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Israeli Soldier Elor Azaria Guilty of Manslaughter of Disarmed Palestinian Watch

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    (Original post by AperfectBalance)
    BB...BBBUT Israel are the good guys and cant do anything wrong and certainly have not done any criminal activities
    Might take a note of the fact the soldier was convicted by an Israeli court... The time to worry is when this shitstorm becomes legal and policy.
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    (Original post by absoul)
    Yes but they dont have to go beyond it. The threat of Hamas only rose as they continued to expand their territory and continued to subject the Palestinians to oppression.
    Nonsense. Of course they have to go beyond the pre-1967 borders, because those borders can't be defended by modern weaponry.

    The rise of Hamas is the fault of the Palestinian people for voting them into power and not Israel.

    (Original post by absoul)
    I accept the fact that they won the war, and it was a bloody terrific plan attacking first with such brutality. But you cant blame Palestinians and punish them for what the Jordanians did.
    The Palestinians collaborated with the invading Arab regimes to kill all the Jews and drive them into the sea. They lost, they were displaced and they lost all the land that they could have enjoyed if they hadn't tried to destroy Israel.
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    The most legitimate claim it could possibly have. Israel fought and won its independence in 1948 against several hostile Arab armies who rejected the peace deal that would have seen two separate states, one Arab and one Jew, established. Israel fought again in 1967 and 1973 against fascistic Arab regimes hell-bent on its destruction. Time and time again the Arabs of Palestine have affirmed their determination to wipe Israel off the face of the earth.
    You seem fairly educated, isnt this ridiculous even for you?
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    And in this story we see the media double standards, if it had been a Palestinian then they would be shouting that the system was rigged against him, if it had been a Palestinian found innocent a big deal would have been made of it, if this Israeli had been found innocent it wouldn't be in the MSM. This is only news because it's the IDF.
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    The most legitimate claim it could possibly have. Israel fought and won its independence in 1948 against several hostile Arab armies who rejected the peace deal that would have seen two separate states, one Arab and one Jew, established. Israel fought again in 1967 and 1973 against fascistic Arab regimes hell-bent on its destruction. Time and time again the Arabs of Palestine have affirmed their determination to wipe Israel off the face of the earth.
    Calling everything you disagree with fascistic is extremely simplistic, while I agree the Arab states are no angels, neither is Israel.
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    Not really. It seems to me that Israel is criticised simply for defending itself.
    See, if you identify as a "liberal democracy" you will be scrutinized more heavily than a proclaimed "dictatorship". A liberal democracy entails certain qualifications that it must meet to be classed as one.This is why Israel breaching human rights etc is held to a higher degree than let's say Somalia. A liberal democracy entails justice and the respect of human dignity and autonomy. In the case mentioned above it appears such ideals were breached. Fine, if you believe Israel is criticised too harshly maybe it should stop labelling itself a liberal democracy and leave the club?

    This is an analagous example of my point. Israel is not part of the NPT. Iran is. Therefore Iran can be criticised more heavily in terms of its nuclear power programme, compared with Israel, because it is bound to certain laws etc which it must adhere to in order to be apart of the NPT.

    Do you understand?
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    #glassofjuice
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    Has anyone noticed the hypocrisy over migration though? In the West we love to say how amazing it is, yet we strongly condemn Jews who flew persecution to settle in Palestine? Why should Palestine, a state which didn't even exist at the time as it was under British control, why should it have a right to say no Jews allowed? Isn't that kind of racist?
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    Nonsense. Of course they have to go beyond the pre-1967 borders, because those borders can't be defended by modern weaponry.

    The rise of Hamas is the fault of the Palestinian people for voting them into power and not Israel.



    The Palestinians collaborated with the invading Arab regimes to kill all the Jews and drive them into the sea. They lost, they were displaced and they lost all the land that they could have enjoyed if they hadn't tried to destroy Israel.
    How can it not be defended? wtf. You're struggling to come up with a reasonable reason apart from defending extreme Zionist ideologies.

    Hamas only attacked when israel made the first unnecessary move.

    Again, you're talking of punishing palestinians for events that occurred over 50 years. You're basically admitting that the continued occupation of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip is nothing more than revenge. It's illegal.

    Justifying this is like justifying making Germany pay reparations to jews for what the Nazis did. It's pathetic and a primitive and devolved way of thinking which reveals that you have no legitimacy in what you're saying. You have a deep hatred for palestinians and muslims.
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    (Original post by TheTruthTeller)
    See, if you identify as a "liberal democracy" you will be scrutinized more heavily than a proclaimed "dictatorship". A liberal democracy entails certain qualifications that it must meet to be classed as one.This is why Israel breaching human rights etc is held to a higher degree than let's say Somalia. A liberal democracy entails justice and the respect of human dignity and autonomy. In the case mentioned above it appears such ideals were breached. Fine, if you believe Israel is criticised too harshly maybe it should stop labelling itself a liberal democracy and leave the club?

    This is an analagous example of my point. Israel is not part of the NPT. Iran is. Therefore Iran can be criticised more heavily in terms of its nuclear power programme, compared with Israel, because it is bound to certain laws etc which it must adhere to in order to be apart of the NPT.

    Do you understand?
    The standards to which Israel is held are super-human and unfair. Israel does everything it can to respect and uphold liberal values whilst simultaneously fighting a vicious, decades-long terrorist campaign by a people that refuses to recognise its existence and has sworn to wipe it off the face of the earth - and are quite happy to sacrifice their own lives in doing so.

