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Who was responsible for the Cold War? Watch

  • View Poll Results: Who was responsible for the Cold War?
    The USSR
    65
    19.17%
    The USA
    80
    23.60%
    Both equally
    194
    57.23%

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    What do you guys think? I've given some talking points but would love to have people post their opinions about which state was responsible for the Cold War.

    Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (USSR)
    - The US gave $11 billion assistance to the Soviet Union during WW2: shows initial desire to cooperate?
    - US did not seek to dominate other states, or dominate the International system - just help to rebuild their economic and political systems: evidenced by the Marshall Plan (aid to Europe to rebuild which the USSR told their Eastern European satellites not to take)
    - USSR was expansionist power and wanted communism to spread (the Comintern and later the Cominform). First targets were Eastern European states which the USSR refused to withdraw from following WW2
    - The US tried to help countries rebuild after WW2 in order to open new markets: based on treaties and agreements, unlike the Soviet empire which based expansion on coercion.
    - far more authoritarian, not constrained by domestic politics unlike the US


    The USA
    - After WW2 the US wanted to consolidate its economic and political interests overseas: had the strongest economy in the world -> needed to create markets to drive its domestic economy
    - Domestically there was a great deal of paranoia about communists -> McCarthyism, “red terror”
    - US was the first to develop nukes. The USSR felt threatened by this, they did not develop the bomb until 1949. The US used theirs against Japan, underlining US military power in the world, was a warning to the Soviet Union.
    - the Marshall plan wasn’t simply to help rebuild European economies but was the spreading of US influence in Europe – very close to the USSR’s sphere of influence
    - The extension of Soviet influence into Eastern Europe was a defensive action: needed to create a buffer zone against capitalism.
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    It was inevitable because they had opposing ideologies. The moment Lenin started to turn Marx's theories into reality. then they were always bound to clash and that was before WW2. They would have clashed whether WW2 would have taken place or not..
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    I voted both equally - I think they both played huge parts in causing it, and both did selfish things, which acted like a domino effect. It's really interesting how long the Cold War actually lasted! I feel like, scarily, it could happen again in the not too distant future.
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    [QUOTE=Sabertooth;67858302]
    Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (USSR)
    - The US gave $11 billion assistance to the Soviet Union during WW2: shows initial desire to cooperate?

    Enemy of my enemy is my friend. They wer fighting Hitler at the time which seemed like a greater threat. maintaining war on two fronts assisted the USA so Russia was able to fight and the Germans ha to use resources to fight them. Menat less dead Americans.

    USSR was threatened and in a unique state by the end of WW2 as it was in an active war footing. It made sense to protect its interests and create a buffer zone against any potential attack.


    The USA
    Already came out of WW2 a winner , richer and more powerful.

    Ideology was in direct conflict against capitalism and the US way of life.

    USSR didnt develop nukes earlier not for want of trying.
    USA making nukes was to end WW2 not to warn the USSR.

    Marshall plan was about rebuilding Europe. I dont buy it was a spread of US influence. A stable Europe menat the USA wouldnt be dragged in again.
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    I'd say the USSR because of their desire for expansion into Eastern Europe.
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    I would say the US was slightly more to blame for it, but only slightly. Whilst Stalin definitely created a hostile atmosphere postwar and poisoned attempts to create a more positive one, it's also true that the US did many things to help foster and promote Soviet paranoia, particularly through the attitudes of hawkish generals like Patton and also through the first use of nuclear weapons in a manner that was clearly at least partly designed to intimidate the USSR and the subsequent rush to produce the hydrogen bomb. The rest is history, but Soviet attempts to 'keep up' militarily with the US were primarily driven by deep seated fears of another invasion from the West, whereas US military power was in the main about protecting economic interests and the rights of US corporations to control other territories.
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    USSR responsible for starting it.

    USA responsible for prolonging it.

    Also, the insidious nature of the Marshall Plan was very much apparent.
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    Long may communsim live
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    It was Cold nominally only, it was a confrontation between communist and democratic ideologies on a global scale. It was played out all over the world, with Vietnam probably the most vivid example, Africa. the Americas, Europe, with both US and USSR pushing their interests wherever the opportunity arose. The moment Portugal abandoned Angola in the 70s they waded in backing their own faction in a civil war that went on for decades, there were even Cuban troops shipped in to prop up the Soviet-backed government. Americans financing and equipping the opposition, south-African troops minding their own interests...

    A lot of people died in the Cold War. Arguably the most important conflict of the century.
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    USA and american imperialism.
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    (Original post by fksociety)
    USA and american imperialism.
    No such thing as Soviet imperialism then?
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    (Original post by zhog)
    No such thing as Soviet imperialism then?
    Did i say that soviet imperialism didnt exist? I said american imperialism was the cause of the cold war.

    Cheap strawman.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    I would say the US was slightly more to blame for it, but only slightly. Whilst Stalin definitely created a hostile atmosphere postwar and poisoned attempts to create a more positive one, it's also true that the US did many things to help foster and promote Soviet paranoia, particularly through the attitudes of hawkish generals like Patton and also through the first use of nuclear weapons in a manner that was clearly at least partly designed to intimidate the USSR and the subsequent rush to produce the hydrogen bomb. The rest is history, but Soviet attempts to 'keep up' militarily with the US were primarily driven by deep seated fears of another invasion from the West, whereas US military power was in the main about protecting economic interests and the rights of US corporations to control other territories.
    The USSR was the first to violate the Yalta agreement by purging the countries they had "liberated" and preventing elections from taking place, then they blockaded Berlin to force the USA to abandon the city. They also behaved like savages in their occupation zone; Soviets soldiers raped on an industrial scale and NKVD commissars killed at a similar pace. The fear of the Red Army was not a "paranoia". Most of the blame for starting the Cold War is on them.

