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      (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
      Second, it's likely that the surveys on Trump and Brexit were skewed by people lying to the interviewers because they knew there was stigma against supporting Brexit and Trump.
      Polls are generally becoming less reliable because the response rate for good telephone polls has been declining since the 1990s as the proportion of households with a landline is shrinking all the time. Also, online polls are the cheapest for polling companies to run - they tend not to be very good but, because they cost less, they're more likely to be commissioned. There's a distinct preference for lots of low-quality online polls than a few high-quality telephone/face-to-face ones.

      This article covers it in some detail: http://www.nature.com/news/the-polli...-think-1.20815. Point is, there are good criticisms of polling and the methods used by pollsters. 'You didn't ask everyone' just happens not to be one of them.
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      (Original post by Ray04)
      Lmao i've been arguing about the wrong point,iv re read the poll by the guardian. - A large majority (91%) of the British Muslims who took part in the survey said they felt a strong sense of belonging in their local area, which is higher than the national average of 76%.However, when asked to what extent they agreed or disagreed that homosexuality should be legal in Britain, 18% said they agreed and 52% said they disagreed, compared with 5% among the public at large who disagreed.

      - I would agree 52% is a more accurate representation of British muslims who agree/disagree on the legality of homosexuality than 91%
      Yeah, no one would say it was 91%. The data collected is probably fairly representative of British Muslims and certainly representative of Muslims worldwide as extensive Pew research has shown.
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      (Original post by humsdehums)
      ANY Muslim who doesn't hate ISIS isn't a Muslim. Therefore, all Muslims hate ISIS. Probably even more than non-Muslims, lol.
      True but of course people will say ISIS and it's few radicalised supporters are muslims and somehow will make it out as if they're the face of every Muslim.
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      (Original post by zayn008)
      True but of course people will say ISIS and it's few radicalised supporters are muslims and somehow will make it out as if they're the face of every Muslim.
      Yes, but what I'm trying to say is anyone who supports ISIS can't be considered Muslim, even though they think they are. Once a Muslim reaches that level they are no longer a human, let alone Muslim.
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      (Original post by Ray04)
      "tried and tested science which has shown to be pretty accurate" - surveys showed brexit wouldn't happen, then brexit happened. Surveys showed trump wouldn't become president, trump became president. & many more instances where surveys, polls and statistics simply failed - http://www.statisticsviews.com/detai...verywhere.html
      Polls about Brexit and Trump were only wrong by a few percentage points, or within the margin of errors. A few percentage points may change the results of some elections, but it doesn't change the big picture when it deals with opinions.
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      (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
      Yes, but as the generations pass they will probably become a lot less conservative and Islam will essentially die just like Christianity has.
      Several studies have shown that many young Muslims are more radical than their parents.
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      (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
      Yeah, no one would say it was 91%. The data collected is probably fairly representative of British Muslims and certainly representative of Muslims worldwide as extensive Pew research has shown.
      I was disagreeing on the basis that the data suggested 91% British muslims believed that homosexuality should be illegal. Considering the majority of British muslims are probably British born and educated, they would be more accepting of homosexuality. Infact I've read recently there Is a growing number of homosexual muslims 'coming out of the closet', there is likely a larger population of gay people in the Muslim community but won't express sexuality out openly due to a number of factors. I have nothing against muslims or any faith, if you believe being gay should be illegal that's your opinion, everyone is entitled to one.
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      (Original post by Josb)
      Several studies have shown that many young Muslims are more radical than their parents.
      Indeed, but I don't see how Muslims living in the West could carry on becoming more and more extreme as generations pass. Their conservatism may plateau and then decline.
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      Yes of course you do! I hate islamophobia as much as you do, most decent British people appreciate and support British Muslims and the contribution s you've made to britaIn
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      (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
      Indeed, but I don't see how Muslims living in the West could carry on becoming more and more extreme as generations pass. Their conservatism may plateau and then decline.
      In ghettos: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...residents.html
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      Don't cite a Daily Mail article and expect people to take you seriously.
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      (Original post by Ladbants)
      No, actually they're allowed to keep their religion since we have freedom of religion in this country. As long as they don't break any British laws by following their religion, they are allowed to stay. And even those who don't abide by British laws aren't going to be deported, they will be tried for their crimes in Britain and sentenced here just like any other British criminal.
      you're not too bad
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      (Original post by Saviorz)
      Don't cite a Daily Mail article and expect people to take you seriously.
      The facts mentioned there are authentic.
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      (Original post by Josb)
      The facts mentioned there are authentic.
      "Many, I imagine, have been brought to the UK" Yep very authentic.
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      (Original post by Saviorz)
      "Many, I imagine, have been brought to the UK" Yep very authentic.
      The fact that almost only radical Muslims live in the ghetto, which was relevant to the discussion.
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      (Original post by Josb)
      The fact that almost only radical Muslims live in the ghetto, which was relevant to the discussion.
      Correlation does not equal to causation, it's an argumental fallacy that most right wingers seem to fall for.
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      (Original post by Saviorz)
      Correlation does not equal to causation, it's an argumental fallacy that most right wingers seem to fall for.
      I was answering someone who asked who could radical Muslims could become more extreme whilst in the UK, I answered him by living in ghettos, and illustrated this with an example of a ghetto. I don't see what the "correlation does not equal causation" has to do with this.
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      (Original post by Josb)
      I was answering someone who asked who could radical Muslims could become more extreme whilst in the UK, I answered him by living in ghettos, and illustrated this with an example of a ghetto. I don't see what the "correlation does not equal causation" has to do with this.
      First of all there is no evidence that there is an increase in ghettos. So this would mean there won't necessarily be a greater number of conservative muslims. The person you replied to said that the conservative views would plateau and decline, which you conveniently ignored.

      Second of all, a correlation between ghettos and extremism does not mean that ghettos are the root cause of extremism nor does it spur extremism. Ghettos are just a term used by people to make it seem like some sort of invasion. The whole point of the fallacy is that its used by lazy people that fail to consider all the factors within an issue, in this case socio-economic ones.
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      (Original post by c0lew0rld)
      As Islamophobia is on the rise, and it's only going to get worst as time goes by.
      what you think will happen in 20 years will the Muslim continue to grow, or will all Muslim be departed in present .
      I think the second is likely more (i'm Muslim btw)
      As a Ummah, we're not doing well, there's no unity between Muslims anymore.its a sad fact. If there's no unity what will become of us? We will struggle to fight. It's been written somewhere, I can't remember from where exactly but... Even though there soooo many Muslims in this world, we still cannot unite and fight for what is right. We are all just so lost,especially the youth, they're more confused than ever. Not saying all are like that but let's be honest majority of us are. I'm 17 years old, I may not have enough experience but I have quite a lot of knowledge about our religion.
      The Ummah will be reunited once we wake up from this fantasy world
      This is a sign of the end of times..
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      Once the old fashioned ones die out and become the minority of the religion.

      If it continues the way it is now, I reckon full on bans will come on the religion eventually
     
     
     
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