edders' campaign for grammatical excellence

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DazYa
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#161
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#161
(Original post by Fluffy)
What random hate campaign are you referring to? Little boy, and your aliases, 'ahem' I mean school friends. If you feel pointing out grammatical weaknesses is a hate campaign, I really hope you do not come across anyone in the real world with a true hatred for you.

Anyway, I really have to run as concierge has just buzzed up as our cab is here.

I hope you have fun.
Your sly remarks
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law man
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#162
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#162
(Original post by Tinykates)
I'm (pretty) sure it's not. Where can we find out for sure? Any ideas?
The most authoritative source on correct grammar usage is, without doubt, The New Fowler's Modern English Usage. It can be found on Amazon here.
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zazy
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#163
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#163
(Original post by edders)
I will be giving out rep for the next few weeks to those people who construct grammatically sound sentences. Obviously, the better written and more stylish posts will be rewarded. Points for proper use of the colon, semicolon, apostrophe, hyphen, ellipsis etc.

It is not long-winded posts that will be rewarded; posts that read well are what I'm looking for. As such, everyday practices such as elision (eg. "don't") are fine.

It is individual posts that will be rewarded. Therefore consistently good grammar by the author is not required; it is simply necessary in the post you would like to reward.

This is an ongoing process: as such there will be no single 'winner'. Indeed, we shall all be winners as we read examples of good writing!

Please remember, the point of this exercise is not to criticise non-conventional grammar but to reward its good usage.

Feel free to nominate people by posting links to their well-written posts here. Alternatively, simply copy and paste the post into your own posting here, stating who it was by and which thread it was in.
I hope this will be a learning experience for us all.

Thanks Edders. Finally, someone actually encouraged UKL members to make sense!
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wanderer
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#164
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#164
The ramifications of the ideas expressed in this thread are quite mind-blowing if you think about it. What is correct spelling and grammar? Who defines a language and the correct way to use it - those who study it or the users themselves?

On the one hand, it is possible to argue that language is by it's very nature malleable, a multi-purpose tool lacking any kind of formal, objective structure. The accepted use of a particular language varies according to time and place - a home counties accent would sound ridiculously posh here in Cumbria, and any variant of modern English would probably be almost incomprehensible to a time traveller from several centuries ago.

On the other hand, there are arguments to back up a formal standard of spelling and grammar (and pronunciation as well, when it comes down to it). It is certainly necessary for legal purposes - the meaning of words and phrases in contracts and legal documents must be firmly established in order for them to function correctly. While it could be argued that standardisation of language can help reduce discrimination, it seems unlikely - language discrimination is hardly a major issue in modern society. However, some of the comments made in this thread do suggest that language issues can generate a certain amount of ... animosity.

The main focus of this argument, however, seems to be on the aesthetic values of language. Many who profess to support what is called 'the correct use of english' seem to harbour a dislike for, even a hatred of, 'text talk' and its relations. While it may be easy to form aesthetic arguments in support of the use of dialects such as Scots or Cumbrian, it is more difficult to justify the harshness of text talk - it simply adds nothing, aesthetically speaking, to the language, and due to its minimalism in regard to word length, can easily destroy any beauty the words possess. However, the single main purpose of language is simply to communicate, and this is what text talk accomplishes - communication without embellishment. It is pure simplicity, and therein lies its value.

The above arguments aren't meant to lead to any strong conclusion, merely to show that this is an interesting issue. I personally couldn't care less either way - I admire well-used english in certain circumstances, but I have no problem with text talk. Tom Leonard makes an interesting comment about these issues with his poem, 'Unrelated Incidents', which is written entirely in Scottish dialect - it was in the AQA GCSE English anthology, so some of you might well have encountered it.
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wanderer
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#165
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#165
*phew*
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dogtanian
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#166
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#166
(Original post by wanderer)
The ramifications of the ideas expressed in this thread are quite mind-blowing if you think about it. What is correct spelling and grammar? Who defines a language and the correct way to use it - those who study it or the users themselves?

