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Should sharia zones be allowed if they fund their own police and courts?

This poll is closed

Should sharia zones be allowed if the fund their own police?

Yes, it could save money 4%
No, our existing police should police all areas 94%
It would a good idea but unrealistic 2%
Not sure0%
Total votes: 49
There has been a lot of call for sharia zones in some areas. If it's going to help ease tensions in some areas then maybe its a good idea. But there should be conditions.

If they want their own laws then they should fund their own police force and law courts.
Our own police are facing major cuts from government and why should they be stretched even further policing areas which want to have their own laws. That would free up police to police other areas.

What are your opinions, would it save money and be mutually beneficial to everyone?

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Original post by Ambitious1999
If it's going to help ease tensions in some areas


I don't think subjecting everyone in a select area to a backwards medieval legal system will 'ease tensions'
Original post by Ambitious1999
There has been a lot of call for sharia zones in some areas. If it's going to help ease tensions in some areas then maybe its a good idea. But there should be conditions.

If they want their own laws then they should fund their own police force and law courts.
Our own police are facing major cuts from government and why should they be stretched even further policing areas which want to have their own laws. That would free up police to police other areas.

What are your opinions, would it save money and be mutually beneficial to everyone?


That it's yet another rdiculous thread by you. This is the UK,. The laws of the land apply to all people. It would be corrosive, devisive an a very silly idea.


Update



Ok ambitious1999 you rank right at the top for starting this sort of thread. You are either dim, an idiot or just a troll because you always do this.

Sorry mods, but there is only so much of this garbage we should have to put up with and as its consistent from this poster, then I doubt their intentions are to engage in genuine discussion but more to annoy people i.e. a troll.

1. There has been a call for Sharia zones? Who would that be from? Source? Are these people living in the UK and are they UK citizens? If so, then why should they have a different set of laws? I do not mind Sharia law where it allowed to exist and submits to the superiority of UK law, but no for a separate system of Sharia law. There is not a call for it and I believe it would be massively opposed by the rest of the UK.

2. Why would it ease tensions? It’s more likely to inflame tensions massively as these so called UK citizens , who live in the UK and take advantage of everything the UK has to offer) then decide they don’t wish to live by the laws of the country they live in. Muslims are a minority who have been permitted to come to the UK. Not all Muslims want Shania law. Virtually all other citizens would be appalled at the thought of a Shania police force in their country.

It would make all the ideas about being invaded and non integration seem real and there would be serious trouble.

3. It wouldn’t work. It is fundamentally wrong in principle. We should all submit to the law of the UK and not Islam. You don’t explain how it would work when the two laws are in conflict.

What would happen where a Sharia policeman said there had been a crime but UK law said there was not?

What would happen where UK law said there had been a crime but Sharia law said not?

Who would Sharia law apply to? Would it be Muslims, all Muslims, just those who volunteered?

What would happen where a Sharia policeman tried to arrest a non Muslim for committing a crime? That simply would not be allowed to happen.

What would happen where a Muslim who decided Sharia law applied was given protection by the Sharia system against the UK police and law? It wouldn’t happen.

It is completely unworkable.

4. You then go on to talk about it would fund itself, but in post 30 you talk about via government grants. There certainly would be no central government funding for a UK Sharia police force. We have one police force in this country and one law, which is applied according to the rule of law to all people who decide they are UK citizens and live here. You haven’t proved it would be viable or that it could fund itself.

If they want another system of law, refuse to accept UK law, then they should leave and find another country to live in.

5. You then talk about it being the equivalent to BTP? BTP have a very limited role. They still apply the law of the UK and the same court system.

6. You then talk about having a different court system. How do you expect it to enforce its judgments? What about jails? No UK police and no other UK citizen would pay a blind bit of notice. Any Muslim who didn’t want to be bound by Sharia law could say so and seek the protection of UK law. Not really very effective.

So yes it was yet another idiotic/ troll thread by you ambitious1999, the same as surrendering to ISIS because we were losing that you were spouting earlier on this year. Yes you managed to irritate me because it was intentional or you fail to appreciate why some people are annoyed with certain aspects of Muslim integration. It is still the UK with one police force and one set of laws. People who don’t wish to respect that should leave and find a country with laws they are happier with.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Ambitious1999


What are your opinions, would it save money and be mutually beneficial to everyone?


The cost is immaterial. We cannot have two sets of laws operating.

Let's say I, a male, walk through town, dressed in a Jesus and Mo tee shirt while periodically swigging from a can of ale, kissing my boyfriend and holding his hand and listening to music (quietly) on my ghettoblaster while negotiating a loan and placing some bets on my mobile phone. None of these things is illegal in England.

