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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    If you think he would have been in his overdraft anyway, which does sound likely, then don't pay. You are only responsible for costs that wouldn't have been incurred had you paid on time.

    However, if this fee has genuinely been incurred because you paid late then you should cover it.
    He is now claiming i owe him £30, which is £10 a day. According to him. Because I paid a day late I would happily pay the £10 (If he could prove the overdraft was due to me) but he wants the £30 and has now contacted the estate agents and citizen advice.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    It would be up to the registrar to make up their own mind on the evidence presented.

    The tenancy agreement would have you down as one of the tenants.

    I would also have a record of payments from the other tenants and yourself from previous months when it didnt bounce. You prove its from them becayse it says where they come from plus they could confirm it in the statement. It would be rather a conicidence that they would all be for a fraction of the actual bill and there was missing 1 share i.e you.

    Ofc it would be shared bills. It would be you to prove otherwise once the presumption was raised.

    The registrar just looks at the surrounding evidence then decideds whose version he believes on the blanace of probabilyu. Yours requires you to lie on oath.
    The tenancy agreement doesn't say how social I am with the other tenants or what our individual and group plans and intentions are on bill paying, but there is an official document with your name on it saying that you and you alone as the only account holder personally owe a company money.

    I don't get on with you and tolerate you in the house. I don't know what you sign up for and how much money you pay for things and how often. I put money in your account sometimes when I feel like it for you to buy toilet roll when I get annoyed there isn't any. I haven't signed anything with any company (except the letting agent) in my entire life and would like a court to prove that I have, which would be impossible as I know that I physically haven't. You're mates with people in the house and are ganging up on me because you want me to pay money for toiletries and kitchen utensils which I don't want to be a part of. I refuse to pay and have no contract with you or anyone you have a contract with yourself except the letting agent; no other company you have dealings with knows who I am and that I even exist. Sue me.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    If you think he would have been in his overdraft anyway, which does sound likely, then don't pay. You are only responsible for costs that wouldn't have been incurred had you paid on time.

    However, if this fee has genuinely been incurred because you paid late then you should cover it.
    Saved me the trouble.

    OP this sums it up nicely. You need to see proof that you being a day late created the £30 charge. Santander could tell you. It might be a daily or it might be because its a bounced payment from a DD. If thats the case then subject to proof its your responsibility, but surely you can negotiate half? I do agree that its not unreasonable to expect him to be in credit as you seem to be being excessively penalised for his poor finances.

    You should see if your bank will refund you.

    CAB will tell him not to bother. Its a reasonable amount of hassle and he wont be bothered enough.
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    (Original post by Glassapple)
    You can apply that to anything; it's obvious I robbed the pie shop because I have pie on my hands and regularly have pie on my hands. That's circumstantial evidence which wouldn't stand up in court. The deposits into the person's account would be viewed as 'in kind' as personal transactions. You see it all the time, like when PayPal has personal and business account options.
    Circumstantial evidence can be enough. It doesn't need to be proved, the court just needs to determine what the agreement would likely have been. It is much more likely that flatmates agree to split bills rather than one person agreeing to pay them all.
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    Deduct the charge he would have incurred had you paid on time from the total penalty charge. That is your share of the responsibility.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    Circumstantial evidence can be enough. It doesn't need to be proved, the court just needs to determine what the agreement would likely have been. It is much more likely that flatmates agree to split bills rather than one person agreeing to pay them all.
    Yeah, people who live together are always by default best mates who couldn't possibly not like each other and not really speak to each other, and not have any kind of agreement between only a few people in the house and not others...
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Saved me the trouble.

    OP this sums it up nicely. You need to see proof that you being a day late created the £30 charge. Santander could tell you. It might be a daily or it might be because its a bounced payment from a DD. If thats the case then subject to proof its your responsibility, but surely you can negotiate half? I do agree that its not unreasonable to expect him to be in credit as you seem to be being excessively penalised for his poor finances.

    You should see if your bank will refund you.

