has been from a farmers league will save Chelsea? Silva next to Christiansson(?) is a disaster waiting to happen.

United gets a lot of penalties-the highest of the lot in the last 2 seasons? Will this continue? As long as Mike Riley is in charge I guess it will.

Since Artetas arrival, like Simeone, he made us rock solid at the back while trying to tweak our attack with limited budget and coaching. A solid defence with goalie like Leno will get you far, not extravagant attackers when your defence needs new players and a goalie(Chelsea).

Title challenge is built on defence. Yes, we will lose a few matches, like Chelsea and United will, as the league is very competitive. But Arteta is on another level to Ole or Lampard tactically and he will be the difference in getting us there imo.
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samir12
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#7987
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#7987
(Original post by MrChill)
I know you must think I am a nutter for saying this. 😄

But how do you know we aren't? We have beaten City, Chelsea, Liverpool back end of last season and strengthened our defence and attack while keeping the best goalscorer in EPL of the last 2 seasons.

Leicester came from nowhere and won. I am not saying we will win it but our defense looks rock solid now and with Auba, Willian, Pepe, Saka, Ceballos going the other way, anything is possible.

Football results and league tables aren't always linear. Here is a die hard gooner believing we can do the unthinkable and ONLY challenge.

COYG. 🙂

ps: Also this keeps the thread alive lol
Two of those games were in the FA cups so irrelevant and you lost to Brighton and Villa which are the games you need to be winning to challenge for the league. Leicesters PL win was a freak one as it was perfect circumstance for them to win with the top 6 sides being poor or in transition, they finished with 81 points where as you need 90+ points to win the league nowadays (based on last couple of seasons, you need atleast 99 points!). Arteta needs another top goalscorer alongside Aubameyang to challenge for the league, you are still too reliant on him solely where as the likes of Man City, Liverpool, United and Chelsea have multiple goal scorers. Europa League will make it difficult to challenge for the league as well given the tight schedule.
Last edited by samir12; 1 month ago
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MrChill
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#7988
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#7988
(Original post by samir12)
Two of those games were in the FA cups so irrelevant and you lost to Brighton and Villa which are the games you need to be winning to challenge for the league. Leicesters PL win was a freak one as it was perfect circumstance for them to win with the top 6 sides being poor or in transition, they finished with 81 points where as you need 90+ points to win the league nowadays.
But we played a full strength City and Chelsea team. You think because it was ONLY the FA cup semi or final, Chelsea and City players gave up?

Yes, we were rubbish last season. We got a better centreback in Gabriel and first choice goalie is back- defo will help against the Brightons. As for Villa, we couldn't break them down- so we upgraded our right wing and got a beast in Willian, even though Pepe is looking better.

A stable, defence can get you those points and I think we have every chance to be up there in the mix if people think Chelsea with their defence can get into the 90+ points! 😄

Anyways have goodun peeps. Laterz. 😁
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bj27
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(Original post by MrChill)
But football isn't linear and how do you know we are a season behind? Take Leicester's title challenge for example.

I think it's arrogant to say Chelsea will be challengers when they still have Kepa in goal and conceded more goals than the worst Arsenal defence in decades. You think a 35 year old , slow has been from a farmers league will save Chelsea? Silva next to Christiansson(?) is a disaster waiting to happen.

United gets a lot of penalties-the highest of the lot in the last 2 seasons? Will this continue? As long as Mike Riley is in charge I guess it will.

Since Artetas arrival, like Simeone, he made us rock solid at the back while trying to tweak our attack with limited budget and coaching. A solid defence with goalie like Leno will get you far, not extravagant attackers when your defence needs new players and a goalie(Chelsea).

Title challenge is built on defence. Yes, we will lose a few matches, like Chelsea and United will, as the league is very competitive. But Arteta is on another level to Ole or Lampard tactically and he will be the difference in getting us there imo.
I'll quote you when you come 5th/6th this season.

Silva isn't slow anyway. Kepa bad but people in front of him worse, no leader at CB and our left backs were non existent defensively. Issue also was that we didn't have top players in attack who could create out of nothing(Pulisic was injured for long periods and Willian who averaged <5 non penalty league goals a season at Chelsea is trash too). We've solved that, we have a solid CB and we've got an LB.