I inadvertently walk into one of your sharia zones and am hoicked off to face all sorts punishments by the wowsers.

The idea is unworkable, unjust, not conducive to clarity, damaging to community relations and completely unacceptable. And that is without mentioning the enormous and anachronistic step backwards it would be to have the criminal law in twenty-first century England controlled by mediaeval (foreign) superstitions.
No.The fact that certain people come here and try to set up their own courts just shows an unwillingness to integrate with the locals.
Original post by Robby2312
No.The fact that certain people come here and try to set up their own courts just shows an unwillingness to integrate with the locals.


I agree with this.

The notion being put forward by the OP is dangerous and plain stupid. It wont ease anything.

Do you even know what sharia law is like? Archaic ethics and morals. Outdated and ineffective. It simply doesn't sense to have 13th century (assuming I've got the century right) ideas in the 21st century.
Ok sure. I am pretty rich, i am going to set up a Nazi law zone.

No jewish people
Only Aryans
Homosexuals will be removed
Only white people
No arabs.
disabled people are killed.


I am sure you are perfectly ok with this brilliant idea.
Original post by Robby2312
No.The fact that certain people come here and try to set up their own courts just shows an unwillingness to integrate with the locals.


Not necessarily. having your own dispute resolution systems is fine as long as it is consistent with UK law. All sorts of organisations have their own systems, which are an alternative to going to the courts.

This proposal seems to want to give Sharia law parity to UK law.

Ambitious 1999 is being silly yet again and they are unable to see the difficulties and fundamental problems such a move would have. It would be unworkable and unacceptable.
No.
Hell no.
Original post by 999tigger
Not necessarily. having your own dispute resolution systems is fine as long as it is consistent with UK law. All sorts of organisations have their own systems, which are an alternative to going to the courts.

This proposal seems to want to give Sharia law parity to UK law.

Ambitious 1999 is being silly yet again and they are unable to see the difficulties and fundamental problems such a move would have. It would be unworkable and unacceptable.


But the fact that they want sharia courts at all suggests that they think there is something wrong with uk law.Otherwise why would you need your own courts? I think it does show an unwillgness to integrate though.Uk law isn't good enough they need their own laws.Our non halal method of slaughter isn't ok for them so an exception has to be made for them.Its not ok when religous beliefs come before animal rights as animals can be definitively proven to exist.Exceptions shouldn't be made for religions.
Original post by Robby2312
No.The fact that certain people come here and try to set up their own courts just shows an unwillingness to integrate with the locals.

I completely agree :yy:
Is this what counts as an intelligent discussion on TSR these days? Lmao i was like lmao.
Reply 13
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viffer
16
As stupid questions go .....

Spoiler

Original post by Robby2312
But the fact that they want sharia courts at all suggests that they think there is something wrong with uk law.Otherwise why would you need your own courts? I think it does show an unwillgness to integrate though.Uk law isn't good enough they need their own laws.Our non halal method of slaughter isn't ok for them so an exception has to be made for them.Its not ok when religous beliefs come before animal rights as animals can be definitively proven to exist.Exceptions shouldn't be made for religions.


No it doesnt. It means UK law is flexible enough to allow (where it sees fit) people to be bound by a set of rules they consent to, as long as they are legal.
Perhaps you were a tad too ambitious with this one mate.
Original post by Ambitious1999
There has been a lot of call for sharia zones in some areas. If it's going to help ease tensions in some areas then maybe its a good idea. But there should be conditions.

If they want their own laws then they should fund their own police force and law courts.
Our own police are facing major cuts from government and why should they be stretched even further policing areas which want to have their own laws. That would free up police to police other areas.

What are your opinions, would it save money and be mutually beneficial to everyone?


Absolutely not; this is the UK, we already have our own legal system and set of laws. If the muslim community doesn't like our laws, they should take themselves off somewhere where Sharia is enshrined in the legal system
Lol no, adhere to the present laws. :colonhash:
I want my own area of law on my property, and I am willing to be the judge and the court can be my bedroom. I have many tensions with others in the neighbourhood, so allowing me to have my own laws is a good idea, right?

Don't be ridiculous, the laws of this country apply to all equally. If they don't want to abide by British law then they should consider moving to a country more suited to their backward ideas.
But there are countries where two systems operate.
1) Singapore has sharia courts
2) The Indonesian island of Sumatra has sharia areas despite Indonesia being a largely Buddhist Christian and Hindu country.
3) Russian Republic of Czechen Ickeria has an Islamic based legal system agreed between its president and President Putin. It was this that eased tensions and has encouraged the Czechens to remain part of Russia rather than declaring their own caliphate as they wanted in the 1990s.

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