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Obtaining a Graduate Actuarial Job in the US

Hi there,

I’ll start by setting the scene, I am a British Mathematics graduate (MMath) from a well respected university in the United Kingdom (Manchester), and I’m focussed on pursuing a career in actuarial work.

It has always been a dream of mine to pursue a career in the States, particularly New York City. Unfortunately, I am all too aware that this may not be entirely feasible at graduate level, partly due to fierce competition but also because of rather stringent visa regulations. However, I am trying to assess the merits of the idea of actually going to NYC, getting all suited and booted, taking my resume along to as many relevant companies as possible, and trying to arrange informal interviews. I have heard this has been done for investment banking, could it possibly work in the actuarial arena? Of course, I would also try to arrange as many interviews as possible before leaving for NYC.

I’m hoping this would demonstrate initiative and commitment to achieving my ambitions, and that US employers would be impressed by this.

Assuming there are no, or very little, financial constraints, what do you think of this idea?

Is there anything in particular you would suggest I do, and if you have any other advice you feel might be pertinent, I would warmly welcome it.

I have actually done some summer work in the US before, and I also have distant relatives who live in New Jersey, which may alleviate any potential concerns employers may have vis-à-vis my ability to handle moving to, and living in, NYC.

Please do be as candid as possible. I really don’t care if you rubbish the idea - I want realistic advice.

I do realise you may not have any idea of the US market and I apologise for this, however, your opinions are probably going to be more informed than mine.

I would be extremely grateful for any feedback whatsoever.

Thank you

Reply 1

PortfolioManager

7

Aspiring Actuary

. However, I am trying to assess the merits of the idea of actually going to NYC, getting all suited and booted, taking my resume along to as many relevant companies as possible and trying to arrange informal interviews.

You are better off emailing them and sending speculative applications. Do research on companies, email em and wait for the reply. Plus you will save money too.

Reply 2

defiantshrimp

There are a number of difficulties in getting a Grad Actuarial job in the US. The most obvious to me is that you don't have work authorisation and because of that a lot of employers won't touch you. I don't know personally how difficult it is to get a visa but I've heard stories. I reckon that if you show up in the US dropping in CVs without a work visa you won't get very far.

The second issue is that they have a different actuarial examination system. Unlike in the UK/Ireland they expect undergrads to have sat some of the entry level exams for the SOA/CAS (they have the same early exams) to show interest and committment and so on. Since you have not done this and I'm not sure it is possible to sit them from the UK that is a major hurdel.

In all I don't think it is a very good idea. My advice: if you qualify as an Actuary in the UK your qualification is transferable to the US (and Europe and almost everywhere else...). Do that and then either look for experienced Actuarial jobs in the US where they will sponsor you for a visa or do an MBA in the US and try the same thing. Since you have a mMath you should be able to finish the exams at the shorter end of the spectrum (3-4 years). Best of luck.

Reply 3

Aspiring Actuary

OP

PortfolioManager

You are better off emailing them and sending speculative applications. Do research on companies, email em and wait for the reply. Plus you will save money too.

Thanks for your reply. This is something, though, I have already done with a few NYC companies with actuarial expertise. I have had the odd reply but, unfortunately, it amounts to little more than the usual:

"Though your education and background are of value to us, we have no suitable vacancies commensurate of your background and experience at the moment. However, we will keep your resume on file should anything suitable arise in the near future."

I have always been an optimistic person, but I cannot foresee anything materialising from that, unfortunately.

Reply 4

Aspiring Actuary

OP

defiantshrimp

There are a number of difficulties in getting a Grad Actuarial job in the US. The most obvious to me is that you don't have work authorisation and because of that a lot of employers won't touch you. I don't know personally how difficult it is to get a visa but I've heard stories. I reckon that if you show up in the US dropping in CVs without a work visa you won't get very far.

The second issue is that they have a different actuarial examination system. Unlike in the UK/Ireland they expect undergrads to have sat some of the entry level exams for the SOA/CAS (they have the same early exams) to show interest and committment and so on. Since you have not done this and I'm not sure it is possible to sit them from the UK that is a major hurdel.

In all I don't think it is a very good idea. My advice: if you qualify as an Actuary in the UK your qualification is transferable to the US (and Europe and almost everywhere else...). Do that and then either look for experienced Actuarial jobs in the US where they will sponsor you for a visa or do an MBA in the US and try the same thing. Since you have a mMath you should be able to finish the exams at the shorter end of the spectrum (3-4 years). Best of luck.

Thanks for your input; I do actually have a dilemma. Due to some of the Statistics and Financial Mathematics modules I have studied whilst at university, I am highly likely to be exempt form certain actuarial examinations from the Institute of Actuaries here in the UK. If these exemptions did come into fruition, these examination passes could then be converted to credits in the US system (SOA or CAS), as I know they are directly transferable. This would obviously make me a slightly more appealing prospect to US employers, whether it would be a crucial determining factor however, I have no idea.

Now, this is where my dilemma arises. In order to obtain these exemptions, I would need to pay some rather exorbitant membership and exemptions fees to the Institute of Actuaries. The whole process would also take several weeks. The money isn't a major, major problem, but assuming this whole US pipedream of mine didn't materialise, and I found employment in the UK instead, I would much rather have saved all that money, as any future employer in the UK would pay all relevant fees to the Institute.

I'm hoping that my very presence in NYC would demonstrate to employers that I have at least some commitment to pursuing an actuarial career and, consequently, not having these examination credits would become more of a secondary concern.

Thank you for your advice; I just pray you’re wrong, LOL.

