Will my Edexcel GCE/IAL subjects be accepted to German universities?

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RizK
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So if I'm right, the basis for entrance to German universities depends on our results conforming to their "Hochschulzugangsberechtigung"

I'm not from the UK but I've done Edexcel/Pearson my whole life, and I graduated this year with 2As and 2Bs (I know, disappointing) for the following:
  • GCE Mathematics
  • GCE Further Mathematics
  • IAL Physics
  • IAL Chemistsry

Now I'm looking to study engineering there, and I can get in touch with the local goethe to learn some required German.

A painful google-translate powered search through the anabin database gave me the following information:
http://i.imgur.com/7Ir39a5.jpg

So I need to have done a language for my A levels?

and then:
http://i.imgur.com/0CNou5e.jpg

Suddenly I don't need a language, but I need to have done a GCE in Engineering, which I didn't even know existed till now. :/

So naturally I looked as to what it was before I stumbled upon this page explaining that said qualification does exist, and is an applied qualification.

So do I need to do that to gain entrance? Or is my Maths/Furthermaths/physics/chemistry combination enough?
Oh, and there also was this:
http://i.imgur.com/Q93szdz.jpg

and applied qualifications are to be withdrawn next year too...


I'm so confused right now. If there's someone who's been through this, or knows something about this, and can shed some light on the matter, please do so, thank you very much!
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Reshyna
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(Original post by RizK)
So if I'm right, the basis for entrance to German universities depends on our results conforming to their "Hochschulzugangsberechtigung"

I'm not from the UK but I've done Edexcel/Pearson my whole life, and I graduated this year with 2As and 2Bs (I know, disappointing) for the following:
  • GCE Mathematics
  • GCE Further Mathematics
  • IAL Physics
  • IAL Chemistsry

Now I'm looking to study engineering there, and I can get in touch with the local goethe to learn some required German.

A painful google-translate powered search through the anabin database gave me the following information:
http://i.imgur.com/7Ir39a5.jpg

So I need to have done a language for my A levels?

and then:
http://i.imgur.com/0CNou5e.jpg

Suddenly I don't need a language, but I need to have done a GCE in Engineering, which I didn't even know existed till now. :/

So naturally I looked as to what it was before I stumbled upon this page explaining that said qualification does exist, and is an applied qualification.

So do I need to do that to gain entrance? Or is my Maths/Furthermaths/physics/chemistry combination enough?
Oh, and there also was this:
http://i.imgur.com/Q93szdz.jpg

and applied qualifications are to be withdrawn next year too...


I'm so confused right now. If there's someone who's been through this, or knows something about this, and can shed some light on the matter, please do so, thank you very much!
Hi I'm doing the same subjects and they are edexcel. I've also done edexcel throughout my whole life. But I'm doing IALs. Will u be able to help me with my doubts, please? I'm self-studying and currently I'm at AS. My ambition is to be an engineer just like you.
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RizK
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(Original post by Reshyna)
Hi I'm doing the same subjects and they are edexcel. I've also done edexcel throughout my whole life. But I'm doing IALs. Will u be able to help me with my doubts, please? I'm self-studying and currently I'm at AS. My ambition is to be an engineer just like you.
Sure, I screwed up this year but I'm planning to resit anyway. PM me
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hickups
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Yes, you would need a language to get into german universities. The anabin is the right website to refer to.

"and then:
http://i.imgur.com/0CNou5e.jpg
Suddenly I don't need a language, "
------- beware, this is only an additional requirement for the named course ---------

"I stumbled upon this page explaining"
------- sorry, but the passage in the original german documents say maths, not engineering. They certainly don't want a vocational Level in engineering------

"Oh, and there also was this:
http://i.imgur.com/Q93szdz.jpg"
-------- yes, that's correct. Vocational levels don't count towards german Abitur -------

There is another problem which you might not have spotted yet: You need 4 independent subjects for a Fachgebundene Hochschulreife. So further maths doesn't count to your 4 subjects, if there is already maths in your list, your score is 3. The 4th subject may be an AS-Level though.

The german education system is different/broader than the english one: You are obliged to go through with nearly all subjects (at least 2 languages, maths, 2-3 sciences and 2 humanities and more) until the end of your 13. year. There are not many students who do well across such a broad range of subjects, so the avarage Abitur (Allgemeine Hochschulreife) is always pulled down by your weaker subjects. So, it's understandable that they ask for one language as a minimum.

Having said all this, you might still be able to enter a Fachhochschule in Germany, which translates into University of Applied Sciences. These institutions don't have such high-flying courses compared to universities, but there are lots of very good ones. I don't know what kind of qualifications they ask for, except that they certainly attach more value to vocational qualifications. Type Fachhochschule and your course into the German google.de and ask the first 3 for their entry requirements.

Since you have already finished your A-Levels: There's another thing you could do: If you are accepted by an english university, you could try and use that offer as a document and apply to a specific university in Germany, without bothering the county's authorities to confirm your Hochschulreife. There is nothing to loose...

