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Hardest Natural Science Degree?

Dancer83

What is, in your opinion, the most difficult of the Natural Science Undergraduate degrees (in the UK)???

Reply 1

Jonatan

13

Dancer83

What is, in your opinion, the most difficult of the Natural Science Undergraduate degrees (in the UK)???

You count Maths as a natural science? Well I think maths is hardest, perhaps followed by biochemical engineering. Im gonna do physics so I hope it is not that impossible.

Reply 2

shiny

12

What is hard? :rolleyes:

Reply 3

ChemistBoy

16

shiny

What is hard? :rolleyes:

I do believe if you can cut diamonds with it, it is quite hard. I go for engineering then... :rolleyes:

Reply 4

Catt

It depends entirely upon whether the subject matter itself is hard or the course, both are entirely different things yet just as valid in assessing the difficulty.

For example, Human Sciences as a degree is very hard work, but the concepts involved may be easier to grasp than, say, physics (except when it comes to population genetics in Human Sciences, which I think is rock hard personally), but physics degrees themselves may be easier (not saying they necessarily are, but I'm just using for an example).

On this basis I chose Human Sciences - as it contains some part of biological sciences, alongside a vast amount of other areas including statistics and social sciences. Its the ultimate natural science (well, ok, no, not really - but its closer than most :tongue:

)

Reply 5

ChemistBoy

16

Catt

Its the ultimate natural science (well, ok, no, not really - but its closer than most :tongue:

)

Nope, physics is the ultimate natural science - one can't get more ultimate than studying the forces that hold our universe together.

Reply 6

Catt

ChemistBoy

Nope, physics is the ultimate natural science - one can't get more ultimate than studying the forces that hold our universe together.

I, personally, don't consider physics a natural science (by natural science I mean the biological sciences in their entirity, rightly or wrongly) :tongue:

Reply 7

ChemistBoy

16

Catt

I, personally, don't consider physics a natural science (by natural science I mean the biological sciences in their entirity, rightly or wrongly) :tongue:

Physics is the study of the natural world, it used to be called natural philosophy (indeed some professors of physics are actually professors of natural philosophy). Your definition of natural science is not the accepted one.

Reply 8

material breach

12

Catt

I, personally, don't consider physics a natural science (by natural science I mean the biological sciences in their entirity, rightly or wrongly) :tongue:

why are biological sciences more of a natural science than physics? Physics is the fundamental study of nature :rolleyes:

Reply 9

Catt

Incomplete

why are biological sciences more of a natural science than physics? Physics is the fundamental study of nature :rolleyes:

its a study of the way the unviverse / physical reality 'works', nature is part of the universe but is not the whole universe. To me at least a study of nature has to be a study of what is biological.

By definition all sciences have to observe reality as they all have to rely on empircal evidence to be considered a science. Therefore the 'world', the 'universe', 'nature' are all viable areas of study for all sciences but I feel that the normal object of physical analysis is not biological systems - although it can, and is, used in this area.

I'm not saying I'm right by any means, but this is how I have always viewed it.

Reply 10

Catt

ChemistBoy

Physics is the study of the natural world, it used to be called natural philosophy (indeed some professors of physics are actually professors of natural philosophy).

I know this isn't what your saying but simply because its sometimes referred to as natural philosophy doesn't make it any more a natural science than it being called philosophy stops it from being emprical and thus stops it from being a science.

And, yes, my view of a natural science isn't the accepted one. So I have a question: if you have natural science what is un-natural science?

Reply 11

Jonatan

13

Catt

I know this isn't what your saying but simply because its sometimes referred to as natural philosophy doesn't make it any more a natural science than it being called philosophy stops it from being emprical and thus stops it from being a science.

And, yes, my view of a natural science isn't the accepted one. So I have a question: if you have natural science what is un-natural science?

A Natural science is the study of natural phenomena (that is, experiments with an outcome that is not decided by humans). The other types of science are the humanities, or the social sciences which study human behaviour and choices. Some sciences are borderline , such as neurology and psychology, as they study the interaction between human behaviour and natural phenomena. Most commonly natural sciences refer to Physics, Chemistry, Biology and any dicipline which is a mixture or sub-set of these three. As an example, geologi is a natural science as it consist primarely of physics and chemistry. Economics is however not a natural science because it deals with human choices and behaviour, thus it is a social science.

Reply 12

Jonatan

13

Catt

To me at least a study of nature has to be a study of what is biological.

So a stream in a mountain landscape should not be considdered a part of nature? I think you have got the concept of nature mixed up with the concept of life. If I dare remind you, one of the most important works on physics was Isac Newton's Principa Mathematica Naturalis. Also, one of the founders of the natural sciences, Aristoteles, equalised nature with realism. "Things fall down , because it is in the nature of things to fall down." Something that is natural in this respect, is thus something which happens without intervention. Gravity acts because it is a fundamental part of nature. The stock market is however the result of many humans interacting and making choices, and is therefore not natural.

Reply 13

Jonatan

13

Catt

It depends entirely upon whether the subject matter itself is hard or the course, both are entirely different things yet just as valid in assessing the difficulty.

For example, Human Sciences as a degree is very hard work, but the concepts involved may be easier to grasp than, say, physics (except when it comes to population genetics in Human Sciences, which I think is rock hard personally), but physics degrees themselves may be easier (not saying they necessarily are, but I'm just using for an example).

On this basis I chose Human Sciences - as it contains some part of biological sciences, alongside a vast amount of other areas including statistics and social sciences. Its the ultimate natural science (well, ok, no, not really - but its closer than most :tongue:

)

Uhm. Human sciences are those scienses which are not natural sciences, thus it cannot possibly be the ultimate natural science. Science in general is divided in two groups, natural sciences and human sciences. Natural sciences are those where you study natural phenomena (that is, phenomena that do not depend of human choice) whereas human sciences are those that study phenomena which is the direct results of human choices (Human behaviour). Thus Physics, Chemistry and Biology are all natural sciences whereas Economics, Social Anthropology and History are social sciences (actually history is debated as it depends on how you look at it whether it makes predictions about the future).

Reply 14

Catt

I have a degree in Human Sciences - it is most certainly not just social science, and it most certainly not just that which is not natural science. Genetics, physiology, neuroscience, cellular biology its all within the discipline. Human Sciences seek to understand humans and since we can only observe the world through ourselves it makes sense that to understand the world we must first understand how it is we come to see the world in the first place, both through our biological endowments and our social constructs. Oh and I was joking about the ultimate part

OK, I accept that 'natural', in this debate at least, means much more than I previously said. However you seem to be excluding human behaviour from what is natural. That makes no sense. At all. We are part of nature, choice does not come into it. We are a product of physical forces. Of course this brings up the debate of free will versus determinism, but still I fail to see how human behaviour cannot be included within the study of what is 'natural'. To take our behaviour, to take ourselves, out of the equation is act above ourselves - and beyond what we know.

Hardest Natural Science Degree?

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