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Labour are now the party of capital watch

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    Capital generally wants to stay in the single market (it wanted to stay in the EU). Yet the Tories are now sticking two fingers up to capital with this obsession with immigration and right wing populism.
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    It mightn't be obvious to some of the population, because only Lab would actually re-introduce trade union rights et al. Tories I'm sure would taxpayer subsidise more businesses than Labour, who would probably be more rigorous in the tax sense. Long term yes, they would be, though the public will not realise it.
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    Labour FTW
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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    It mightn't be obvious to some of the population, because only Lab would actually re-introduce trade union rights et al. Tories I'm sure would taxpayer subsidise more businesses than Labour, who would probably be more rigorous in the tax sense. Long term yes, they would be, though the public will not realise it.
    So in other words, want business? Vote Tory. Want tax and less business? Vote Labour, But then we already knew that.

    Also, loled at the "I am more wizened than the ignorant plebs" remark.
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    as a Labour MP said on the wireless this morning

    "Even North Korea has access to the single market"
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    The issue is that even if a Labour government would result in access to the single market, all that would be left to access the single market is a smoking wreck of an economy.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    So in other words, want business? Vote Tory.
    Business wants single market access. That is looking less and less likely under the Tories.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    So in other words, want business? Vote Tory. Want tax and less business? Vote Labour, But then we already knew that.

    Also, loled at the "I am more wizened than the ignorant plebs" remark.
    Its all about priorities, I'd imagine Tories would be quite laissez faire with tariffs as long as it business. Labour on the other hand would promote workers rights that businesses would seek to ignore. Want to see in work benefits fall? Great, go the Toy way.

    The entire referendum was idiotic because there were no solid plans, now we sit here guessing about what we'll do next. Tories benefit from short termism, you know, the pension reform, the post office sell off, the front loaded NHS funding, right to buy (since i doubt stock will be replenished fully)

    And it depends, the lay person who doesnt follow politics? Yeah i imagine i do. People who support based on headlines? Yeah i imagine i do. I think you're overstating the ability of the public to critically analyse.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    So in other words, want business? Vote Tory. Want tax and less business? Vote Labour, But then we already knew that.

    Also, loled at the "I am more wizened than the ignorant plebs" remark.
    Businesses love the single market, the tories want to leave it...

    Also the tories don't reduce tax, they just shift it to VAT which hits the poor hardest.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Capital generally wants to stay in the single market (it wanted to stay in the EU). Yet the Tories are now sticking two fingers up to capital with this obsession with immigration and right wing populism.
    Generally policies help more than rhetoric. Looking at the political landscape Labour is going to be out of power until after Brexit. They can go on and on about the single market, but if there is not an election before the negotiations finish it is all irrelevant.
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    Firms wanting something is not a reason to do so.

    Labour are the party of the capital however for many people in the country, that's reason enough for their thoughts on Labour to be vindicated.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Business wants single market access. That is looking less and less likely under the Tories.
    How would you describe Putin's economics? He seems hard to pin down as being either necessarily right or left wing.
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    Every second they become more unelectable... you can't win a GE if you go against the wish of 17 million people. out means out.
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    (Original post by richardhello)
    Every second they become more unelectable... you can't win a GE if you go against the wish of 17 million people. out means out.
    You absolutely can win an election when 17million people wont vote for you. Realistically you need about 35% of people who turn up to vote for you, that, if you cant work it out, is significantly less than 17 million.


    Also, the premise of the thread is ridiculous, Labour has been the party of Capital, if slightly less so than the Tories, for quite some time now. Unless Im supposed to believe that the neo-liberal economic policies pursued during the Blair/Brown years was all in the interest of the working man... pssh.
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    (Original post by mojojojo101)
    You absolutely can win an election when 17million people wont vote for you. Realistically you need about 35% of people who turn up to vote for you, that, if you cant work it out, is significantly less than 17 million.
    Due to the turnout of the referendum being high this is categorically not true. Conservatives got 11 million votes in 2015 which was 37%, if Labour immediately totally alienate 17 million votes they have no chance.
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    (Original post by DziNe)
    Due to the turnout of the referendum being high this is categorically not true. Conservatives got 11 million votes in 2015 which was 37%, if Labour immediately totally alienate 17 million votes they have no chance.
    A good chunk of that 17 million where never going to vote Labour anyway, another significant proportion will likely not turnout. All Labour need to do is make sure a low enough proportion of that 17 million vote not only against them but also against the Tory government such as to split that wide enough that they have the biggest party.

    Do I think the Labour party can do it? Of course not, I just reject the notion that they absolutely need all those 17 million votes or even a large portion of them.
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    (Original post by mojojojo101)
    A good chunk of that 17 million where never going to vote Labour anyway, another significant proportion will likely not turnout. All Labour need to do is make sure a low enough proportion of that 17 million vote not only against them but also against the Tory government such as to split that wide enough that they have the biggest party.

    Do I think the Labour party can do it? Of course not, I just reject the notion that they absolutely need all those 17 million votes or even a large portion of them.
    I suspect the turnout in the next election will be one of the highest in a very long time, especially if there is an early election called.
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    (Original post by mojojojo101)
    You absolutely can win an election when 17million people wont vote for you. Realistically you need about 35% of people who turn up to vote for you, that, if you cant work it out, is significantly less than 17 million.


    Also, the premise of the thread is ridiculous, Labour has been the party of Capital, if slightly less so than the Tories, for quite some time now. Unless Im supposed to believe that the neo-liberal economic policies pursued during the Blair/Brown years was all in the interest of the working man... pssh.
    A lot of those who sell their labour to capital have a self interest in protecting capital and keeping the system going. Labour can represent those who sell labour and have an interest in keeping capitalism going. The working class generally do not have the desire to overthrow capitalism. Labour represents this.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Labour are the party of the capital
    and Manchester, Leeds, Liverpool and so on. So basically they are the party of the places where everything useful actually happens.


    (Original post by Aj12)
    Generally policies help more than rhetoric.
    No they don't. Policies are useless unless you can package them in a nice rhetorical package. If you have good rhetoric you don;t even need good policies. Leave winning was a good example of this.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    and Manchester, Leeds, Liverpool and so on. So basically they are the party of the places where everything useful actually happens.




    No they don't. Policies are useless unless you can package them in a nice rhetorical package. If you have good rhetoric you don;t even need good policies. Leave winning was a good example of this.
    They can package all they like, but if their policies are made irrelevant by reality, what then?

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