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Muh 'project fear'

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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-3...alflow_twitter

    I wonder how the brexshiteers are going to spin this one?

    *ah a quick look at the LBC comment section shows that apparently "this will be a good thing as it will bust monopolies and allow people to buy British produce' ...

    And there I was thinking that these were all British companies and one of the benefits to leaving the EU would be cheaper food...


    I've got to congratulate Cummings and Eliot: whilst Mandelson and Campbell taught politicians to spin- VoteLeave have taught people to spin themselves!
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    Just like I tell the Brexiteers you need to be thinking longer term. We havent even left yet, so markets will be volatile for several years.
    This is too short term and more focused on unceratinity. After we leave then we wont have to be contributing to CAP any more.
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-3...alflow_twitter

    I wonder how the brexshiteers are going to spin this one?

    *ah a quick look at the LBC comment section shows that apparently "this will be a good thing as it will bust monopolies and allow people to buy British produce' ...

    And there I was thinking that these were all British companies and one of the benefits to leaving the EU would be cheaper food...

    I've got to congratulate Cummings and Eliot: whilst Mandelson and Campbell taught politicians to spin- VoteLeave have taught people to spin themselves!
    If you look at Unilever's accounts then their gross margin is actually pretty hefty on a global basis (higher than your electricity provider for example) so i have little sympathy and all that's happening here is that a producer big enough to have a degree of market power over retailers is finding that Tesco are not the small fish it probably deals with elsewhere.

    Looking at the brands they are also a bit rubbish so i back Tesco here.

    Regarding cheaper food post-Brexit there are some ways to see that..

    1) We can abolish tarrifs on all agricultural imports (it would screw farmers but food production stopped being a major driver of the economy in the 1700's).

    2) Once we've abolished CAP many farms will no longer be able to carry on selling things like milk at a loss so they will switch to producing vegetables for example and hence the price of those will fall

    3) We could through M&A see more industrial farming take over and benefit through economies of scale. US and Australian production factories are huge and automated.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    If you look at Unilever's accounts then their gross margin is actually pretty hefty on a global basis (higher than your electricity provider for example) so i have little sympathy and all that's happening here is that a producer big enough to have a degree of market power over retailers is finding that Tesco are not the small fish it probably deals with elsewhere.

    Looking at the brands they are also a bit rubbish so i back Tesco here.

    Regarding cheaper food post-Brexit there are some ways to see that..

    1) We can abolish tarrifs on all agricultural imports (it would screw farmers but food production stopped being a major driver of the economy in the 1700's).

    2) Once we've abolished CAP many farms will no longer be able to carry on selling things like milk at a loss so they will switch to producing vegetables for example and hence the price of those will fall

    3) We could through M&A see more industrial farming take over and benefit through economies of scale. US and Australian production factories are huge and automated.

    1: Cant see May doing that, and that would put her on a collision course with shire tories and the farming lobby

    2: whilst you say that the companies are s bit rubbish they have strong brands and are globally recognised- di you see the imports from the third world really being superior?

    3: don't see what this has to do with brexit.
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    The Tesco and Unilever argument is a bit like Britain and the EU.

    Tesco is Britain, a small retailer in global terms while Unilever is the large multinational with a world wide presence. Like the EU, if Unilever gives way to Tesco, it would appear weak to other retailers like Sainsburys and lose negotiating power similar to the EU's argument with Switzerland and soon, Britain.
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-3...alflow_twitter

    I wonder how the brexshiteers are going to spin this one?

    *ah a quick look at the LBC comment section shows that apparently "this will be a good thing as it will bust monopolies and allow people to buy British produce' ...

    And there I was thinking that these were all British companies and one of the benefits to leaving the EU would be cheaper food...


    I've got to congratulate Cummings and Eliot: whilst Mandelson and Campbell taught politicians to spin- VoteLeave have taught people to spin themselves!
    Unilever are trying it on with a 10% increase without the reasoning to back it up and Tesco have rightly told them to do one.

    If it were 5% and a review on a monthly basis then there would probably be no argument


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    (Original post by Davij038)
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-3...alflow_twitter

    I wonder how the brexshiteers are going to spin this one?

    *ah a quick look at the LBC comment section shows that apparently "this will be a good thing as it will bust monopolies and allow people to buy British produce' ...

