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    Randdom,

    You are correct about the right of those people to vote and effect change. What I don't like are ignorant, racist fools like Biggles who struggle to understand the most simple of foreign policy issues.
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    You are correct about the right of those people to vote and effect change. What I don't like are ignorant, racist fools like Biggles who struggle to understand the most simple of foreign policy issues.
    I agree with you there
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    I've just noticed that the US really should tell those who criticize us to stop being stupid. I have dual American/British citizenship and have lived in England all my life. I am currently working on John Kerry’s presidential team and have realized the hypocrisy of European arguments about the USA. We (the USA) have liberated Iraq and Afghanistan and even though 25,000 civilians are dead (which is terrible) 50 million people are free. Afghanis are about to vote for the first time, Iraqis are rebuilding schools and democratic institutions and potentially millions have been saved from murder in the future by Saddam or the Taliban or in the US or UK by Al Qaeda. Apparently though, this is bad!! Currently Sudan is left at the hands of murdering thugs and yet the UN is too afraid to even impose a threat of force! Only the US is arguing for military assistance and is ignored by the rest of the world! In terms of farm subsidies, the US offered to cut all of theirs worth $120 billion and huge political expense. The Europeans only agreed to a part way plan to protect their own interests. If America was listened to here we could save millions of farmers in LEDC's and construct a fairer, safer world where all people have the opportunity for trade and prosperity free of fear.

    To the critics of America - look in the mirror, stop being dumb
    1) America is just as bad as Europe when it comes to subsidies. That has never changed. They harp on aobut free trade, and then wack tariffs on steel. The difference is that in the last 30 years they have realised they really can't do it anymore. The bigger the EU gets, the more bargaining power it has. Consortiums are growing all over the world in order to try and get bargaining power against the US. Any argument you can come up with declaring America as the saviour of the poor is utter *******s. (And I know Europe isn't perfect, what with the stupid subsidies to farmers.)

    2) You are so not on the Kerry tea. If you were you would know that America is certainly not pushing for action against Sudan. Indeed, the French troops training the Chad army (and now moving east to the border to protect the refugee camps) would beg to differ.

    3) "we (the USA)" well it's nice to know that you and not the Europeans are liberating left right and centre. However, you do note that the UK is part of Europe, as is Italy and Poland, and we've got a f*ckload of troops both actively in Afghanistan and Iraq. You may also note that Spain (again European) supported the war and paid for it dearly.

    4) '50 million free' please don't be kidding yourself. It sounds like 50million people in chains have been set free to do as they like. Where in fact its just as dangerous as ever, except now instead of corrupt/evil state officials its a multitude of bandits and armed factions. It will get better with time we hope, but the situation is not better at the moment.

    Even vienna I'm sure will not appreciate the unilateral declartion of the Us as a saviour

    J
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    Imagashead,

    thank you for having a brain. I'm sorry I don't have any links for the information you requested but I know they were widely reported in the US since 2002. On the topics of the ICC and Kyoto I disagree with you, yet I do respect that we have made some mistakes in Iraq and Afghanistan in terms of forces neccessary etc...
    Thank you for your compliment its much appreciated. I find it remarkable that someone on the 'Kerry campaign team' is unable to collaborate such apparently 'well-known' facts and also resorts to crude sarcastic comments when A) his question about why US foreign policy should be criticised is answered (surely the point of posing a question on a discussion forum is that people answer it - or maybe its just me) and B) elements of his argument are shown to be somewhat weak in the factual department. One can only wonder...
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    Imagashead,

    I was being serious! I disagree with u but I am willing to debate with someone like u about ICC, Kyoto etc who understands the issues. Biggles is the person who annoys me, not you. And I'm sorry I can't give u any facts to support my arguments, but I assure you from what I know they are reliable.
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    The war was one because the US manpower, technology and industrial superiority overwhelmed Germany and our huge support for Russia in WW2 (giving them tanks etc) paid off.
    Please, not this old line again. The US entered World War II because of Pearl Harbor, not to save European ass. They were rightly angry at the attack, but most of the US government would've quite happily seen Europe tear itself to shreds if America wasn't in any danger and it didn't have any adverse effects on the US economy. While other countries would probably have had the same stance, the USA is certainly not some great superhero that has a greater moral core than other countries. The US has consistently and continuously interefered in the runnings of other countries for its own benefit, and certainly not for ensuring the democracy and freedom of other nations (a good look at American corporations and American foreign policy in Africa for example will immediately confirm this). And the US's position on pollution is appalling. Bush didn't want the Kyoto protocol because he was considering the interests of "American business". But I suppose the price of electricity in Texas is more important than damage to the environment.
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    Now WW2 We should have got involved in 1939 I agree. But cowardice was not the reason we didn't. Americans thought Europe should sort themselves out. The RAF were excellent in the war but don't pretend they won the war. The war was one because the US manpower, technology and industrial superiority overwhelmed Germany and our huge support for Russia in WW2 (giving them tanks etc) paid off.
    I don't think that anyone can say that the USA won world war two because they didn't. A combination of Britian, Russia and America won world war two. No one can say what would have happend if America hadn't entered the war unless they are a fortune teller because they did enter the war. Russia played a huge part in World war two and lost many troups they kept the eastern frount going so they played and important role as did Britian. The war was won by a combination of countries and not just the USA.