Sorry for any weird english, I am german and I have just discovered that my daughter did the same thing: She has just chosen 4 A-Level subjects, including maths and further maths, which barrs her from gaining the Hochschulreife she needs for studying in Germany. She is starting next year, so might be able to change her courses, I hope.
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Nathanielle
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BTW there is an old thread where Abitur and A Levels are compared.

And hickups is right, Math and further math only count as one subject.Hence you would need another A Level anyway.
The rest (Math, Physics, Chemistry) is okay for engineering and math.

According IAL etc., I have no idea, what it means, hence I do not comment.

Concerning the Fachhochschulen (FH) (University of Applied Sciences): there basic entry requirements won't defer much from the ones at universities. In Germany the big difference is, that you can go to a FH without covering the whole range of subjects at school, which you fulfill anyway with A Levels. Exception are usually only made, in case you have a "real" vocational qualification, as e.g. an apprenticeship in the field you intend to study. You can try, of course, but don't get your hopes up. (I don't think the offer would work. It could work beginning your studies in the UK and then applying after your first year, though. But that seems to much of a hassle.)

(Original post by hickups)
...

Sorry for any weird english, I am german and I have just discovered that my daughter did the same thing: She has just chosen 4 A-Level subjects, including maths and further maths, which barrs her from gaining the Hochschulreife she needs for studying in Germany. She is starting next year, so might be able to change her courses, I hope.
In case she speaks German, she could do additional A Level in German. It is accepted.
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hickups
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Nathanielle, she speaks German and that is exactly what she will do now, if they let her change (although it always seemed rediculous to take German as a foreign language!)

... is that a fix for RizK as well, an AS-Level German? He wants to resit something and will need the language anyway.
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Nathanielle
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(Original post by hickups)
although it always seemed rediculous to take German as a foreign language!
Well, it is. (On the other hand some do then German A Level as a fifth and gain the equivalent of an Abitur, but that means a lot of work, as then you need five full A Levels.) And one further hint, in case she takes another A Level, she will have to do a German test to be accepted to uni. (A friend of mine needed one, although she had a Mittlere Reife from Germany.)
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RizK
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Much thanks hickups and Nathanielle for your thoughtful responses.

So I understand this means I already have 3/4th of the qualifications I need. Do you think an application with
  • GCE Maths+Furthermaths
  • IAL Physics
  • IAL Chemistry
  • AS German/French

would be a strong enough application to be considered into entry for a TU9 University? I want to step into academia till at least my masters, and I thought going to a good reputed university would help me.

I did look into Hochschule Rhein-Waal and another few universities of applied sciences.

However it is hard to get an apprenticeship (10 weeks in the field?) where I am from, so my best bet is to do well in my tests and get good results. Would that be enough? Do german universities look into the extracurriculars aspect of an applicant as well?

Also, I'll miss the winter application deadlines (July 15) by the time I write the tests and wait for the reply. You don't suppose I could apply with pending results, yes? :/

Thank you, and I'll try to look for the thread comparing A levels and Abitur.
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Nathanielle
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(Original post by RizK)
So I understand this means I already have 3/4th of the qualifications I need. Do you think an application with
  • GCE Maths+Furthermaths
  • IAL Physics
  • IAL Chemistry
  • GCSE AS German/French

would be a strong enough application to be considered into entry for a TU9 University?
They just look at your grades, I think. The tradition in Germany is to filter students out at University, so the acceptance rate is higher than the number of students they want to see passing the exams. In case AS is sufficient, yes.

They do look in the extracurriculars in case your grades are in a range, where they don't take you automatically, but are good enough to get considered. The 10 weeks "Vorpraktikum" is I think, what you mean? As all German students have to do it, it is not hard to get, but apply early, in case you aim for a big company. (It doesn't matter for your future career, though, where you have done it.)

I did look into Hochschule Rhein-Waal and another few universities of applied sciences.

Concerning the admission deadlines, you should contact the universities directly.
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RizK
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(Original post by Nathanielle)
They just look at your grades, I think. The tradition in Germany is to filter students out at University, so the acceptance rate is higher than the number of students they want to see passing the exams. In case AS is sufficient, yes.

They do look in the extracurriculars in case your grades are in a range, where they don't take you automatically, but are good enough to get considered. The 10 weeks "Vorpraktikum" is I think, what you mean? As all German students have to do it, it is not hard to get, but apply early, in case you aim for a big company. (It doesn't matter for your future career, though, where you have done it.)

I did look into Hochschule Rhein-Waal and another few universities of applied sciences.

Concerning the admission deadlines, you should contact the universities directly.
I see. Thank you!
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hickups
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(Original post by RizK)
an application with
  • GCE Maths+Furthermaths
  • IAL Physics
  • IAL Chemistry
  • AS German/French
looks good, this combination is the equivalent of the Fachgebundene Hochschulreife and you should be able to apply for any engineering course at university or uni. of applied science with this.

