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Scary Trump rally; what on earth is going on!? Watch

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    (Original post by Wōden)
    Okay, AlexanderHam, we get it already. You don't like Trump.
    Why does there always have to be some whiney comment along these lines every time there is a thread made against Trump?

    Does the fact I dislike Trump have any actual bearing on the matter? Are you only capable of perceiving this through some childish lens of, "Oh, well you don't like him".

    I fundamentally object to his policies. I think he's an awful human being. So yes, I don't like him. And...?
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Why does there always have to be some whiney comment along these lines every time there is a thread made against Trump?

    Does the fact I dislike Trump have any actual bearing on the matter? Are you only capable of perceiving this through some childish lens of, "Oh, well you don't like him".

    I fundamentally object to his policies. I think he's an awful human being. So yes, I don't like him. And...?

    Which of his policies is it that you object to?
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    (Original post by joe cooley)
    Which of his policies is it that you object to?
    First and foremost, foreign policy. His shilling for Vladimir Putin is utterly disgraceful, and he stumbles from one ill-thought through statement to the next. A few weeks ago he was blustering that we should have a new nuclear arms race against Russia. And then last week, he said that we should cancel the new sanctions against Russia in exchange for nuclear arms reductions.

    The policy is completely misconceived. Firstly, why should we bribe Russia with sanctions cancellation to do something that is in their interests? (nuclear arms reductions). In fact, they haven't even fully complied with their reduction obligations under the SORT treaty. Why should we give them benefits to do something that is in their interests to do and which they have already agreed to do?

    Second, Trump intends to allow Russia to get away with their outrageous interference in the US election, that we should "move on with our lives". That is utterly nauseating; Trump is so thin-skinned and insecure that he feels that any acknowledgement of Russia's actions undermines his legitimacy. The election has happened, he has been elected president. Acknowledging Russia interfered in the election doesn't change that fact, and it undermines America's strength to allow another country to get away with this. It undermines cyber-deterrence, and tells our adversaries, "You can get away with any hacking you want to do if you can somehow tie it to Trump and make him feel like his political interests are engaged and require him to deny/minimise said hacking".

    Third, his willingness to accede to Russia's annexation of the Crimea is disgraceful. There are many other things I could refer to, and happy to expand on them if asked (as long as there is reciprocal discussion, not just "Yeah, expand!").

    On domestic policy, he talks like Bernie Sanders and then acts like a mainstream Republican, appointing Wall Street spivs like Munchkin (Mnuchin, the Goldman Sachs spiv) to head the Treasury department, and appointing Wall Street lawyer to be the SEC regulator. It's laughable that Trump said in his inaug. speech "The time for empty words is over", as if he is not the most guilty person of that in American politics right now (what happened to Mexico paying for the wall?). He claims to be a populist and against the establishment, and then goes ahead and puts extremely pro-establishment people in important government positions.

    He's appointed big donors to important policy positions, to a degree that the Clintons never dreamed of doing. In short, he's a complete hypocrite. He has no intention of taking on Wall Street. He has no intention of draining the swamp. His supporters were gulled because they valued electing someone who seems not to be politically correct more than valuing someone who will actually do things that benefit ordinary people
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    First and foremost, foreign policy. His shilling for Vladimir Putin is utterly disgraceful, and he stumbles from one ill-thought through statement to the next. A few weeks ago he was blustering that we should have a new nuclear arms race against Russia. And then last week, he said that we should cancel the new sanctions against Russia in exchange for nuclear arms reductions.

    The policy is completely misconceived. Firstly, why should we bribe Russia with sanctions cancellation to do something that is in their interests? (nuclear arms reductions). In fact, they haven't even fully complied with their reduction obligations under the SORT treaty. Why should we give them benefits to do something that is in their interests to do and which they have already agreed to do?

    Second, Trump intends to allow Russia to get away with their outrageous interference in the US election, that we should "move on with our lives". That is utterly nauseating; Trump is so thin-skinned and insecure that he feels that any acknowledgement of Russia's actions undermines his legitimacy. The election has happened, he has been elected president. Acknowledging Russia interfered in the election doesn't change that fact, and it undermines America's strength to allow another country to get away with this. It undermines cyber-deterrence, and tells our adversaries, "You can get away with any hacking you want to do if you can somehow tie it to Trump and make him feel like his political interests are engaged and require him to deny/minimise said hacking".