    And there I was thinking that these were all British companies and one of the benefits to leaving the EU would be cheaper food...


    I've got to congratulate Cummings and Eliot: whilst Mandelson and Campbell taught politicians to spin- VoteLeave have taught people to spin themselves!
    Yes, an important part of Leave was to delude people into becoming their own Leave PR machine.

    Unilever are just reacting to market conditions - because they are big, they have sufficient market power to demand the price increases - but all of the other major and minor suppliers will soon be following suit. Tesco's approach to it is like the little Dutch boy sticking his finger in the hole in the damn. Facts are facts and it's a fact that the £ has lost a substantial slice of its value.
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    No more Marmite!?

    Damn you Brexit. This is the last straw :fuhrer:

    There will be riots I tell you. :mob:
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    Don't worry guys, Rakas21 doesn't like these brands, so this is fine. Everything's fine.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)

    Looking at the brands they are also a bit rubbish so i back Tesco here.
    :rofl:
    Spoiler:
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    You take that back :indiff:
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    so you're saying this delegitimises brexit as a long term plan? :lol: woooow.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    so you're saying this delegitimises brexit as a long term plan? :lol: woooow.
    No I'm pointing out another example of how batshit deluded politics in the west in general is gettting.

    We were told by vote Leave that prices will be cheaper and that there would be no real economic impact and further more that people were not only wrong but lying when they said otherwise (Leave.EU for all of its faults should be commended for its honesty on this point),

    Now this and other examples have shown that there will probably be s few bumps on the road and instead of some contrition brexiters are now either blaming remainers or saying it's all a good thing.

    When the lib dems promised free tuition fees and were unable to provide it people went mad at them for doing anything to get into power. When Vote Leave does the same thing brexiters start blameing others.

    If you think it's good that we have a massively devalued currency, lower investment and possibly face higher food bills fine make that argument. But these were arguments used by remain which have turned out to be correct rather than project fear and we haven't even left the bloody thing yet.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    If you look at Unilever's accounts then their gross margin is actually pretty hefty on a global basis (higher than your electricity provider for example) so i have little sympathy and all that's happening here is that a producer big enough to have a degree of market power over retailers is finding that Tesco are not the small fish it probably deals with elsewhere.

    Looking at the brands they are also a bit rubbish so i back Tesco here.

    Regarding cheaper food post-Brexit there are some ways to see that..

    1) We can abolish tarrifs on all agricultural imports (it would screw farmers but food production stopped being a major driver of the economy in the 1700's).

    2) Once we've abolished CAP many farms will no longer be able to carry on selling things like milk at a loss so they will switch to producing vegetables for example and hence the price of those will fall

    3) We could through M&A see more industrial farming take over and benefit through economies of scale. US and Australian production factories are huge and automated.
    1) alienating, then destroying the farming industry that various leave campaigners said they would protect, also could make the UK weaker in that it would near totally reliant on imports for all food.

    2) So all dairy farmers will move over to vergtable production? Regardless of land, cost and other barriers that would prevent them from doing so. Plus then we'll just end up with low milk production and the price of milk will go up, way up (or will have to import a highly perishable good, most likely from the EU).

    3) Not a fan of the 'Britain is full' idea but the idea that the UK is suddenly going to set up thousand acre, highly automated meat factories is pretty ridiculous.


    Ont he issue at hand I have precisely 0 sympathy with Tesco. They and other supermarkets have bullied producers smaller than them for years, paying prices hat are fundamentally unfair and unsustainable so that they can sell products like milk at a loss. Now a bigger company has turned up and started pushing them around and suddenly they don't like it? Pathetic. That's capitalist economies for you though, you get to bully everyone smaller than you until someone else turns up to bully you, meanwhile ordinary people get ****ed at every turn.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Marmite is made here as are all the ingredients


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    It looks like Unilever has capitulated and for now at least, Tesco has won.
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    (Original post by paul514)
    Unilever are trying it on with a 10% increase without the reasoning to back it up and Tesco have rightly told them to do one.

    If it were 5% and a review on a monthly basis then there would probably be no argument

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    Monthly reviews would be awful for Tesco, they'd have to pass on every price increase and fall. Retailers like Tesco ideally want a fixed price for as long as possible with their supplier because they more or less pass the low supply margins to customer and profit from volume.

    I was surprised that they never met in the middle though.