    Cold War _ u would be speaking russian if it weren't for the US u ungrateful idiot.
    Again no one knows what would have happend if their had been no cold war but again I don't think that anyone can say with any cirtainty that Britain would have been taken over by the Russians after world war two or the Germans during world war two.
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    A combination of BritianRussia and America won world war two 
    I agree with you on that point.

    but there is no doubt to me that Germany would have beaten the UK in WW2 and Russia after if the US had not entered the war.
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    Hitler didn't actually want to invade Britain before World War 2 feeling that it had a right to its empire just as Germany had a right to its own from what I've read on the subject.
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    (Original post by USUK1)
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    A combination of BritianRussia and America won world war two 
    I agree with you on that point.

    but there is no doubt to me that Germany would have beaten the UK in WW2 and Russia after if the US had not entered the war.
    I just don't think that anyone can really be that sure because lots of things could have happened if America hadn't entered the war in both Europe and America. I mean in these situation we can What if forever. What if the Japaneas hadn't got it wronge and the whole navy had been in pearl harbour, what if people had listened to churchill and not appeased Hitler, what if there had been no Nazi-Soviet pack. The fact is that no one is ever going to be able to answer these questions so there is no point in speculating because it happend the way that it did and nothing will change that. So I don't think it is really fair to say that we would be speaking Russian or that we wouldn't have won ww2 without the USA because no one will ever know and tbh I am a bit sick of hearing people tell me that I would be speaking Russian/German.
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    (Original post by vienna)
    which crisis? the need for aid, the humanitarian crisis, the political response? or the barbary and gang rape and death camps of Islamic ethnic cleansing?
    The crisis in Sudan and all of it has been on the news. There was a report on newsnight which went into the attacks quite a lot a while back. However they obviously aren't going to go into loads of details about gang rape ect on the 6 o'clock news.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    The crisis in Sudan and all of it has been on the news. There was a report on newsnight which went into the attacks quite a lot a while back. However they obviously aren't going to go into loads of details about gang rape ect on the 6 o'clock news.
    much like the beheading of Nick Berg......did they spare any detail about Abu Ghraib?
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    Imagashead,

    I was being serious! I disagree with u but I am willing to debate with someone like u about ICC, Kyoto etc who understands the issues. Biggles is the person who annoys me, not you. And I'm sorry I can't give u any facts to support my arguments, but I assure you from what I know they are reliable.
    Okay, my apologies. Why do oppose the ICC and Kyoto?
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    I do not support Kyoto as I believe it leaves significant sovereign rights of business, environment and social policy in the hands of a foreign unelected body. Kyoto will not work unless it is universally agreed on and carried out. Currently no where near all of the signatories are abiding to the plan and in the US it would cost over $150 billion to American business. These costs are unrealistic both politically and economically and emphasize that the plan is not going to succeed in its objectives. However I do believe we need a climate control plan that is realistic and bold, but that also takes into account the need for reforms by American officials dictation and not those of foreigners. We must have a plan that is both possible to implement successfully and can attract and demand the support of the world. In this sense we can fully deal with the problem.

    The disagreement I have with the ICC is that it fails to place safeguards so that american forces will not be kidnapped without US authority and it places legal control of American forces under the UN, which I don't agree with. In another sense I am highly sceptical of its ability to punish war criminals quickly, effectively and cheaply.
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    (Original post by vienna95)
    much like the beheading of Nick Berg......did they spare any detail about Abu Ghraib?
    Yes they only refered to the pictures as containing disturbing images with vague discriptions on the news it was only in newsnight which is on a 10 that they went into loads of graphic detail about what went on. The pictures were blurred a lot in the earlier news due to their disturbing content.
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    I really couldnt care less about those who were in Abu Graid. I wish the yanks would have doent he world a favour and just killed them while they were at it. would of saved a whole lot of paper work and made the sport news come up much quicker on the BBC
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    I've just noticed that the US really should tell those who criticize us to stop being stupid. I have dual American/British citizenship and have lived in England all my life. I am currently working on John Kerry’s presidential team and have realized the hypocrisy of European arguments about the USA. We (the USA) have liberated Iraq and Afghanistan and even though 25,000 civilians are dead (which is terrible) 50 million people are free. Afghanis are about to vote for the first time, Iraqis are rebuilding schools and democratic institutions and potentially millions have been saved from murder in the future by Saddam or the Taliban or in the US or UK by Al Qaeda. Apparently though, this is bad!! Currently Sudan is left at the hands of murdering thugs and yet the UN is too afraid to even impose a threat of force! Only the US is arguing for military assistance and is ignored by the rest of the world! In terms of farm subsidies, the US offered to cut all of theirs worth $120 billion and huge political expense. The Europeans only agreed to a part way plan to protect their own interests. If America was listened to here we could save millions of farmers in LEDC's and construct a fairer, safer world where all people have the opportunity for trade and prosperity free of fear.