On the one hand, it is possible to argue that language is by it's very nature malleable, a multi-purpose tool lacking any kind of formal, objective structure. The accepted use of a particular language varies according to time and place - a home counties accent would sound ridiculously posh here in Cumbria, and any variant of modern English would probably be almost incomprehensible to a time traveller from several centuries ago.

On the other hand, there are arguments to back up a formal standard of spelling and grammar (and pronunciation as well, when it comes down to it). It is certainly necessary for legal purposes - the meaning of words and phrases in contracts and legal documents must be firmly established in order for them to function correctly. While it could be argued that standardisation of language can help reduce discrimination, it seems unlikely - language discrimination is hardly a major issue in modern society. However, some of the comments made in this thread do suggest that language issues can generate a certain amount of ... animosity.

The main focus of this argument, however, seems to be on the aesthetic values of language. Many who profess to support what is called 'the correct use of english' seem to harbour a dislike for, even a hatred of, 'text talk' and its relations. While it may be easy to form aesthetic arguments in support of the use of dialects such as Scots or Cumbrian, it is more difficult to justify the harshness of text talk - it simply adds nothing, aesthetically speaking, to the language, and due to its minimalism in regard to word length, can easily destroy any beauty the words possess. However, the single main purpose of language is simply to communicate, and this is what text talk accomplishes - communication without embellishment. It is pure simplicity, and therein lies its value.

The above arguments aren't meant to lead to any strong conclusion, merely to show that this is an interesting issue. I personally couldn't care less either way - I admire well-used english in certain circumstances, but I have no problem with text talk. Tom Leonard makes an interesting comment about these issues with his poem, 'Unrelated Incidents', which is written entirely in Scottish dialect - it was in the AQA GCSE English anthology, so some of you might well have encountered it.
You could have just asked for rep. It would have been so much easier.


Oh, and capitalise the E in "English". That sort of post is just asking for the pedants to creep out of the darkness...
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musicman
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#167
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#167
(Original post by wanderer)
The ramifications of the ideas expressed in this thread are quite mind-blowing if you think about it. What is correct spelling and grammar? Who defines a language and the correct way to use it - those who study it or the users themselves?

On the one hand, it is possible to argue that language is by it's very nature malleable, a multi-purpose tool lacking any kind of formal, objective structure. The accepted use of a particular language varies according to time and place - a home counties accent would sound ridiculously posh here in Cumbria, and any variant of modern English would probably be almost incomprehensible to a time traveller from several centuries ago.

On the other hand, there are arguments to back up a formal standard of spelling and grammar (and pronunciation as well, when it comes down to it). It is certainly necessary for legal purposes - the meaning of words and phrases in contracts and legal documents must be firmly established in order for them to function correctly. While it could be argued that standardisation of language can help reduce discrimination, it seems unlikely - language discrimination is hardly a major issue in modern society. However, some of the comments made in this thread do suggest that language issues can generate a certain amount of ... animosity.

The main focus of this argument, however, seems to be on the aesthetic values of language. Many who profess to support what is called 'the correct use of english' seem to harbour a dislike for, even a hatred of, 'text talk' and its relations. While it may be easy to form aesthetic arguments in support of the use of dialects such as Scots or Cumbrian, it is more difficult to justify the harshness of text talk - it simply adds nothing, aesthetically speaking, to the language, and due to its minimalism in regard to word length, can easily destroy any beauty the words possess. However, the single main purpose of language is simply to communicate, and this is what text talk accomplishes - communication without embellishment. It is pure simplicity, and therein lies its value.

