Norrington Table 06/07

Being a prospective Mertonian...(well I was thinking of applying there this year...) the NT does scare you just a little :p:

Reply 22

Jonesy_LJ

Athena

Also 2nd or 3rd most students :wink:

/
I do love distorting statistics :biggrin:

Reply 23

Eau

I would've thought that the rankings would drastically change from year to year, as there are a new batch of students every year no?

Reply 24

Well yes, they do, that's rather the point. But it's also affected a lot by tutors (as in the Merton tutors for E+M and PPE certainly set extra essays) and by the general atmosphere of the college - freshers learn a lot very rapidly from the 2nd years about how much work it's worth putting in.

Reply 25

sugar_cane

They set extra essays for E&M? Is it majorly different from the other colleges?

Reply 26

Eau

Bekaboo

Well yes, they do, that's rather the point. But it's also affected a lot by tutors (as in the Merton tutors for E+M and PPE certainly set extra essays) and by the general atmosphere of the college - freshers learn a lot very rapidly from the 2nd years about how much work it's worth putting in.

Isn't that set by your own standards? Anyways, I really shouldn't read too much into this, lol - rankings within rankings within rankings are depressing.

Reply 27

Original post by &#8756

They set extra essays for E&M? Is it majorly different from the other colleges?

You're best off asking Megsy but I'm sure she said at one point she was set 4 a week rather than 2.

Reply 28

Eau

Isn't that set by your own standards? Anyways, I really shouldn't read too much into this, lol - rankings within rankings within rankings are depressing.

It should be, but it very rarely is. How much work you do is likely to be largely effected by how much work your friends, tute partners, and college parents do. If your tute partner is sailing through on a 1st then you're unlikely to be happy with a 2i and may end up staying all night trying to craft the perfect essay, but if they're sat back smiling you may find yourself easing off. If all the people you live with are working when you feel like giving up but have nothing better to do, you might go back to those problem sheets, rather than giving up when they're all going to go to the pub without you. Your college parents are likely to tell you which lectures are worth going to, which tutors will cut you some slack, and how quickly you'll hit your stride.

Reply 29

sugar_cane

Bekaboo

You're best off asking Megsy but I'm sure she said at one point she was set 4 a week rather than 2.

My my, four... :s-smilie:

That should be interesting if I ever get in!

Reply 30

Eau

Bekaboo

It should be, but it very rarely is. How much work you do is likely to be largely effected by how much work your friends, tute partners, and college parents do. If your tute partner is sailing through on a 1st then you're unlikely to be happy with a 2i and may end up staying all night trying to craft the perfect essay, but if they're sat back smiling you may find yourself easing off. If all the people you live with are working when you feel like giving up but have nothing better to do, you might go back to those problem sheets, rather than giving up when they're all going to go to the pub without you. Your college parents are likely to tell you which lectures are worth going to, which tutors will cut you some slack, and how quickly you'll hit your stride.

So, like at school. :smile:

Reply 31

London Prophet

17

hic_et_ubique

WOOHOO.

Pembroke is in the top 10!!!!!!!!!! :biggrin:

I knew our year was a good one (Ok, I admit, my 2:1 was pulling us down not up, but still i feel proud :biggrin:

)

Reply 32

Athena

6

Bekaboo

Your college parents are likely to tell you which lectures are worth going to, which tutors will cut you some slack, and how quickly you'll hit your stride.

As well as lending you books, helping with lab reports, letting you read their essays... have I said how great my college parents are? Hehe. You all did really well in your exams, I'm pleased for you :biggrin:

Reply 33

Hehe depends on how nice your parents are - although in fairness Simon (who isn't technically my dad but the Jesus system is strange) did give me all his 1st year essays around Easter in my first year so i could revise from them and helped me out with a lab report this time around. I'm surprised at how much help Penny and Sarah can give you given they do a different subject :p:

Still itching to know what everyone else got!

Reply 34

kizer

Bekaboo

Well yes, they do, that's rather the point. But it's also affected a lot by tutors (as in the Merton tutors for E+M and PPE certainly set extra essays) and by the general atmosphere of the college - freshers learn a lot very rapidly from the 2nd years about how much work it's worth putting in.

Also worth remembering is that colleges have different amounts of students doing different subjects. Colleges which have a lot of science students have a natural advantage on the Norrington table.

AND, of course, the obvious fact that colleges do not all get candidates of equal ability applying there at first. Some colleges are way oversubscribed (so can pick out the best and move the others to other colleges), and some have to consider candidates discarded by other colleges (being very undersubscibed). Also in some subjects (and perhaps generally, but that would be a conjecture I could not prove) some colleges have a particular reputation (Balliol PPE, Magdalen English etc) which means a lot of high quality candidates apply there.

Not the most PC reason of course, but it would be incomplete not to mention it.

Reply 35

thomasjtl

9

I wonder what will happen to hilda's position in the next few years, after it's gone mixed. Be interesting to see whether the issue of not many people applying there because its single sex and hence pooling more applicants really does have much affect on its position.

Reply 36

kizer

^^ I would predict that its position will clearly improve. It cannot be good for it's table position that so many of the students there were pooled there - pooled students are ones specifically chosen as not the best among a group of applicants.

Reply 37

hobnob

kizer

^^ I would predict that its position will clearly improve. It cannot be good for it's table position that so many of the students there were pooled there - pooled students are ones specifically chosen as not the best among a group of applicants.

It probably will rank a bit higher, but for a very simple reason: boys get more firsts.

I doubt that there'll be a sudden surge in top-quality direct applicants to Hilda's, though, to be honest. After all, it's not like the college is going to turn into Balliol or Christ Church overnight. The college won't suddenly become old or rich or famous just because it's going mixed, so I don't really see people who would now go for the grand colleges applying to Hilda's instead in a few years' time... :dontknow:

There may be a chance that a couple of strong applicants with low self-confidence will end up applying there, because they falsely believe the more popular colleges wouldn't take them, but there'll probably be far more direct applicants who are simply trying to play the stats game. Or male applicants who fancy the idea of being among the first boys admitted to a former girls' college. :wink:

Obviously those groups of applicants can still be great students, but I don't think there's any reason to assume they'll automatically be of a much higher standard than the sort of people who apply there now...

Reply 38

Hoofbeat

kizer

...pooled students are ones specifically chosen as not the best among a group of applicants.

I don't think you can generalise like that. Indeed, some pooled students will not be the best applicants, but sometimes they can be equal to the other applicants but may have been interviewed later and thus if their college has already made a firm decision that they are definitely taking some of the people they interviewed earlier, then irrespective of their quality they will be pooled. I think it depends entirely on the subject involved, ie. some subjects have more departmental admissions proceedures (eg. Biochemistry where the students are all ranked and those that are ranked highest get their preferred college), but in other subjects it could entirely depend on whether you're interviewed first or last! However, I think you're certainly right that their will be some improvement in Hilda's Norrington table position, which may partly be due to the number of pooled applicants there to begin with.

Also, I disagree with your comment:

Also worth remembering is that colleges have different amounts of students doing different subjects. Colleges which have a lot of science students have a natural advantage on the Norrington table.

Indeed, it is true that more scientists get firsts than many arts subjects, which could be seen as an unfair advantage on the Norrington table. However, far more 2:2's and 3rd are given out in sciences than arts (how many 3rds do you ever see in History finals?!) so in my opinion that balances everything out.

Reply 39

kizer