    (Original post by Captain Haddock)
    Don't worry guys, Rakas21 doesn't like these brands, so this is fine. Everything's fine.
    Indeed. Gold help them if they ever try take my HP sauce off the shelves though, we may have to go to war with the Netherlands.

    (Original post by Davij038)
    No I'm pointing out another example of how batshit deluded politics in the west in general is gettting.

    We were told by vote Leave that prices will be cheaper and that there would be no real economic impact and further more that people were not only wrong but lying when they said otherwise (Leave.EU for all of its faults should be commended for its honesty on this point),

    Now this and other examples have shown that there will probably be s few bumps on the road and instead of some contrition brexiters are now either blaming remainers or saying it's all a good thing.


    When the lib dems promised free tuition fees and were unable to provide it people went mad at them for doing anything to get into power. When Vote Leave does the same thing brexiters start blameing others.

    If you think it's good that we have a massively devalued currency, lower investment and possibly face higher food bills fine make that argument. But these were arguments used by remain which have turned out to be correct rather than project fear and we haven't even left the bloody thing yet.
    To be fair, these people were/are being unrealistic and people were idiots if they believed them.

    Unfortunately for the Remain camp, the majority of those still whining (even on here) actually never bothered to read the documents from which they parrot some of the media scare stories, hence they've made no progress in convincing people they were wrong to vote Brexit.

    (Original post by mojojojo101)
    1) alienating, then destroying the farming industry that various leave campaigners said they would protect, also could make the UK weaker in that it would near totally reliant on imports for all food.

    2) So all dairy farmers will move over to vergtable production? Regardless of land, cost and other barriers that would prevent them from doing so. Plus then we'll just end up with low milk production and the price of milk will go up, way up (or will have to import a highly perishable good, most likely from the EU).

    3) Not a fan of the 'Britain is full' idea but the idea that the UK is suddenly going to set up thousand acre, highly automated meat factories is pretty ridiculous.

    Ont he issue at hand I have precisely 0 sympathy with Tesco. They and other supermarkets have bullied producers smaller than them for years, paying prices hat are fundamentally unfair and unsustainable so that they can sell products like milk at a loss. Now a bigger company has turned up and started pushing them around and suddenly they don't like it? Pathetic. That's capitalist economies for you though, you get to bully everyone smaller than you until someone else turns up to bully you, meanwhile ordinary people get ****ed at every turn.
    Not all. The whole point about milk producers selling at a loss is that across the EU there is an oversupply of milk and subsidies allow them to maintain production. In a competitive economy responding to price signals we would see milk production fall only in so far as margins were near zero (but not negative).

    I must admit that i did think this too. Although oligopolists are not always bad, Tesco does abuse its market power in the supply chain especially.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    It looks like Unilever has capitulated and for now at least, Tesco has won.
    Thats just one battle, the tide of inflation can't be halted.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    Thats just one battle, the tide of inflation can't be halted.
    You're right it won't be halted it will probably be around 5%


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    (Original post by Davij038)
    No I'm pointing out another example of how batshit deluded politics in the west in general is gettting.

    We were told by vote Leave that prices will be cheaper and that there would be no real economic impact and further more that people were not only wrong but lying when they said otherwise (Leave.EU for all of its faults should be commended for its honesty on this point),

    Now this and other examples have shown that there will probably be s few bumps on the road and instead of some contrition brexiters are now either blaming remainers or saying it's all a good thing.

    When the lib dems promised free tuition fees and were unable to provide it people went mad at them for doing anything to get into power. When Vote Leave does the same thing brexiters start blameing others.

    If you think it's good that we have a massively devalued currency, lower investment and possibly face higher food bills fine make that argument. But these were arguments used by remain which have turned out to be correct rather than project fear and we haven't even left the bloody thing yet.
    So Unilever has now resolved this issue with Tesco and nothing has actually surfaced from the media hysteria. Marmite is 100% made in Britain so honestly have no idea why you're equating with this Brexit. Yes, we will experience some minor inflation due to the weak pound, but for crying out loud this is incredibly short-term.

    Funny how you're saying Leave lied about lower food prices. If you understood anything about the common external tariff you would clearly know lower food prices would be an inevitably once we're outside and free to trade at world prices, not inflated prices in a protectionist customs union.

    Short-term inflation caused by currency speculation < long-term benefits of lower prices caused by free trade.
 
 
 
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