Reply 5

La Haine

2

I was under the impression that exemptions from actuary exams isn't always an advantage as firms have to pay the ones with exemptions more and some firms would actually prefer them to do the exams whilst working for them.

Reply 6

Mustard-man

18

La Haine - Saïd

I was under the impression that exemptions from actuary exams isn't always an advantage as firms have to pay the ones with exemptions more and some firms would actually prefer them to do the exams whilst working for them.

Nah, a few exemptions is okay. Also, like you said, it's some firms who prefer to train from near-scratch. The most popular first degree to get into the Actuarial profession (in 2005) was/is Maths (Actuaries.org.uk stats). BSc alone may offer one or two exemption. I don't think a Maths Masters would give that much more, but of course it would depend on the course content. There are something like 16(?) professional exams. Someone coming from a BSc Actuarial Science degree alone would get more exemption - up to full 8 CT exemption, that's nearly half, though admitedly the later exams are tougher. So some firms may not like people having the 'knowledge', but little experience to apply with, so they may not be keen on paying these people a sum which is of that level, and would rather pay more to those who have reached that level through proper training. But yeah, I think he's okay with MMaths (at least in the UK :p:

)

Reply 7

defiantshrimp

Aspiring Actuary

If these exemptions did come into fruition, these examination passes could then be converted to credits in the US system (SOA or CAS), as I know they are directly transferable. This would obviously make me a slightly more appealing prospect to US employers, whether it would be a crucial determining factor however, I have no idea.

You might have difficulty in converting credits, especially if they are credits that you have not sat the actual exams for but rather were exempted from sitting. It doesn't sound like they would allow it, but that is only a guess.

Aspiring Actuary

I'm hoping that my very presence in NYC would demonstrate to employers that I have the commitment to pursue an actuarial career and, consequently, not having these examination credits would become a secondary concern.

I doubt very much that your presence in NYC will signal anything significant. It costs very little to fly to NY and start handing out CVs and I can't see how it shows you are committed to anything more than... well showing up in NYC and handing out CVs, let alone a wish to be an Actuary. Why would people bother sitting exams if they could just show up and demonstrate there committment?

There is no point at all showing up in NYC (unless you want a holiday). Just apply to jobs there via the internet, like everyone else. And hope that someone will hire you and sponsor you for a work permit. If they won't, then showing up at the doorstep won't make them change their minds. In the meantime also apply to UK firms that have no work authorisation issues.

Reply 8

Aspiring Actuary

OP

defiantshrimp

You might have difficulty in converting credits, especially if they are credits that you have not sat the actual exams for but rather were exempted from sitting. It doesn't sound like they would allow it, but that is only a guess.

I have had this explicitly confirmed by the Institute, converting exemptions to the US system will, fortunately, not pose any problem.

defiantshrimp

I doubt very much that your presence in NYC will signal anything significant. It costs very little to fly to NY and start handing out CVs and I can't see how it shows you are committed to anything more than... well showing up in NYC and handing out CVs, let alone a wish to be an Actuary. Why would people bother sitting exams if they could just show up and demonstrate there committment?

There is no point at all showing up in NYC (unless you want a holiday). Just apply to jobs there via the internet, like everyone else. And hope that someone will hire you and sponsor you for a work permit. If they won't, then showing up at the doorstep won't make them change their minds. In the meantime also apply to UK firms that have no work authorisation issues.

I don’t know if it’s just me, but I’m detecting a hint too much scepticism and incredulity in the perspective from which you are coming. I am, and I hope other people are, of the opinion that showing up in the Big Apple, looking immaculately dressed, being incredibly well informed of the actuarial industry and specific company (research), will serve as a positive indicator of my commitment to pursue the said career in the US. Flying to NYC, still puts a hole in your wallet too, LOL.

Another potential problem, that turning up in NYC alleviates, is that whilst employers may be impressed with one's academic background and experience, they may have strong reservations about paying to fly that person over to the US for an interview. In fact, this is something a US recruiter explicitly told me.

And yes, I would also use part of the trip to enjoy a well deserved holiday, LOL.

Reply 9

defiantshrimp

Sorry if I came off a bit blunt! It's good to hear that you can carry over the exemptions, that should help. Best of luck with the trip.

Reply 10

Aspiring Actuary

OP

defiantshrimp

Sorry if I came off a bit blunt! It's good to hear that you can carry over the exemptions, that should help. Best of luck with the trip.

LOL, that's ok. I'm not even certain if I'm going yet, still weighing up the pros and cons. If I am recommended to obtain the exemptions first, then I might not being going for at least several weeks. In the mean time, I do have an assessment day with AXA next week - if I’m successful, problem solved. Believe it or not, that is actually the 6th assessment centre I’ve managed to get to, but still no job. :eek:

Reply 11

SweenDogg

Hi 'Aspring Actuary',

Reading through your post from a few years ago I notice that I am in a similar position myself. I am about to enter my final year of university studying for a degree in Actuarial Science.

As was the case with yourself, I would very much like the opportunity to work in the USA however from doing some a small amount of research I realise this may not be feasible given the visa/work restrictions in the USA.

However I am curious what you decided to do in the end and how it worked out for you i.e. did you manage to secure employment in the states?

Kind regards

Reply 12

jasonlui

You can not get a work visa without a company signing you on. I think the best thing to do is email the companies first and follow up with phone calls. I recall my boss saying that he would be more impressed with someone who turned up but it's going to cost you money to stay in NY without a job.

NYC is a great city, good luck.

Obtaining a Graduate Actuarial Job in the US

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