I think we can make anywhere from 1st - 4th and well you won the FA cup in 2017 with a great defensive performance against Chelsea too, where we both happened to play 3-4-3 that same game too, what happened the next year? Or have you conveniently forgotten that. Winning the FA cup means nothing. How many FA cups have you won last decade and how many times have you put up a title challenge? This should be the answer.

Anyway I said the same thing on this website back in 13/14 while everyone was busy creaming about Ozil here. Zurich knows.
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bj27
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#7990
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#7990
(Original post by MrChill)
But we played a full strength City and Chelsea team. You think because it was ONLY the FA cup semi or final, Chelsea and City players gave up?

Yes, we were rubbish last season. We got a better centreback in Gabriel and first choice goalie is back- defo will help against the Brightons. As for Villa, we couldn't break them down- so we upgraded our right wing and got a beast in Willian, even though Pepe is looking better.

A stable, defence can get you those points and I think we have every chance to be up there in the mix if people think Chelsea with their defence can get into the 90+ points! 😄

Anyways have goodun peeps. Laterz. 😁
Lol Beast in Willian. I watch him every week.

Lets lay down some stats for you because you're either 15 or stupid:
Willian
37 league goals in 7 seasons.
Havertz stats:
29 league goals in 2 seasons.

Both are right wingers/No 10s.

Don't want to use Ziyech stats because he's in a farmers league but similar story. We bought two better younger right wingers. Plus anyway Chelsea had lots of key injuries in the final, not an excuse for the way we played but Kanté starting and Pulisic not getting injured midway in the match and it's a different story.

No doubt I see the team Arteta is building and what he's trying to do with the players you've got and it looks good, but you have no depth in midfield hence having to use the likes of Elneny, Maitland Niles is nice squad player but he's not particularly a top player, he's a role player.
Last edited by bj27; 1 month ago
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samir12
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#7991
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#7991
(Original post by MrChill)
But we played a full strength City and Chelsea team. You think because it was ONLY the FA cup semi or final, Chelsea and City players gave up?

Yes, we were rubbish last season. We got a better centreback in Gabriel and first choice goalie is back- defo will help against the Brightons. As for Villa, we couldn't break them down- so we upgraded our right wing and got a beast in Willian, even though Pepe is looking better.

A stable, defence can get you those points and I think we have every chance to be up there in the mix if people think Chelsea with their defence can get into the 90+ points! 😄

Anyways have goodun peeps. Laterz. 😁
My point is it just simply has no relevance for the Premier League as its a knock out cup competition but even then, the average PL teams don't play as attacking as those teams you mentioned and you get the majority of points from those types of teams, not by beating the top 6. Liverpool in the past were able to beat top teams in the PL but still couldn't win the league as they dropped too many points against the lower sides who parked the bus, not every team is going to play into Arteta's hands. United had a stable defence under Mourinho in his second season but only got 84 points and lost out to Man City who got 100 points. Just having a stable defence and one top striker isn't enough nowadays, bar has been raised now.

Can see you guys going on a run like Leicester did last season but will not be able to sustain it for a full season and drop off. Top 4 is certainly achievable but will be tough.
Last edited by samir12; 1 month ago
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Zürich
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#7992
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#7992
Yeah title talk is ludicrous and will be for a few years until we enter another cycle post Klopp/Pep. Same position as Utd I think.

My prediction is City to hit 95-100ish points, Liverpool 90-95ish, Chelsea 75-80ish, Utd 70-75, Arsenal 70-80. Jose will be sacked.
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Zürich
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#7993
Unai Emery disasterclass in La Liga today against newly promoted Huesca.

This guy man...
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MrChill
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#7994
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(Original post by bj27)
Lol Beast in Willian. I watch him every week.

Lets lay down some stats for you because you're either 15 or stupid:
Willian
37 league goals in 7 seasons.
Havertz stats:
29 league goals in 2 seasons.

Both are right wingers/No 10s.

