Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    I'm aware of that - I used to stalk TSR a lot before I created my account - which makes it even more surprising how why right-wing views have become so prevalent
    Not sure it follows that it should be surprising when you consider that we're talking about an HE-linked platform that was to some extent dominated, and certainly permiated, by relatively naive/idealistic/emotional pinkos with poorly evidenced/thought out arguments vs. the other themes/characteristics I touched upon in my earlier post :curious:

    Was like a red rag to a bull, primarily for right-minded vocal individuals like myself, who have the capacity/desire to educate, debate, and correct for misinformation/misunderstanding and related social ills, irrespective of the (at the time, considerable) scope for adverse public (mis)perceptions and personal backlash; secondarily, others have variously followed our lead, and otherwise felt compelled to react to the somewhat perverse/confused mainstream or 'establishment' narrative/'consensus' e.g. in the wake of increasingly serious/widely felt failures of (neoliberal) proressivism :yy:

    If we reintroduced negs, I'm pretty sure that we'd end up with a much more polarised forum, with subforums becoming left-wing or right-wing circlejerks. It would be hilarious, and quite interesting to watch, but probably not very good for TSR
    Probably, aye. Certainly liable to get more oddbod trolling as those of us who collect red gems tend to end up throwing caution to the wind. Doubtless part of the rationale for their removal in the first place. Economies of moderation :scrooge:
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    Probably, aye. Certainly liable to get more trolling as those of us who collect red gems tend to end up throwing caution to the wind. May have been part of the rationale for their removal in the first place. Economies of moderation :scrooge:
    I wonder how much the removal of negs coincided with the increase of right-wing thought (or, as I call it, Wrongthink).
    Offline

    11
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    I wonder how much the removal of negs coincided with the increase of right-wing thought (or, as I call it, Wrongthink).
    Ha ha ha!

    Go the whole hog, call it "Thoughtcrime."

    Seriously, the abolition of negging probably did have an effect. I reckon the majority, perhaps the significant majority of TSR users tend to the left, but they seem to be largely apathetic. Far less vocal than the right, as we have discussed.

    The neg system allowed them to passive aggressively attack right wing viewpoints they disagreed with, without having to actually engage that poster in debate.

    You still see the phenomenon with positive reps. You only have to make a virtue signalling post saying something trite like "you can't say all Muslims are terrorists!" to get about 35 positive reps.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    It's not altogether surprising; only the pendulum of politics. TSR was for a long time an insufferable SJW hub; it swung too far to the left, sparked a reaction, and has now ostensibly swung too far to the right. History repeats - and what did Engels-Marx say? First as tragedy, then as rotten farce, and Trump/Brexit fit the latter rather neatly. Marx was a little harsh of course, since Napoleon III did in fact restore France to glory at least for a good while and at least domestically before his downfall (coincidentally, in Mexico), but I think it takes some creative imagination to believe the far right can restore the UK and America to greatness. Generally, TSR is not particularly right-wing on specific issues (drug laws, abortion, religion, homosexuality, gun laws, criminal justice, etc) but only on sociopolitical and macroeconomic issues of national identity, culture, gender and the free market, which is clearly only a reaction to the regressive left. Extreme breeds extreme after all.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    (Original post by Craghyrax)
    It used to be the case that you could have a discussion and both parties would come away having been intellectually stimulated, and taught something new.
    Did TSR seriously used to be like this? I find it hard to imagine.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Did TSR seriously used to be like this? I find it hard to imagine.
    It wasn't utopia, and you still had to put up with a lot of anger and flaming. But there were more cases of threads where some genuine debate was going on, and people were actually really going into the reasoning behind why they supported a view, rather than resorting to pettiness and ad hominems.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Did TSR seriously used to be like this? I find it hard to imagine.
    Ehh, I think the overall standard of debate was probably a bit higher back in the day. I remember there being more users on the extreme ends of the political spectrum as well, or at least a lot more big personalities on both sides who really knew their stuff.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    just left wing, liberal, SJW etc - everything that is a formula for somebody that will flag you for simply expressing your opinions that they don't agree with or like. you know how it is. I even got flagged the other day for "offending potential homeless people"...on the student room. I **** you not.
    It sounds to me like you're out of touch with how moderation works on TSR right now About a year ago, the Community Team (who are paid full time staff based in Brighton) took over handling all post reports and carding. People like me no longer hand out warnings, except in extreme situations. For instance, the other day it was about 3am on a Saturday night, and some troll with a brand new account started posting a gazillion very offensive threads all over TSR. I am allowed to ban someone if that happens because nobody from the CT is likely to be online... maybe not until Monday... and it is a clear cut case. But if, for instance, I came across a post of yours that said 'homeless people are losers who need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps', I would submit a report, just like any other user can, and it would have to wait for the CT to come online and review it on the Monday.