    CAB will tell him not to bother. Its a reasonable amount of hassle and he wont be bothered enough.
    I would say it is poor management of finances that if your account gets locked, you are unable to access £14. Have more than one account, have a bit of cash. When this happened to me, I could still get cash out in branch.
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    (Original post by Glassapple)
    Yeah, people who live together are always by default best mates who couldn't possibly not like each other and not really speak to each other, and not have any kind of agreement between only a few people in the house and not others...
    Why would 1 person pay for all the bills? It doesn't matter whether they are mates or not, that is not a fair arrangement and not a common one.
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    (Original post by Gigglebar)
    He is now claiming i owe him £30, which is £10 a day. According to him. Because I paid a day late I would happily pay the £10 (If he could prove the overdraft was due to me) but he wants the £30 and has now contacted the estate agents and citizen advice.
    £10 sounds fair. If you paid 1 day late, then you owe 1 day tops. He can contact whoever he wants, it doesn't mean you have to pay.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Saved me the trouble.

    OP this sums it up nicely. You need to see proof that you being a day late created the £30 charge. Santander could tell you. It might be a daily or it might be because its a bounced payment from a DD. If thats the case then subject to proof its your responsibility, but surely you can negotiate half? I do agree that its not unreasonable to expect him to be in credit as you seem to be being excessively penalised for his poor finances.

    You should see if your bank will refund you.

    CAB will tell him not to bother. Its a reasonable amount of hassle and he wont be bothered enough.
    I sent the payment through a transfer and he told me he had recieved it. He is now telling me there is a £30 fee to pay for me being late (£10 per day) even though the payment was due on the 9th (2 days ago =£20) I have told him I would pay the £10 for the one day I was late, but he refused and contacted CAB. I presume this is because he cannot afford the extra £20 cos he goes and gets pissed every night. surely this is not my responsibility to pay! I am not paying for his nights out when my account was frozen due to fraud as this is the second attempt at fraud in the past 3 months. This was all discussed before the payment was due. My original post was just to see if anyone knew legal advice but it got blown out of proportion. It was a £14 bill payment i missed, if someone has less than £20 in their bank account, what is the point of having an account in the first place?
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    I would say it is poor management of finances that if your account gets locked, you are unable to access £14. Have more than one account, have a bit of cash. When this happened to me, I could still get cash out in branch.
    The payment was due on the 9th - a sunday. therefore no branches open. It is not poor finances at all. It is poor finances on their part if £14 puts them in their overdraft. and how is it poor financial management when £700 is stolen from me via fraud. I can clearly afford to pay the £14 but couldn't on that specific day.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    Why would 1 person pay for all the bills? It doesn't matter whether they are mates or not, that is not a fair arrangement and not a common one.
    Do you think a company cares why someone is paying a bill as long as they get paid? Maybe this one person wants to be nice, maybe this one person has a great job and just sorts it all out themselves, maybe this one person won the lottery, etc. Companies don't ask unnecessary questions about why their bill gets paid and by who as long as they get paid what they are owed. Anybody who pays a bill is literally an account number with an individual bill reference number attached to them for each bill.

    I could pay your phone bill for you right now if you gave me the account details and your phone company wouldn't care; they get paid which is all they want and all they will ever want, regardless of who gives them the money.
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    £30 of drama in this thread tbh :bandit:
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    (Original post by Glassapple)
    The tenancy agreement doesn't say how social I am with the other tenants, what our individual and group plans and intentions are on bill paying, but there will be an official document with your name on it saying that you and you alone as the only account holder personally owe a company money.

    I don't get on with you and tolerate you in the house. I don't know what you sign up for and how much money you pay for things and how often. I put money in your account sometimes when I feel like it for you to buy toilet roll when I get annoyed there isn't any. I haven't signed anything with any company (except the letting agent) in my entire life and would like a court to prove that I have, which would be impossible as I know that I physically haven't. You're mates with people in the house and are ganging up on me because you want me to pay money for toiletries and kitchen utensils which I don't want to be a part of. I refuse to pay and have no contract with you or anyone you have a contract with yourself except the letting agent; no other company you have dealings with knows who I am and that I even exist. Sue me.
    Except I have :
    1.A record of payments already for you which conveniently fit your share of the BB payments.
    2. Witness statements confirming the arrangements as well as confirming the fact you pay your share of other utilities.
    3. Enough documents confirming you as one of the tenants.