Don't want to use Ziyech stats because he's in a farmers league but similar story. We bought two better younger right wingers. Plus anyway Chelsea had lots of key injuries in the final, not an excuse for the way we played but Kanté starting and Pulisic not getting injured midway in the match and it's a different story.

No doubt I see the team Arteta is building and what he's trying to do with the players you've got and it looks good, but you have no depth in midfield hence having to use the likes of Elneny, Maitland Niles is nice squad player but he's not particularly a top player, he's a role player.
So you call me stupid for just voicing my opinion about Willian. That's uncalled for and frankly quite disrespectful. But, I don't know what's going on in your life so I will let it go this time.

I don't understand why you are trying to compare Havertz to Willian-I never mentioned anything about Havertz or Ziyech. Also, I would like to point out that Havertz played as centre forward last season for a number of games and scored- so the numbers are skewed. Also, Havertz doesn't help with defending and win possession like Willian. So he isn't as well rounded like Willian, albeit with much higher ceiling. Pulisic is better imo. But, compared to Ozil Willian is a beast.

I based my opinion on Willian's all-around attacking + defensive ability. He created 76 chances last season in EPL. Source: List of players who created most chances. His set pieces are ridiculously good. Goals are one part of the equation and just because Giroud and Tammy couldn't score from the insane amount of chances created by Willian isn't his fault. Also, Frank plays differently to how we play. Auba, Pepe, Laca will thrive with Willian behind them as we don't have anyone who made it into top 15 of that "most chances created list". He already has 2 assists in the league- 28% of the total amount of assists he made for Chelsea in all of last season. There is a reason why you signed Werner-to get your goal scored tally closer to your chances created tally.

As for Silva being fast, will he be able to keep up with Adama Traore, Aubameyangs in EPL? Azpilicueta is faster and pulled a hammie trying to keep up with Auba in the FA cup final. You conceded 54 goals last season, we conceded 48 with one of the worst defences in the league with our second goalie in goal towards the end of the season. A 35-year-old, slower Silva + Kepa will somehow make you better defensively? Don’t get me wrong you will score bucket loads with Havertz, Ziyech, Werner, Pulisic but will you be able to keep clean sheets when needed against the likes of City, Liverpools, etc?

Also, I did say people might laugh at my opinion and call me nutter but we have a world class striker, one of the highest chance creators from last season, a rock solid defence with one of the top goalies from last season. Last season we had an unusual number of draws but we lost less matches than Chelsea, Leicester, etc. Our squad has plenty of players who can come in and do a job too. Hence my optimism. You don't have to agree with it but doesn't mean you can start calling me stupid lol.

Also, this is a different era with a different manager, with different tactical mentality. Don't compare 2017 Post Wenger era to Mikel's.

How do you know that despite all the best players in the world, Frank won't have a disaster of a season? He certainly underperformed last season tactically with a very good squad. Give Arteta your squad from last season and he challenges for title imo.

Finally, aim for the top, you might get 4th. Aim for 4th, you know how that ended for us last season peeps. Just my friendly opinion.
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MrChill
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#7995
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(Original post by Zürich)
Unai Emery disasterclass in La Liga today against newly promoted Huesca.

This guy man...
Haha Emery is finished.

Did anyone see the PSG vs Marseille fight at the end of the match? I thought fight night was on lol. Check it out, if you haven't already :eek3::

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Gob Bluth
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#7996
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#7996
(Original post by MrChill)
So you call me stupid for just voicing my opinion about Willian. That's uncalled for and frankly quite disrespectful. But, I don't know what's going on in your life so I will let it go this time.

I don't understand why you are trying to compare Havertz to Willian-I never mentioned anything about Havertz or Ziyech. Also, I would like to point out that Havertz played as centre forward last season for a number of games and scored- so the numbers are skewed. Also, Havertz doesn't help with defending and win possession like Willian. So he isn't as well rounded like Willian, albeit with much higher ceiling. Pulisic is better imo. But, compared to Ozil Willian is a beast.