    Third, his willingness to accede to Russia's annexation of the Crimea is disgraceful. There are many other things I could refer to, and happy to expand on them if asked (as long as there is reciprocal discussion, not just "Yeah, expand!".

    On domestic policy, he talks like Bernie Sanders and then acts like a mainstream Republican, appointing Wall Street spivs like Munchkin (Mnuchin, the Goldman Sachs spiv) to head the Treasury department, and appointing Wall Street lawyer to be the SEC regulator. It's laughable that Trump said in his inaug. speech "The time for empty words is over", as if he is not the most guilty person of that in American politics right now (what happened to Mexico paying for the wall?). He claims to be a populist and against the establishment, and then goes ahead and puts extremely pro-establishment people in important government positions.

    He's appointed big donors to important policy positions, to a degree that the Clintons never dreamed of doing. In short, he's a complete hypocrite. He has no intention of taking on Wall Street. He has no intention of draining the swamp. His supporters were gulled because they valued electing someone who seems not to be politically correct more than valuing someone who will actually do things that benefit ordinary people
    So basically, you're against better relations between the US and Russia.

    Why?

    Considering the close relationships the West has with some of the most vicious backward regimes in the world, why is Russia different?

    The wall?

    Hes been President for one day,how long do you think it will take to build a 1500 mile long wall?

    Are there some establishment types in his administration, indeed there are.

    Are there some outsiders, you bet there are.

    Some of them are even on record as uttering the phrase "Islamic terrorism"!

    The horror,the horror.

    Goldman Sachs, that's the outfit Hilary give a paid speech to and wouldn't release the transcripts isn't it?

    LOL

    Out of curiosity, do you believe the left wing meltdown will last for all of Trumps first term?

    I do hope so.
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    (Original post by joe cooley)
    So basically, you're against better relations between the US and Russia.
    I'm not against better relations with Russia if they are willing to behave properly and bring themselves into the community of nations. Thus far, Putin has made it clear he will not.

    Both Bush 43 and Obama tried to have good relations with Putin. Obama had naively assumed that the bad relations between the US and Russia were the fault of the evil neocons, and as soon as someone sensible and friendly got into the White House, all those disagreements would fall away as good sense and self-interest took hold. They tried to "reset" relations.

    It failed because Putin is not interested in behaving like a modern, civilised leader. His deviousness, his violence, his contempt for human rights, have all made a normal relationship impossible. The invasion of Ukraine, the annexation of Crimea, the shootdown of MH17 (resulting in so many deaths of Dutch, Malaysians, British and Australians), his blank cheque support for Assad and willingness to use the most indiscriminate aerial firepower against civilians, his use of cyberwarfare and political warfare against the US in the 2016 elections... these demonstrate Putin's mentality.

    So yes; I do not support bending over for Russia. If the Russians are willing to reform their behaviour and make amends for past outrages, if he will pull out of (at least) eastern Ukraine and apologise for the 2016 hacking, then we can consider improving the relationship between us.

    Out of curiosity, do you believe the left wing meltdown will last for all of Trumps first term?
    It's unclear what you're talking about. Feel free to elaborate and perhaps then

    It is quite funny how alt-reich special snowflakes are so sensitive about protests against Trump. They claim to be for free speech but they just cannot stand being protested against. It's almost like, deep down, they crave respectability; they desperately want the left to think well of them.
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    there is a European version of this charming performance too

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGvkIfu9u6Q

    there was also a Native American one, but this has been taken down
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    I'm not against better relations with Russia if they are willing to behave properly and bring themselves into the community of nations. Thus far, Putin has made it clear he will not.

    Both Bush 43 and Obama tried to have good relations with Putin. Obama had naively assumed that the bad relations between the US and Russia were the fault of the evil neocons, and as soon as someone sensible and friendly got into the White House, all those disagreements would fall away as good sense and self-interest took hold. They tried to "reset" relations.

    It failed because Putin is not interested in behaving like a modern, civilised leader. His deviousness, his violence, his contempt for human rights, have all made a normal relationship impossible. The invasion of Ukraine, the annexation of Crimea, the shootdown of MH17 (resulting in so many deaths of Dutch, Malaysians, British and Australians), his blank cheque support for Assad and willingness to use the most indiscriminate aerial firepower against civilians, his use of cyberwarfare and political warfare against the US in the 2016 elections... these demonstrate Putin's mentality.