    I have been a moderator since 2009, and before that I was also part of the wider support team through being Secretary General of the MUN and a PS Helper. I know a lot of the CT staff, and I've seen the moderation team change and transform over the years. Some Brighton HQ staff are Labour supporters, but some are Conservative too. As to the moderators on TSR, you can't generalise about us either. We're talking about 60ish people here, and if we put a poll up in the support team forum, I think you'd find that a lot of people would tick the 'indifferent' or 'not all that interested in politics' box, rather than identifying as right or left wing. I certainly haven't met any moderators that would conform to the 'SJW' stereotype. The closest example of that is probably me, and actually - despite the fact that I am a Corbyn supporter - I have a lot of criticisms of the direction that some left wing culture has gone in over the last decade. I think identity politics is a massive problem, and I think that some left wing individuals over-simplify issues, and have very inflexible moral knee jerk reactions to things. Please note the use of 'some'. I think I know one person on the mod team who votes Green, and he's more calm and has more patience than me. So definitely not a 'SJW'.
    The bottom line is that it's very wrong (and also quite funny) to point to one mod - like you did with me - and say 'look... this person is identical to all the other 60 mods on TSR' :p:

    I think your biggest 'problem' is class and culture related, not political. What moderators and the CT share in common is a preference for tact and diplomacy. If you want to say something like "homeless people are stupid ****s" then anybody on the moderation team is going to view that as inflammatory and needlessly harsh. If you want to say "in my opinion, homeless people need to do more to take responsibility for their lives, and the state should stop enabling their problems", I would strongly disagree with you and would personally think that you're an arrogant, ignorant and heartless [insert expletive], but neither myself nor anybody who administrates TSR would warn you for that, because it was communicated diplomatically. Even a mod who was right wing and IDS's biggest fan would have warned for the first example.

    (Original post by Snufkin)
    It takes a lot of energy to argue with hard-right and so-called alt-right people online, and most of the time your efforts are wasted because they either won't acknowledge your post, or they will dismiss it out of hand as lies. After a short time most people give up. They are a (very) vocal minority who are best ignore.
    Basically yes. Actually I think arguing with lots of people from different political backgrounds matches this description. There is no point in arguing with a person who has already made their mind up and who is determined to stick to their guns, come what may. That isn't a discussion, it's a fight. Fighting is exhausting and pointless. It just leads to bad feeling, and people becoming more entrenched. That's why I gave up on debating on TSR many years ago. It used to be the case that you could have a discussion and both parties would come away having been intellectually stimulated, and taught something new. Now showing up for a discussion is just like being a voluntary pinâta for a bunch of angry teens to release their frustration against. No thanks


    (Original post by citibankrec)
    TSR is a big place. A lot of mods have no interest in posting in D&CA. Or in Chat... or wherever else you are. I spent the majority of my TSR membership - both as a user and mod - posting in the Universities forums.

    (Original post by Captain Haddock)
    Ehh, I think the overall standard of debate was probably a bit higher back in the day. I remember there being more users on the extreme ends of the political spectrum as well, or at least a lot more big personalities on both sides who really knew their stuff.
    Captain Haddock is one of my favourite fictional characters :love::adore:
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Craghyrax)
    Basically yes. Actually I think arguing with lots of people from different political backgrounds matches this description. There is no point in arguing with a person who has already made their mind up and who is determined to stick to their guns, come what may. That isn't a discussion, it's a fight. Fighting is exhausting and pointless. It just leads to bad feeling, and people becoming more entrenched. That's why I gave up on debating on TSR many years ago. It used to be the case that you could have a discussion and both parties would come away having been intellectually stimulated, and taught something new. Now showing up for a discussion is just like being a voluntary pinâta for a bunch of angry teens to release their frustration against. No thanks
    Debate on TSR is often fruitless, but I think you're looking back with rose-tinted glasses. Debate hasn't become less productive, you've just out-grown the forum and lost interest in debating the same repeated threads with younger members and with no end in sight. It can sometimes feel like an online version of The Truman Show.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by macromicro)
    Debate on TSR is often fruitless, but I think you're looking back with rose-tinted glasses. Debate hasn't become less productive, you've just out-grown the forum and lost interest in debating the same repeated threads with younger members and with no end in sight. It can sometimes feel like an online version of The Truman Show.
    Always possible
    I was never very active in D&D, to be fair.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    Sounds like we need to...