The above arguments aren't meant to lead to any strong conclusion, merely to show that this is an interesting issue. I personally couldn't care less either way - I admire well-used english in certain circumstances, but I have no problem with text talk. Tom Leonard makes an interesting comment about these issues with his poem, 'Unrelated Incidents', which is written entirely in Scottish dialect - it was in the AQA GCSE English anthology, so some of you might well have encountered it.
How rep-hungry can one person actually be? The apostrophe in "it's" will probably prevent you from gaining rep for this post - an apostrophe should only be used if you mean "it is", as the possessive pronoun does not have an apostrophe.
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wanderer
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#168
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#168
*laughs*

If you think I was just doing that for rep, you should have seen some of my posts on a couple of forums I was on before this one - science and philosophy ones without any rep system. The fact that I actually enjoyed thinking about this and writing that isn't impressive - its sad. I just start writing and then get carried away. Anyway, as far as I can tell, the best way to get rep is to make people laugh, which probably involves less typing.
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....
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#169
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#169
(Original post by wanderer)
Anyway, as far as I can tell, the best way to get rep is to make people laugh, which probably involves less typing.
A much more difficult skill too

Oh and, you got "it's" wrong again
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Apollo
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#170
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#170
(Original post by Gimp)
A much more difficult skill too

Oh and, you got "it's" wrong again
why do i get the feeling this is going to get very annoying, very quickly
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wanderer
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#171
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#171
I can't seem to help the it's/its thing - I always seem to get it wrong. You're absolutely right about making people laugh though. One of the most difficult things to pull off.

An argument about whether I wrote that post for rep or not would be completely pointless, so I'll try and avoid it by going to bed. Sorry if I've given off a bad impression here.
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Bhaal85
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#172
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#172
(Original post by edders)
I will be giving out rep for the next few weeks to those people who construct grammatically sound sentences. Obviously, the better written and more stylish posts will be rewarded. Points for proper use of the colon, semicolon, apostrophe, hyphen, ellipsis etc.

It is not long-winded posts that will be rewarded; posts that read well are what I'm looking for. As such, everyday practices such as elision (eg. "don't") are fine.

It is individual posts that will be rewarded. Therefore consistently good grammar by the author is not required; it is simply necessary in the post you would like to reward.

This is an ongoing process: as such there will be no single 'winner'. Indeed, we shall all be winners as we read examples of good writing!

Please remember, the point of this exercise is not to criticise non-conventional grammar but to reward its good usage.

Feel free to nominate people by posting links to their well-written posts here. Alternatively, simply copy and paste the post into your own posting here, stating who it was by and which thread it was in.
I hope this will be a learning experience for us all.

How wonderfully mad of you.
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Mighty
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#173
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#173
I take it you're trying to prevent this sort of language?

And yes, I shamelessly plagarised that from someone else. And I can't type.
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DazYa
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#174
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#174
(Original post by Mighty)
I take it you're trying to prevent this sort of language?

And yes, I shamelessly plagarised that from someone else. And I can't type.
go on the picture thread, i got " hax0r " speak on my t shirt kaka
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Mighty
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#175
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#175
(Original post by DazYa777)
go on the picture thread, i got " hax0r " speak on my t shirt kaka
www.thinkgeek.org

Full of random clothing like that.

NB: If the sight of netspeak offends you, don't click either of my links. You'll fall off your chair / stool / floor.
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not1
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#176
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#176
(Original post by wanderer)
The ramifications of the ideas expressed in this thread are quite mind-blowing if you think about it...
That's a copy and paste job from an English essay, right?
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crana
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#177
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#177
(Original post by Tinykates)
'However' should always be followed by a comma, and if it is in the middle of two other words a comma should also precede it.
In sentences like "However hard I try, I can never remember my password.", you mean?
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crana
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#178
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#178
(Original post by Fluffy)
I would like to thank you for your concern, but it is misplaced. I would like to reassure you, having already done one undergraduate degree and having gained a D.Phil. from the University of Oxford, that there are ways of avoiding letting a medical condition disrupt your academic outputs.
Just out of interest, is dyslexia actually considered to be a medical condition?
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Geogger
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#179
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#179
(Original post by crana)
In sentences like "However hard I try, I can never remember my password.", you mean?
Nice one!
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musicman
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#180
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#180
I feel that edders has no intention of giving anybody any rep for this, and is just enjoying seeing everyone try too hard.
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