Should prisons be reformed Watch

jonathanemptage
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I was watching this video recently.



and it got me thinking a lot of these are based in Scandinavia and seem to have very low reoffender rates obviously they are doing some thing right so I ask you guys how should we reform the prison system.
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sek510i
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After reading accounts of prison life by former inmates, and accounts by police officers who have to deal with reoffenders, I think it's pretty clear that prisons in this country do need some pretty major changes.

Firstly, people in prison still have access to drugs and alcohol, so their problems with them are less likely to stop. It's more expensive, but people can still find a way to get it. From one prisoner's account, it's mostly smuggled in by a small number of guards as well, along with mobile phones.

Secondly, on release, people don't get enough support. If somebody's dumped by the roadside with only the possessions they came into prison with, after possibly losing their home and job and contacts and stuff while they were inside, then they probably will be pushed back towards reoffending just to make ends meet.

Thirdly, if we gave the probation service some money then they could try to do more to help people with drug and alcohol problems when they were released, rather than making them sign in once a week or however often it is.

Fourthly, the CPS could push for (and the magistrates could provide) longer sentences for repeat offenders. I've heard of cases where people who had reoffended on release were arrested and sent back to prison for a couple of months, were released, reoffended and got another two month sentence. Again and again and again. After a certain point, prison sentences stop being a deterrent and just become a way to give the local police a break from arresting somebody from a couple of months, and the people committing these crimes (especially in the case of acquisitive crime) still aren't getting any help dealing with addictions or mental health issues.I think that our prison and justice system does very little to deter people from reoffending, and leaves it all up to family and friends, charities and to some extent the police and social services.
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jonathanemptage
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would compulsory training not help so they have an option to train as say a plumber or chef or bricklayer what have you so those who went in with no skills actually have a legal way to make a living when they are released.
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InArduisFouette
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(Original post by sek510i)

Secondly, on release, people don't get enough support. If somebody's dumped by the roadside with only the possessions they came into prison with, after possibly losing their home and job and contacts and stuff while they were inside, then they probably will be pushed back towards reoffending just to make ends meet.

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failure to engage is not the problem of NOMS or the DWP and LAs ...
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the bear
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the Death Penalty should be brought back for various offenses. Mobile phone signal blocking should be compulsory.
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999tigger
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Pfc they need to be reformed, its a neverending process. It costs money and thats a thing in short supply. They wont do anything because prison reform isnt a vote winner.
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natalie427
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(Original post by jonathanemptage)
would compulsory training not help so they have an option to train as say a plumber or chef or bricklayer what have you so those who went in with no skills actually have a legal way to make a living when they are released.
They already do this.
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natalie427
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(Original post by sek510i)
After reading accounts of prison life by former inmates, and accounts by police officers who have to deal with reoffenders, I think it's pretty clear that prisons in this country do need some pretty major changes.

Firstly, people in prison still have access to drugs and alcohol, so their problems with them are less likely to stop. It's more expensive, but people can still find a way to get it. From one prisoner's account, it's mostly smuggled in by a small number of guards as well, along with mobile phones.

Secondly, on release, people don't get enough support. If somebody's dumped by the roadside with only the possessions they came into prison with, after possibly losing their home and job and contacts and stuff while they were inside, then they probably will be pushed back towards reoffending just to make ends meet.

Thirdly, if we gave the probation service some money then they could try to do more to help people with drug and alcohol problems when they were released, rather than making them sign in once a week or however often it is.

Fourthly, the CPS could push for (and the magistrates could provide) longer sentences for repeat offenders. I've heard of cases where people who had reoffended on release were arrested and sent back to prison for a couple of months, were released, reoffended and got another two month sentence. Again and again and again. After a certain point, prison sentences stop being a deterrent and just become a way to give the local police a break from arresting somebody from a couple of months, and the people committing these crimes (especially in the case of acquisitive crime) still aren't getting any help dealing with addictions or mental health issues.I think that our prison and justice system does very little to deter people from reoffending, and leaves it all up to family and friends, charities and to some extent the police and social services.

I work in a prison and this is far from the case in our prison. We do have drug cases but very VERY few, and although I cannot say, I do not believe the guards in the prison I work in would ever smuggle drugs in.

I dont really agree with much you say, apart from money needs to be added to this area, not really just the probation services but also the psychological services (those who are designing the programmes and interventions for these offenders). A heavier focus also needs to be placed on the assessments made by psychologists, we are very clever at what we do and the justice system needs to involve us more in deciding what is best for a offender after their sentence is up.

Longer sentences for repeat offenders would be difficult to arrange, offences vary so much and situations are different for each offender etc. The justice system, government, law etc have to have everything standardised for every offender, if its one thing for one offender and another for another it will cause outburst. Would be very hard to organise.
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sek510i
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(Original post by natalie427)
I work in a prison and this is far from the case in our prison. We do have drug cases but very VERY few, and although I cannot say, I do not believe the guards in the prison I work in would ever smuggle drugs in.