    Don't let your antiamericanism fool you.
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    Quite simply it was the fault of those silly Bolshies, beyond that, it was reaction to the policies of the USSR
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    Its the United States who are to blame IMO, USSRs attitude wasn't expansion, but fear. The US' hostility towards a political stance that they disagree with (honestly, why was a "communist" such a dirty word?) provoked the inevitable dispute. It was the Soviets who blinked when Petrov refused to fire the nuclear missile, it was the Soviets who took the public hit over Cuba. I blame the USA.

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    (Original post by Josb)
    The USSR was the first to violate the Yalta agreement by purging the countries they had "liberated" and preventing elections from taking place, then they blockaded Berlin to force the USA to abandon the city. They also behaved like savages in their occupation zone; Soviets soldiers raped on an industrial scale and NKVD commissars killed at a similar pace. The fear of the Red Army was not a "paranoia". Most of the blame for starting the Cold War is on them.

    Don't let your antiamericanism fool you.
    Hmmm...a fair point about the blockade (although didn't it target the entirety of Berlin, or was it just the US sector?)

    Which country are you referring to regarding Yalta? The Soviets had already a presence in Poland and Scandinavia then.

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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    Hmmm...a fair point about the blockade (although didn't it target the entirety of Berlin, or was it just the US sector?)

    Which country are you referring to regarding Yalta? The Soviets had already a presence in Poland and Scandinavia then.

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    Why would they blockade their own sector? It was just the British, American, and French sectors

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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    Its the United States who are to blame IMO, USSRs attitude wasn't expansion, but fear. The US' hostility towards a political stance that they disagree with (honestly, why was a "communist" such a dirty word?) provoked the inevitable dispute. It was the Soviets who blinked when Petrov refused to fire the nuclear missile, it was the Soviets who took the public hit over Cuba. I blame the USA.

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    Rargh, the other ideology was wrong. Do you know when the Cold war is regarded as having started, short of going all the way back to Lenin (yeah, the Russian guy started it all off)? It's generally agreed to be related with the Truman Doctrine, bonus points if you can tell me who's expansionism this was a reaction to?

    Do you really expect the US to have taken the hit over Cuba when it was the Russian missiles going to Cuba that sparked it, even if US missiles in Turkey caused those actions? Do you really think allies over enemies would be blamed? Or the people who apparently lost nothing over the people who were made to remove their tactical edge? Remember, the Jupiter removals and promise not to invade Cuba were not common knowledge.

    Oh, and if you really can't work out why communist is such a dirty word, I'll give you a hint: it's related to the American Dream.

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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    Which country are you referring to regarding Yalta? The Soviets had already a presence in Poland and Scandinavia then.
    At Yalta, Stalin had promised to organise free elections at the end of the war, but:

    Poland: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish...ferendum,_1946
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish...,_1947#Conduct
    Czechoslovakia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_C..._d%27%C3%A9tat
    Romania: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani...irregularities
    etc.

    To be fair, there were free elections in Czechoslovakia and Hungary, but the problem was that Stalin didn't accept the results.

    Once the USA saw what was happening in Eastern Europe, they realised that they had to counter Soviet influence with the Marshall plan, which was only implemented in June 1948. If they had wanted to control Europe, they would have used it immediately after the fall of Nazi Germany. Their first idea was to destroy Germany with the Morgenthau Plan, and leave Europe. The US Congress was also Republican, and isolationists such as Robert Taft wanted to return to the pre-war situation.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Rargh, the other ideology was wrong. Do you know when the Cold war is regarded as having started, short of going all the way back to Lenin (yeah, the Russian guy started it all off)? It's generally agreed to be related with the Truman Doctrine, bonus points if you can tell me who's expansionism this was a reaction to?

    Do you really expect the US to have taken the hit over Cuba when it was the Russian missiles going to Cuba that sparked it, even if US missiles in Turkey caused those actions? Do you really think allies over enemies would be blamed? Or the people who apparently lost nothing over the people who were made to remove their tactical edge? Remember, the Jupiter removals and promise not to invade Cuba were not common knowledge.

    Oh, and if you really can't work out why communist is such a dirty word, I'll give you a hint: it's related to the American Dream.

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    The Truman doctrine (or Marshall Plan) was a response to preventing poorer nations from communism and becoming Soviet allies. American attitudes, not Soviets.

    I'll check up about the blockade, I'd assumed that since Soviet attitudes towards Germans was resentment anyway but okay, it was a power play.

    Again, its a simple comparison, the US had multiple military bases in proximity to the Soviet Union, additionally unlike the US bases, Cuba's leader was targeted for assassination, the Soviets rallied behind their communist ally. The US wanted to overthrow a revolution and restore a government looking after their own interests, how are they the good guys?

    It shows how much more powerful the US was than the USSR was, so that any deal would be easier to cope with for the US than the Soviets.

    I don't know who the Jupiter removals are, (guerillas?)

    Dirty as in why it was so hated, sure it defeats the American dream premise, but supporting the purge because of fear that a political ideology spreads? Madness.

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