    To the critics of America - look in the mirror, stop being dumb
    Ahh, but Sudan doesnt have any oil fields.
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    I've just noticed that the US really should tell those who criticize us to stop being stupid. I have dual American/British citizenship and have lived in England all my life. I am currently working on John Kerry’s presidential team and have realized the hypocrisy of European arguments about the USA. We (the USA) have liberated Iraq and Afghanistan and even though 25,000 civilians are dead (which is terrible) 50 million people are free.
    Thanks for the support of our foreign policy. I agree with most of the things you have said, but I don't believe that the figure of 25,000 civilians dying is accurate. Many websites that keep track of these statistics define a civilian as a person that may or may not be wearing a uniform. The terrorists we are battling against aren't stupid enough to attack our soldiers wearing uniforms.
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    (Original post by USUK1)
    I am currently working on John Kerry’s presidential team and have realized the hypocrisy of European arguments about the USA. We (the USA) have liberated Iraq and Afghanistan and even though 25,000 civilians are dead (which is terrible) 50 million people are free.
    Freedom is a wonderful thing no doubt, the fact that I can walk into the street right now and start accusing Tony Blair of being a war mongerer, a homosexual, a liberal democrat, a capitalist, a communist, an illegitimate freemason, a scarecrow, a zionist, a black panther, a axe murderer etc without fear of being locked up in prison is one of the greatest things about western civilisation. However, freedom is not, I believe, the key aim of repressed and impoverished people around the world. There primary aim must surely be that they have food on the table, that they can leave the house without fearing for their lives, that they have a job that pays a decent wage and their children can go to school, the opportunity to take part in the development of a new bureaucracy will always be secondary to that. Bringing freedom to repressed peoples make wonderful election soundbites, where the reality is anarchy and danger freedom is at too high a cost.
    (Original post by USUK1)
    Afghanis are about to vote for the first time, Iraqis are rebuilding schools and democratic institutions and potentially millions have been saved from murder in the future by Saddam or the Taliban or in the US or UK by Al Qaeda. Apparently though, this is bad!!
    Afghansitan has been all but abandoned, Medecins sans frontiers, an organisation which for years has been operating in the most dangerous environments around the world, including the Former Yugoslavia, Chechnya, FYD Congo (and for the past twenty years Afghanstan) now believe that the situation in Afghanistan is too dangerous for their employees. More heroine is being produced by the country than ever before, Warlords have been handed control in many regions of the country, the elections have had to be postponed as the turmoil within is too great for an election, and the taliban are again begining to operate as a dangerous milita/terrorist faction.....progress to me at least, is almost entirely non-existant.
    (Original post by USUK1)
    Currently Sudan is left at the hands of murdering thugs and yet the UN is too afraid to even impose a threat of force! Only the US is arguing for military assistance and is ignored by the rest of the world!
    The US as of yet have merely branded the situation in Sudan as 'genocide' they are yet to impose any sanctions on the Khartoum government, and are unlikely to use a military force, the US military is already fully stretched with operations in Iraq and Afghanistan. The UN (of which the US is the most powerful nation) has been devastatingly slow to react, the problem in Sudan is set to spiral outof control as the winter rains look set to wipe out the possibility of any trasnportation in Dharfour, Cholera, Malaria and Rubellla endemics are thought to be only weeks away and the WHO currently has only 40% of the funds it requires to seriously try and prevent mass starvation, pointing to the differences in policy between the US and Europe is utterly irrelevant, both countries are failing to prevent a genocide, the US is unwilling to commit troops as the Situation in Iraq and Afghanistan continue to drag and in Europe opposition to Sanctions is led by the French and Chinese (yes I know they're not European) who have considerable oil interst in the country and Russia continues to sell the arms that the Janjaweed are using, it will require divisive and swift action to prevent absolute catastrophe in the region, and at the moment the willingness and strength to do this is lacking on both sides of the pond.
    (Original post by USUK1)
    In terms of farm subsidies, the US offered to cut all of theirs worth $120 billion and huge political expense. The Europeans only agreed to a part way plan to protect their own interests. If America was listened to here we could save millions of farmers in LEDC's and construct a fairer, safer world where all people have the opportunity for trade and prosperity free of fear.
    Its only because this is a serious situation that I dont answer this paragraph with a . The US continues to have the most oversubsidiesed agriculutral system in te world, dwarfing that of the EU, I am almost certain that you have made the $120 billion figure up as well, or at least found it on the web site of some right wing think tank. As the worlds richest nation it is the US responsibility to bring about change in the way in which other western nations treat these problems, but whilst self interest looms large in the US this looks about as likely as Nobel Prize for Peace being sent over to the White House antime soon.


    (Original post by USUK1)
    To the critics of America - look in the mirror, stop being dumb
    To the defenders of the US, try and rememeber that the word dumb means that someone lacks the ability to speak, using this as an argument againt actual critiscm, is in your words dumb.
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    I think Michael Moore should be put in charge. He is so intelligent and a worthwhile human*

    *not necessary my views - waiting for a caustic response
 
 
 
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