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    Help get the petition off the ground:

    https://www.change.org/p/tony-blair-...edium=copylink
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    done
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    I sort of liked Blair. Dunno why he gets so much ****.
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    I miss the good old days.

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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    I miss the good old days.

    At least Blair only fraternised with monsters for good reasons, like persuading them to give up their nuclear weapons. Corbyn accepted payments for appearing on the state TV station of a regime which routinely executes gays on cranes and achieved precisely nothing in doing so.
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    (Original post by Fenice)
    At least Blair only fraternised with monsters for good reasons, like persuading them to give up their nuclear weapons. Corbyn accepted payments for appearing on the state TV station of a regime which routinely executes gays on cranes and achieved precisely nothing in doing so.
    Plus Blair got to airmail women and children prisoners to Gaddafi for torture, Corbyn didn't even get **close** to that level of achievement.
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    I quite liked Blair until I found out he had advised on how to spin a massacre carried out by the dictatorship of Kazakhstan. If he admitted he made a mistake with Iraq then I think he would be redeemed in the eyes of many.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Plus Blair got to airmail women and children prisoners to Gaddafi for torture, Corbyn didn't even get **close** to that level of achievement.
    Provide your source
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Plus Blair got to airmail women and children prisoners to Gaddafi for torture, Corbyn didn't even get **close** to that level of achievement.
    I don't have a dog in this fight 'cos I'm a Tory but joking aside, how can you compare them? Blair served, whether you like him or not, 10 years as a PM, his CV is long. Corbyn has yet to wield political power and it is highly likely that he never will
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    (Original post by usainlightning)
    I quite liked Blair until I found out he had advised on how to spin a massacre carried out by the dictatorship of Kazakhstan. If he admitted he made a mistake with Iraq then I think he would be redeemed in the eyes of many.
    Is there any evidence that he explicitly advised on 'how to spin a massacre'? It seems that he was advising them in an economic capacity
    A spokeswoman for Blair said TBA’s work in Mangystau involved “no comms [communications] element.”She said he was hired to “help build capacity to attract investment and improve accountability as Mangystau sought to deliver better services for its citizens.” -RT
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    Blair was Dubya's *****.
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    A Labour Party that wasn't an laughing stock lead by a joke of a man and which presided over an economy where getting a job was a piece of piss, where the NHS was funded like a rapper funds their bling collection, when the minimum wage was introduced, them getting elected was as inevitable as the sun rising and some Labourites are against it? No wonder their party is getting killed these days.
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    (Original post by Fenice)
    Provide your source
    You've obviously never heard about Blair's little hatchet man Jack Straw using MI6 to rendite people to Gaddafi as part of the oil-for-bombs package then.
    http://www.reprieve.org.uk/press/uk-...it-with-facts/

    Of course they deny it, but then they would, wouldn't they.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    You've obviously never heard about Blair's little hatchet man Jack Straw using MI6 to rendite people to Gaddafi as part of the oil-for-bombs package then.
    http://www.reprieve.org.uk/press/uk-...it-with-facts/

    Of course they deny it, but then they would, wouldn't they.
    As per usual you come to shock value conclusions with only the faintest and most tenuous circumstantial evidence

    'Of course they deny it, but then they would, wouldn't they' is not persuasive
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    (Original post by Fenice)
    As per usual you come to shock value conclusions with only the faintest and most tenuous circumstantial evidence

    'Of course they deny it, but then they would, wouldn't they' is not persuasive
    Oh stop. It's been a major story for years and there has been abundant evidence.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-torture-libya

    The fact that Straw and Blair deny involvement is just typical of them basically. The head of MI6 at the time has repeatedly stated that it was ordered by Straw and Straw would not have acted alone.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Oh stop. It's been a major story for years and there has been abundant evidence.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-torture-libya

    The fact that Straw and Blair deny involvement is just typical of them basically. The head of MI6 at the time has repeatedly stated that it was ordered by Straw and Straw would not have acted alone.
    So far you have failed to properly evidence all of your claims, including the last one
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    (Original post by Fenice)
    So far you have failed to properly evidence all of your claims, including the last one
    I can't read the reports for you.

    If you do want to take the time, can I recommend this article in the Herald about the men and their families rendited to Libya by MI6 under Blair/Straw.
    http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1...a__39_s_gulag/
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    I can't read the reports for you.

    If you do want to take the time, can I recommend this article in the Herald about the men and their families rendited to Libya by MI6 under Blair/Straw.
    http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1...a__39_s_gulag/
    You can't, but if you are debating an issue and you make certain claims, it is traditional to expect you to provide some clear, direct evidence to support what you are saying. You have failed to do this because the evidence does not exist, as this article itself admits:

    'Last week after more than four years of Scotland Yard investigations, and months of agonising within the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) it was decided that there was insufficient evidence to convict any British minister or intelligence officers, among them former chief MI6 officer Sir Mark Allen'
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    (Original post by Fenice)
    You can't, but if you are debating an issue and you make certain claims, it is traditional to expect you to provide some clear, direct evidence to support what you are saying. You have failed to do this because the evidence does not exist.

    Blair makes deal with Gaddafi.

    Shortly afterwards, MI6 flies people across the globe that had previously escaped Gaddafi's clutches, sending them and their families to his cruel torture machine.

    Do you need a personal sworn testimony from Blair and Straw admitting it? Good luck with that.

    What I don't understand is how these MI6 people can sleep at night.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Blair makes deal with Gaddafi.

    Shortly afterwards, MI6 flies people across the globe that had previously escaped Gaddafi's clutches, sending them and their families to his cruel torture machine.

    Do you need a personal sworn testimony from Blair and Straw admitting it? Good luck with that.
    Not necessarily.

    Scotland Yard and the CPS conducted a thorough investigation and came to the conclusion that there wasn't enough evidence to mount any charges against any ministers or intelligence officers. After several years, nothing has changed. In the Wikileaks age, you are decided that a vast conspiracy between the top of government, the intelligence services and a foreign and utterly incompetent regime which has now been replaced by another has been miraculously successful in containing itself.

    Gaddafi was capable of the most absurdly fantastical claims. You are also implicitly suggesting that he voluntarily kept the very damaging information that Britain had broken international human rights laws loyally to himself when She had not only abandoned support for him but was actively bombing his army from the air. It is an absurd suggestion to anyone who has even a passing awareness of his personality.

    Your gut instinct is not more reliable than the English justice system.
 
 
 
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