The Hochschule Rhein-Waal doesn't have a NC in their engineering courses ("Alle Studiengänge der Fakultät Technologie und Bionik sind zulassungsfrei."
https://www.hochschule-rhein-waal.de...ge-und-modelle), that means a simple "pass" is enough to get in.

Not having any entry restrictions (in terms of grades) has probably another advantage: It should be fine, if you hand in your qualification documents at the time of enrolment, so you are able to meet their application deadline without your official results.

In case you choose a course with NC at another university, you have to go through authorities which transfer your grades into the German Notendurchnschnitt, so you can actually compete with other students for a place. That takes usually its time, students are warned (in the document you quoted) that they won't be able to start their studies immediatly after college.
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hickups
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(Original post by Nathanielle)
They just look at your grades, I think. The tradition in Germany is to filter students out at University, so the acceptance rate is higher than the number of students they want to see passing the exams. In case AS is sufficient, yes.

Concerning the admission deadlines, you should contact the universities directly.
That is exactly right, they do not look at anything else, just your "Zeugnisse". If there are more applicants than places, they simply resrict the entry by numerus clausus and waiting time.
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hickups
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(Original post by Nathanielle)
Well, it is. (On the other hand some do then German A Level as a fifth and gain the equivalent of an Abitur, but that means a lot of work, as then you need five full A Levels.) And one further hint, in case she takes another A Level, she will have to do a German test to be accepted to uni. (A friend of mine needed one, although she had a Mittlere Reife from Germany.)
oh honestly! Authorities are a bit dumb. If your friend had done the Mittlere Reife there is no way she didn't speak German!
Anyway. The equivalent of the Abitur not only is 5 full A-Levels, but also a certain range of subjects. My daughter isn't going to give up neither on further maths nor latin (her choice so far: latin, maths, further maths, physics, ...german) and she can't possibly do 7 A-Levels to include the required chemistry and humanity for the Abitur. However, she has to make her own choice. I can only provide some help with the regulations - she needs 4 individual subjects to go to Berlin and study Maths. On the other hand you are right: the percentage of students, who actually finish this Maths course is very small and she could problably do with a plan b. The Abitur is very universal...
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Nathanielle
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(Original post by hickups)
oh honestly! Authorities are a bit dumb. If your friend had done the Mittlere Reife there is no way she didn't speak German!
Anyway. The equivalent of the Abitur not only is 5 full A-Levels, but also a certain range of subjects. My daughter isn't going to give up neither on further maths nor latin (her choice so far: latin, maths, further maths, physics, ...german) and she can't possibly do 7 A-Levels to include the required chemistry and humanity for the Abitur. However, she has to make her own choice. I can only provide some help with the regulations - she needs 4 individual subjects to go to Berlin and study Maths. On the other hand you are right: the percentage of students, who actually finish this Maths course is very small and she could problably do with a plan b. The Abitur is very universal...
Are you sure, she needs German, in case she has already taken Latin? Because Latin should count as language and to proove her German skills it is faster to just take that German test, instead of preparing an A Level.

I think it really depends on what your daughters aim is in the long run. Does she want to be flexible in Germany (e.g. switch from Math to another subject or switch her minor) or does she want to have the choice to apply to the top UK schools.
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hickups
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(Original post by Nathanielle)
Are you sure, she needs German, in case she has already taken Latin? Because Latin should count as language and to proove her German skills it is faster to just take that German test, instead of preparing an A Level.

I think it really depends on what your daughters aim is in the long run. Does she want to be flexible in Germany (e.g. switch from Math to another subject or switch her minor) or does she want to have the choice to apply to the top UK schools.
Hi Nathanielle, maybe this is too much distraction from the thread. German was the quick-fix for a native german-speaker to make it 4 individual subjects (further maths doesn't count).
Thank you for all your thoughts!
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RizK
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(Original post by hickups)
Hi Nathanielle, maybe this is too much distraction from the thread. German was the quick-fix for a native german-speaker to make it 4 individual subjects (further maths doesn't count).
Thank you for all your thoughts!
(Original post by Nathanielle)
x
what if i do AS english literature - does it count?
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hickups
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(Original post by RizK)
what if i do AS english literature - does it count?
yes, that should count.
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Fadel
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Hohscule Rhein-Waal does not accept predicted grades, so you're missing the deadline. Your marks will be converted into a german equivalent by http://www.uni-assist.de/index_en.html and then evaluated.
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RizK
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(Original post by hickups)
yes, that should count.
thanks, my parents were of the idea that all I would do by doing German AS is bring my average down. (I know zero German atm x))
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hickups
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(Original post by Fadel)
Hohscule Rhein-Waal does not accept predicted grades, so you're missing the deadline. Your marks will be converted into a german equivalent by http://www.uni-assist.de/index_en.html and then evaluated.
The Hochschule Rhein-Waal hasn't set a NC for the entry to the engeneering courses. A simple pass will get him in. He can probably hand the certificate in at the time of enrolment.

BTW does anyone know, how to reach the TSR-Team? I wrote this and more in an earlier reply, but it is still pending.
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