    Make______________________
    The Student Room
    __________________great again!
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Captain Haddock)
    more big personalities on both sides who really knew their stuff
    Perhaps a tad oxymoronic :curious:

    Spoiler:
    Show
    People who really know their stuff scarcely adopt arbitrary/inflexible political positions (esp. not on the right/extreme left)
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    I've been a member of numerous forums for at least 15 years. Then, most forums were quite left wing and very few people right wing. The type of discussion was different then.

    I think it simply reflects current day issues and attitudes. Obviously immigration is a big issue, the EU is a big issue and a certain religion is a huge issue. A big percentage of the general public worry about these issues and have turned to the far right for support as everyone else seemingly doesn't care. To a certain extent that will be mirrored here.

    Labour having a moron in charge has also pushed a few people in the opposite direction. In fact I know a lot of people who have disowned Labour.
    • Community Assistant
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by astutehirstute)
    Are you for real?

    Right wing people are shaping the western world as we watch. Brexit, Trump, Italy, in a couple of months the Netherlands and France.

    It is the left that is pi$$ing in the wind.
    Wouldn't call Brexit necessarily right wing.

    The five star movement in Italy aren't really right wing tbf. As anti-establishment parties go, they're one of the less extreme.

    The others I agree with.
    • Community Assistant
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Rakas21)
    The answer to the OP is that TSR is more reflective of the country than OP's (probably Labour) echo circles. The Libertarianism stems from the middle class demographic while the nationalism and anti-SJW stems from the fact that the userbase is mostly outside of London and heavily male.



    Is that really unrepresentative of the country as a whole outside London? I live outside of Bradford and i can tell you that most white folk have a very negative perception of that religion and its followers and these are people who are exposed to that hellhole rather than out in the sticks. Anecdotal perhaps but backed by polling. Britain aint Islam friendly outside of the circles of power.
    Whilst I have a lot of respect for independently minded conservatives such as yourself, Lib, Nullis, Limeman etc, there does seem to have been a massive upsurge in what I can only describe as 'Daily Mail comment section posters' on this forum in recent weeks.

    Debates are less about exchanging ideas but more about threads going 'X is ruining our way of life!!!'
    • Offline

      18
      (Original post by Snufkin)
      It takes a lot of energy to argue with hard-right and so-called alt-right people online, and most of the time your efforts are wasted because they either won't acknowledge your post, or they will dismiss it out of hand as lies. After a short time most people give up. They are a (very) vocal minority who are best ignored.
      I'd say this is the case for anyone with dogmatic ideas about anything. I'm sure you can think of a certain left-of-centre member who frequents the U.S. presidential election thread who's like this too. :ninja:
      • Offline

        18
        (Original post by Craghyrax)
        As to the moderators on TSR, you can't generalise about us either. We're talking about 60ish people here, and if we put a poll up in the support team forum, I think you'd find that a lot of people would tick the 'indifferent' or 'not all that interested in politics' box, rather than identifying as right or left wing. I certainly haven't met any moderators that would conform to the 'SJW' stereotype.
        I agree that you can't generalise, but when you say you haven't met any such moderators... Would you say you've met/are aware of more or less all of the current ST members?
        Offline

        13
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by Hydeman)
        I agree that you can't generalise, but when you say you haven't met any such moderators... Would you say you've met/are aware of more or less all of the current ST members?
        As I said, I've been a mod since 2009, and involved in the support team for longer.

        I'm sure that it's easiest for you guys to think that disagreement/warnings for your views has to mean the person interfering is left wing. But that isn't the only... nor even the most likely explanation for that outcome.
        • Offline

          18
          (Original post by Craghyrax)
          As I said, I've been a mod since 2009, and involved in the support team for longer.

          I'm sure that it's easiest for you guys to think that disagreement/warnings for your views has to mean the person interfering is left wing. But that isn't the only... nor even the most likely explanation for that outcome.
          I see. Just to be clear: I was speaking generally, not from my point of view. I don't consider myself right-wing, nor have I received warnings in the recent past. I just found it hard to believe that you don't know anyone on the ST to be the SJW-type. :ninja:
          Offline

          10
          ReputationRep:
          (Original post by Mathemagicien)
          Why is N&CA full of libertarians, nationalists, and anti-SJWs?

          Just curious to see if anyone has any theories why this is the case.
          I dunno, but student politics doesn't really allow for the middle-of-the-road centrist position.

          You have 3 options it seems. Far left, far right, or cynical self-service because you actually have a career in politics in mind.

          *shrug*

          Student politics is why I think the idea of raising the voting age to at least 25 has some merit.
         
         
         
      • See more of what you like on The Student Room

        You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

      • Poll
        What newspaper do you read/prefer?
        Useful resources
      • See more of what you like on The Student Room

        You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

      • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

        Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

        Quick reply
        Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.