I dont really agree with much you say, apart from money needs to be added to this area, not really just the probation services but also the psychological services (those who are designing the programmes and interventions for these offenders). A heavier focus also needs to be placed on the assessments made by psychologists, we are very clever at what we do and the justice system needs to involve us more in deciding what is best for a offender after their sentence is up.

Longer sentences for repeat offenders would be difficult to arrange, offences vary so much and situations are different for each offender etc. The justice system, government, law etc have to have everything standardised for every offender, if its one thing for one offender and another for another it will cause outburst. Would be very hard to organise.
I apologise if it sounded like I was blaming prison staff as a whole for the problems in the justice system, that wasn't my intention at all.
Certainly, I agree that each prisoner is different and longer sentences wouldn't be a solution for everybody. I just don't see the point in spending money on sending somebody to prison if it's unlikely to have an effect on their behaviour.

Do you think that they should let psychologists have more influence in the initial sentencing instead, and try to find alternatives that would suit the prisoner?
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by the bear)
the Death Penalty should be brought back for various offenses. Mobile phone signal blocking should be compulsory.
Which offences do you have in mind?
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the bear
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(Original post by AngryRedhead)
Which offences do you have in mind?
burglary, arson, murder etc *
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by the bear)
burglary, arson, murder etc *
Murder I can agree with but why burglary and arson? Also I had the impression you were too left wing for this kind of thing anyway
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the bear
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(Original post by AngryRedhead)
Murder I can agree with but why burglary and arson? Also I had the impression you were too left wing for this kind of thing anyway
i forgot to mention drug dealing. *
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by the bear)
i forgot to mention drug dealing. *
Why though?
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the bear
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(Original post by AngryRedhead)
Why though?
let me turn it round.... why not ? *
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MemeworksStudios
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100% of criminals executed never reoffend.
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Ambitious1999
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(Original post by sek510i)
I apologise if it sounded like I was blaming prison staff as a whole for the problems in the justice system, that wasn't my intention at all.
Certainly, I agree that each prisoner is different and longer sentences wouldn't be a solution for everybody. I just don't see the point in spending money on sending somebody to prison if it's unlikely to have an effect on their behaviour.

Do you think that they should let psychologists have more influence in the initial sentencing instead, and try to find alternatives that would suit the prisoner?
I agree prison is not the answer for a lot of crimes. I know somebody who went to prison for failing to pay a train fare and not attending their court summons. The sentence was only 30 days but they were treat the same as murderers and peadophiles. Bullied and punched by gangs. They had to endure the crossfire from rival gangs like Barton lox crew, Arran brotherhood, Tony McCraig appreciation militia etc.

That guy was never reformed during his 30 days inside. All he saw was violence, getting a black eye, being shouted at by guards. Yes there were courses but they refused to let him do his exams so what was the point?

He came out of prison no better than when he went in. Only thing he left with was the mental trauma of bullying, he lost his place at university . There were no exam certificates, guarantees of anything to better his life.

I'm just hoping that labour-momentum change the criminal justice system to bring back more understanding, liberty and reform as we had before new labour messed it up to please the daily mail readers.
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by the bear)
let me turn it round.... why not ? *
I just think that killing someone for supplying drugs is a little bit OTT; drug dealers are only in business because there's a demand for it from the general population. Is it really that much of a serious offense to warrant taking someone's life? What harm are they actually doing?

Burglary, whilst yes, I can see that it can be quite a traumatic experience for the victims to be burgled (I've never been burgled and God willing I never will be) I think because most burglaries don't involve killing (if they do it's different) a more appropiate punishment would be fine at least twice the value of whatever items were stolen.

Arson; The place where I work has had some stupid chavs try and set fire to the building for the laughs. Whilst it could have been dangerous had they succeeded in their goal I don't think it would have warranted the death penalty
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the bear
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(Original post by AngryRedhead)
I just think that killing someone for supplying drugs is a little bit OTT; drug dealers are only in business because there's a demand for it from the general population. Is it really that much of a serious offense to warrant taking someone's life? What harm are they actually doing?

Burglary, whilst yes, I can see that it can be quite a traumatic experience for the victims to be burgled (I've never been burgled and God willing I never will be) I think because most burglaries don't involve killing (if they do it's different) a more appropiate punishment would be fine at least twice the value of whatever items were stolen.

Arson; The place where I work has had some stupid chavs try and set fire to the building for the laughs. Whilst it could have been dangerous had they succeeded in their goal I don't think it would have warranted the death penalty
you are entitled to your opinion

this is one referendum which HMG are definitely not going ahead with !*
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by the bear)
you are entitled to your opinion

this is one referendum which HMG are definitely not going ahead with !*
You still haven't given your side of the coin? Why do you think the aforementioned offences are worthy of death?
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