    You dont have to sign to be responsible for your share.

    The registrar will look at my evidence and look at yours then make their mind up. You wont be able to explain away the amount of the payments coming from you on a regular basis.

    You will have to commit perjury if you deny you used the bb. the registrar will have to decide whther he believes you didnt use BB bearing in mind your previous payments and the continued usage by other tenants. he will do that on the balance of probabilities.

    ps you sound like a really nightmare housemate.
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    (Original post by estel)
    £30 of drama in this thread tbh :bandit:
    Feel free to resolve it by sending the OP £30.
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    (Original post by estel)
    £30 of drama in this thread tbh :bandit:
    Yes, but why should I pay £20 extra just for him to spend on "the sesh" when i had £700 stolen from me via fraud. I aint doing it. I already bailed him out his overdraft before.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Except I have :
    1.A record of payments already for you which conveniently fit your share of the BB payments.
    2. Witness statements confirming the arrangements as well as confirming the fact you pay your share of other utilities.
    3. Enough documents confirming you as one of the tenants.

    You dont have to sign to be responsible for your share.

    The registrar will look at my evidence and look at yours then make their mind up. You wont be able to explain away the amount of the payments coming from you on a regular basis.

    You will have to commit perjury if you deny you used the bb. the registrar will have to decide whther he believes you didnt use BB bearing in mind your previous payments and the continued usage by other tenants. he will do that on the balance of probabilities.

    ps you sound like a really nightmare housemate.
    You sound like you would willingly trust a group of strangers with your cash. Foolish. I live there, so what, you want me to contribute towards your porn subscription too? I put money in your account on the first of every month for toilet paper and bin bags, out of the goodness of my heart I keep up these regular payments not attached to anything official.
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    (Original post by Glassapple)
    Do you think a company cares why someone is paying a bill as long as they get paid? Maybe this one person wants to be nice, maybe this one person has a great job and just sorts it all out themselves, maybe this one person won the lottery, etc. Companies don't ask unnecessary questions about why their bill gets paid and by who as long as they get paid what they are owed. Anybody who pays a bill is literally an account number with an individual bill reference number attached to them for each bill.

    I could pay your phone bill for you right now and your phone company wouldn't care; they got paid which is all they wanted and all they will ever want, regardless of who gave them the money.
    That's right. As I said, there is a contract between the company and the person on the contract. The person on the contract must pay the company what they agreed wherever that money comes from.

    That does not mean that there is not a separate contract between OP and the main bill payer to pay him towards the bills. The OP is liable to the bill payer for that contract. If it was agreed that the a contribution be paid on a certain date and that has been breached, the bill payer should be compensated for that.
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    (Original post by Glassapple)
    You sound like you would willingly trust a group of strangers with your cash. Foolish. I live there, so what, you want me to contribute towards your porn subscription too? I put money in your account on the first of every month for toilet paper and bin bags, out of the goodness of my heart I keep up these regular payments not attached to anything official.
    It's purely academic, but it's unlikely a judge would agree with your interpretation that you continue to gift them money out of the goodness of your heart and there's every chance they would rule that there was a contract in place between the two tenants.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    That's right. As I said, there is a contract between the company and the person on the contract. The person on the contract must pay the company what they agreed wherever that money comes from.

    That does not mean that there is not a separate contract between OP and the main bill payer to pay him towards the bills. The OP is liable to the bill payer for that contract. If it was agreed that the a contribution be paid on a certain date and that has been breached, the bill payer should be compensated for that.
    Again it goes back to well he said this, she said that, nothing was signed. We agreed verbally on a Saturday morning after a night of heavy drinking that I would send you £14 each month for broadband payments. Prove it. You're right in that the person who signed must pay in whatever circumstances; it is their responsibility to source the money for the bill they signed up to pay.
 
 
 
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