    There is no moral equivalence between the Islamic Republic of Iran, a squalid, fascist, apocalyptic Islamist regime which is the world's leading state sponsor of terrorism, and Israel. I have no problem with Israel having nuclear weapons because Israel is a liberal democracy and I trust them not to actually make use of those weapons except as a last resort. Iran cannot be invested with such trust, because it is run by people who would have no moral qualms about using nuclear weapons to further their goals, and are quite happy to risk nuclear armageddon in the process.
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    what this soldier did is inexcusable. he has been tried & sentenced in the appointed court.

    if people want to avoid getting shot like this they should not stab soldiers.
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    (Original post by absoul)
    How can it not be defended? wtf. You're struggling to come up with a reasonable reason apart from defending extreme Zionist ideologies.
    It's a perfectly reasonable reason.

    (Original post by absoul)
    Hamas only attacked when israel made the first unnecessary move.
    That is complete nonsense. It is Hamas that has repeatedly launched rocket attacks against Israel, completely unprovoked, which has led to Israel taking tough measures in its defence.

    (Original post by absoul)
    Again, you're talking of punishing palestinians for events that occurred over 50 years. You're basically admitting that the continued occupation of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip is nothing more than revenge. It's illegal.
    Gaza is self-governing under the terrorist organisation Hamas.

    There are pressing practical reasons why the West Bank must be occupied by the Israelis, including, as I just said, the fact that the pre-war 1967 borders are indefensible with long-range missiles. It's not just for "revenge", it's for defence and to deter terrorist aggression.

    (Original post by absoul)
    Justifying this is like justifying making Germany pay reparations to jews for what the Nazis did. It's pathetic and a primitive and devolved way of thinking which reveals that you have no legitimacy in what you're saying. You have a deep hatred for palestinians and muslims.
    lol
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    (Original post by HopelessMedic)
    By comparing Israel with Hamas as equals you are essentially saying Israel is a terrorist state.

    You can't call Hamas a terrorist organisation and then justify Israeli action with " Hamas is worse", it's hypocritical.
    Israel and Hamas are not equals. Hamas are filthy Islamic terrorists. Israel is a liberal democracy.
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    (Original post by Abdukazam)
    Might take a note of the fact the soldier was convicted by an Israeli court... The time to worry is when this shitstorm becomes legal and policy.
    I know
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    (Original post by Abdukazam)
    Might take a note of the fact the soldier was convicted by an Israeli court... The time to worry is when this shitstorm becomes legal and policy.
    1. HRW released a report a few days ago which documented “numerous statements” made by senior Israeli politicians and religious figures “calling on police and soldiers to shoot to kill suspected attackers, irrespective of whether lethal force is actually strictly necessary to protect life":

    Some senior officials officials have been encouraging Israeli soldiers and police to kill Palestinians they suspect of attacking Israelis even when they are no longer a threat, Human Rights Watch said today in an analysis of those statements. Other Israeli officials have failed to repudiate the calls for excessive use of force.
    https://www.hrw.org/news/2017/01/02/...ing-shoot-kill

    2. The IDF have investigated at least 262 Palestinian deaths since 2000, which has resulted in only 17 indictments. The majority of Israeli soldiers indicted for manslaughter since 2000 were given a plea bargain instead of a prison sentence (despite manslaughter having a maximum sentence of 20 years imprisonment).

    3. 53% of Jewish Israelis support the killing of “any Palestinian who carries out a terror attack against Jews should be killed on the spot, even if he has been captured and clearly does not pose a threat.” Politicians from a range of political affiliations have come out in support of Elor, and there were pro-Elor protests outside the Jaffa military court this morning which clashed with police and chanted "Mohammed is dead".

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a6727061.html
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    I was kicked out of school for asking for a glass of juice at the holocaust memorial centre
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    The standards to which Israel is held are super-human and unfair. Israel does everything it can to respect and uphold liberal values whilst simultaneously fighting a vicious, decades-long terrorist campaign by a people that refuses to recognise its existence and has sworn to wipe it off the face of the earth - and are quite happy to sacrifice their own lives in doing so.

    There is no moral equivalence between the Islamic Republic of Iran, a squalid, fascist, apocalyptic Islamist regime which is the world's leading state sponsor of terrorism, and Israel. I have no problem with Israel having nuclear weapons because Israel is a liberal democracy and I trust them not to actually make use of those weapons except as a last resort. Iran cannot be invested with such trust, because it is run by people who would have no moral qualms about using nuclear weapons to further their goals, and are quite happy to risk nuclear armageddon in the process.
    "Super human and unfair". Illegal settlements condemned by the UN are unfair aww poor Israel.

    There is little point in arguing with you because you are not looking at the problem objectively. It is evident from the language you use that you do not have an ounce of sympathy for the Palestinian cause to a state, and that your personal prejeduces have got the better of you. You use terms like "super human" and "unfair" like an angry child who does not want to follow the rules and believes they are above the rules. Even I, who am not the biggest fan of Israel can understand why it reacts and acts in certain situations, but luckily I am able to look at both sides objectively. You just see Israel's good and not it's bad. Your whole paragraph is just based with a bunch of emotional rubbish that I can use to justify the exact opposite of what you said. "decades-long terrorist campaign by a people that refuses to recognise its existence". I can equally say Palestinians are being opressed by decades of Israeli illegal millitary rule, who came occupied their land and kicked them out. See how it works? You need to either accept UN rule or stop labelling Israel as some sort of liberal democracy which upholds liberal and justice.
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    (Original post by Runescape)
    I was kicked out of school for asking for a glass of juice at the holocaust memorial centre
    nice
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    (Original post by AIDS Skrillex)
    nice
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    WE
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    (Original post by Runescape)
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    WE


    god damn, did mr KANG get banned? :lol:
 
 
 
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