I based my opinion on Willian's all-around attacking + defensive ability. He created 76 chances last season in EPL. Source: List of players who created most chances. His set pieces are ridiculously good. Goals are one part of the equation and just because Giroud and Tammy couldn't score from the insane amount of chances created by Willian isn't his fault. Also, Frank plays differently to how we play. Auba, Pepe, Laca will thrive with Willian behind them as we don't have anyone who made it into top 15 of that "most chances created list". He already has 2 assists in the league- 28% of the total amount of assists he made for Chelsea in all of last season. There is a reason why you signed Werner-to get your goal scored tally closer to your chances created tally.

As for Silva being fast, will he be able to keep up with Adama Traore, Aubameyangs in EPL? Azpilicueta is faster and pulled a hammie trying to keep up with Auba in the FA cup final. You conceded 54 goals last season, we conceded 48 with one of the worst defences in the league with our second goalie in goal towards the end of the season. A 35-year-old, slower Silva + Kepa will somehow make you better defensively? Don’t get me wrong you will score bucket loads with Havertz, Ziyech, Werner, Pulisic but will you be able to keep clean sheets when needed against the likes of City, Liverpools, etc?

Also, I did say people might laugh at my opinion and call me nutter but we have a world class striker, one of the highest chance creators from last season, a rock solid defence with one of the top goalies from last season. Last season we had an unusual number of draws but we lost less matches than Chelsea, Leicester, etc. Our squad has plenty of players who can come in and do a job too. Hence my optimism. You don't have to agree with it but doesn't mean you can start calling me stupid lol.

Also, this is a different era with a different manager, with different tactical mentality. Don't compare 2017 Post Wenger era to Mikel's.

How do you know that despite all the best players in the world, Frank won't have a disaster of a season? He certainly underperformed last season tactically with a very good squad. Give Arteta your squad from last season and he challenges for title imo.

Finally, aim for the top, you might get 4th. Aim for 4th, you know how that ended for us last season peeps. Just my friendly opinion.
problem is we have all seen it over the years that people get their hopes up over a good run and then that hope just comes crashing down around them.

arsenal essentially need to be hitting a 90+ point season and you justify that after a good run. good runs happen to all teams but as jam stayed you suddenly need to best all the lower teams in order to get those sorts of tallies. arsenal are some way from that consistency unfortunately. I reckon you'll end up with 73 points or so which will be a good season all things considered.

also arteta needs to prove himself over the season to be talking so highly about him. it is likely he can based on his start so far but it's quite early to be scoffing at other managers like Frank when you consider similar reasons such as tenure and Chelsea's situation last year with the ban.

nothing wrong with hope but it's the hope that kills
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bj27
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#7997
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lol challenge for title with our squad from last season when we lost our best player while Abraham and Pulisic were injured for nearly half the season. That is nonsense of the highest order. I get annoyed with Frank's decisions but we should have finished 8th with the squad we had under those circumstances.

I'll quote you when season is done.

The drivel about Willian, when Costa was there Willian wasn't scoring goals for fun either and Costa was a bigger killer in the box than both of your strikers. Willian was in a 3-4-3 under Conte too and tbh your hoof to fast strikers via the defence is basically what Conte did. It's nothing new or revolutionary. what killed us was not having the right players. I guess looking at it your attack goals wise are at the same level as Chelsea's when we won the title.

Anyway I'll see end of season, will quote you then.
Last edited by bj27; 1 month ago
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Zerforax
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Is Auba being paid 400k a week with his new contract?
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bj27
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#7999
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(Original post by Zerforax)
Is Auba being paid 400k a week with his new contract?
meanwhile Werner on 270k.

Tbh I like Pepe and Saka too. I can't lie I think their attack man for man is near to Liverpools. They got the depth too compared to you lot.
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Zürich
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#8000
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(Original post by Zerforax)
Is Auba being paid 400k a week with his new contract?
Wouldnt surprise me, at least he's worth it unlike that horrid, fraudulent, leeching Turk we have....

Like this Arsenal team now, lots of big and good personalities like Auba, Maitland Niles, Luiz, Tierney. Havent felt like that since Santi/Podolski and co left.

But we need to cut the wage bill down obviously. I can see 5 departures in the coming weeks. 3 defenders, Torreria, El Neny etc. Not bad players at all btw, just not up to the level we aspire to.
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