Thoughts on UK Muslims identifying themselves as Muslims, and not British?

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Dodgypirate
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Controversial topic, I may say.

I've been running my mind over this since the release of 'Muslims like us' on BBC2.
I can't remember who said it on the show - it might have been several people in fact - but it got me thinking:

1) Why would they consider themselves 'Muslim' and avoid the British identity?

2) Are they simply putting their faith first?

3) Does anyone on here identify as Muslim instead of British?



I may not be making myself clear enough, I'm a little tired
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Ciel.
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
Controversial topic, I may say.

I've been running my mind over this since the release of 'Muslims like us' on BBC2.
I can't remember who said it on the show - it might have been several people in fact - but it got me thinking:

1) Why would they consider themselves 'Muslim' and avoid the British identity?

2) Are they simply putting their faith first?

3) Does anyone on here identify as Muslim instead of British?



I may not be making myself clear enough, I'm a little tired
How dumb is that? Why confuse religion with nationality?
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by Ciel.)
How dumb is that? Why confuse religion with nationality?

It's almost as they don't want any association with the UK...

I don't call myself a British Agnostic :lol:
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l'etranger
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I don't see why people are forced to identify with Britain or Britishness.
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by l'etranger)
I don't see why people are forced to identify with Britain or Britishness.
It's a moral obligation when you come to the UK to subscribe to it. Remember, it's our great country welcoming them, not the other way round.
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Aladdinsaaane
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(Original post by Ciel.)
How dumb is that? Why confuse religion with nationality?
Ask the left! They think being anti-Islam is racist!
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Aladdinsaaane
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
It's a moral obligation when you come to the UK to subscribe to it. Remember, it's our great country welcoming them, not the other way round.
It should be a legal obligation.
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l'etranger
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
It's a moral obligation when you come to the UK to subscribe to it. Remember, it's our great country welcoming them, not the other way round.
No it isn't. The only obligation is to obey the law, and even then it's largely a matter of your tolerance for consequence rather than anything rooted in moral absolutes.
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chelseadagg3r
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Well my guess is they identify as Muslim because they are Muslim. Religion and nationality aren't the same thing. You can be British and Muslim :confused:
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by l'etranger)
No it isn't. The only obligation is to obey the law, and even then it's largely a matter of your tolerance for consequence rather than anything rooted in moral absolutes.
So how on Earth do you want them to fully integrate if they won't take on the British identity? Unless you don't want them to.


I'll say it again, 50% of Muslims in the UK think homosexuality should be illegal... what does UK law say?

Many don't even care about UK law and would rather be under Sharia.

I'm surprised there is still such a denial at the Islam problem in the West.
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by chelseadagg3r)
Well my guess is they identify as Muslim because they are Muslim. Religion and nationality aren't the same thing. You can be British and Muslim :confused:
Sure, but that isn't exactly my point.

I'm saying many Muslims in the UK consider themselves Muslim full stop.
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chelseadagg3r
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
Sure, but that isn't exactly my point.

I'm saying many Muslims in the UK consider themselves Muslim full stop.
Well they are Muslims lol

You mean they consider themselves 'not British', rather than just Muslim? They're two different things
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l'etranger
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
So how on Earth do you want them to fully integrate if they won't take on the British identity? Unless you don't want them to.


I'll say it again, 50% of Muslims in the UK think homosexuality should be illegal... what does UK law say?

Many don't even care about UK law and would rather be under Sharia.

I'm surprised there is still such a denial at the Islam problem in the West.
I don't particularly care if they integrate or not, because there is no such thing as British society, you are an individual and you are a member of your family, there is no wider membership of Britain, we need to stop talking like moralising collectivists.
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Yahudi Arabia
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[email protected]'s wrong with identifying as both?
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by chelseadagg3r)
Well they are Muslims lol

You mean they consider themselves 'not British', rather than just Muslim? They're two different things
I don't know whether you have watched 'Muslim like us', but in episode 2, towards the end, one of the woman says she doesn't see herself as British because people don't accept her as one - she sees herself as Muslim. I think several people agreed with her.

There were only 3-4 Muslims on the show who were quite liberal, the rest were conservative.
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by Yahudi Arabia)
[email protected]'s wrong with identifying as both?
Nothing.

I'm concerned about those who consider themselves only Muslim and not British or British Muslim.
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chelseadagg3r
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
I don't know whether you have watched 'Muslim like us', but in episode 2, towards the end, one of the woman says she doesn't see herself as British because people don't accept her as one - she sees herself as Muslim. I think several people agreed with her.

There were only 3-4 Muslims on the show who were quite liberal, the rest were conservative.
I haven't. I should though, there's been a lot of talk about it. But yeah, that's quite interesting. I guess I can see where she's coming from, because with a lot of people it's very 'you must accept every British value or you will not be accepted' kind of thing, so why identify with something that doesn't really believe in you? I don't think it's a case of 'I'm not British. I am a Muslim and we are taking over' etc as some people see it, but I think it's more a case of 'I don't want to label myself as part of something that does not accept me, and therefore I'll just stick to the term Muslim because my religion does accept me', at least for a large part
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username1292215
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British Muslim
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Dodgypirate
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(Original post by chelseadagg3r)
I haven't. I should though, there's been a lot of talk about it. But yeah, that's quite interesting. I guess I can see where she's coming from, because with a lot of people it's very 'you must accept every British value or you will not be accepted' kind of thing,

We're moving into philosophy now. What are British values? I can imagine basic human rights are included.



(Original post by chelseadagg3r)
so why identify with something that doesn't really believe in you?
A small minority of bigots making you feel bad shouldn't stop you from being British.

Lots of people in this country make gay people, for instance, feel unwelcomed, but it doesn't stop them from being British or wanting to be British - and being gay isn't a choice either.
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Elizabeth II
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Hi

Going to tidy this up a little bit. Bear with me. Thanks!

Ethan
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