    So yes; I do not support bending over for Russia. If the Russians are willing to reform their behaviour and make amends for past outrages, if he will pull out of (at least) eastern Ukraine and apologise for the 2016 hacking, then we can consider improving the relationship between us.



    It's unclear what you're talking about. Feel free to elaborate and perhaps then

    It is quite funny how alt-reich special snowflakes are so sensitive about protests against Trump. They claim to be for free speech but they just cannot stand being protested against. It's almost like, deep down, they crave respectability; they desperately want the left to think well of them.
    Ah, so you're upset over Russian hacking.

    How about the Chinese hacking that went on, not so bothered about that?

    Or is it that the supposed Russian hacking showed American voters how corrupt Hilary and the Democratic party are, while the Chinese merely exposed sensitive military information?

    You have me all wrong.

    The collective meltdown the left are enjoying at the moment is fantastic.

    From the worthless scum marauding on US streets to the Hollywood/MSM scum dismissing the opinions of ordinary American people all they are achieving is to expose the true face of the left.

    Lets hope they keep it up.
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    (Original post by joe cooley)
    will last for all of Trumps first term?
    The better question is whether Trump will last for the entirety of his first term.

    He's the most unpopular man to take presidential office since polling began. When President Obama took office in 2009 he had an approval rating of 68%. He had a deep well of goodwill from independents and even some republicans. He had political capital.

    Trump has none of that. Just 37% of Americans approve of him, 54% do not. Unlike previous presidents, he's had no honeymoon, he had no reserve of goodwill, no political capital to spend.

    So pretending as though somehow it is some minority left-wing position to find him disagreeable is either delusion or dishonesty on your part (I suspect the former; you're probably part of a social media bubble in which you genuinely think Trump is popular).

    It's actually a good thing for the left that Trump won. After eight years in power the left needs a break. Can you imagine how bad the reversal would be if Clinton had won? Now the left can look forward to a man who will make George W Bush look sane and popular. The right will be so discredited by the Trump years that the democrats will be cashing the Trump cheque for years to come. His legitimacy is already low because of his getting 3 million votes less than Clinton, and then on top having been supported by the Russian state.

    That state of affairs will only get worse now that the buck stops with him and he can't blame anyone but himself for the monumental failures that are to come (although he will no doubt try to blame the media, left-wing protesters and other easy targets... that's easy, that's playing to his mindless base. But middle America will not be impressed)
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    (Original post by joe cooley)
    Ah, so you're upset over Russian hacking.
    I object to a foreign state hacking Western individuals, companies or government departments. If a foreign state does this, they must be punished.

    Like most on the alt-reich, you don't oppose that because you are more loyal to Russia than to the West. The alt-reich has no patriotism; they value political partisanship over national security, and if that means supporting Russia over their own country, they will do that if they believe it serves the right-wing's political interests. Alt-reichers are so weak and morally bankrupt, it's pathetic.

    How about the Chinese hacking that went on, not so bothered about that?
    Typical mindless partisan talking point. First, I did oppose that Chinese hacking and I was of the view that China should be punished. Second, President Obama did respond to the hacking by issuing indictments and in the end the Chinese agreed to a moratorium on commercial hacking and both sides agreed that espionage hacking would be considered analogous to previous espionage.

    Third, there is a clear difference between, as the Chinese did, hacking the OPM to obtain government records (which is normal espionage) and hacking, as the Russians did, a US political party and then leaking the documents to damage one candidate and support the other candidate who is their shill and they know will serve their interests.

    If you can't grasp that fairly clear distinction you are either ignorant or dishonest.

    Russian hacking showed American voters how corrupt Hilary and the Democratic party are
    Really? What bribes or corruption did that hack expose? Name three illegal acts or bribes it disclosed

    In any case, thanks for confirming that your support lies with Russia rather than the West.
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    The better question is whether Trump will last for the entirety of his first term.

    He's the most unpopular man to take presidential office since polling began. When President Obama took office in 2009 he had an approval rating of 68%. He had a deep well of goodwill from independents and even some republicans. He had political capital.

    Trump has none of that. Just 37% of Americans approve of him, 54% do not. Unlike previous presidents, he's had no honeymoon, he had no reserve of goodwill, no political capital to spend.

    So pretending as though somehow it is some minority left-wing position to find him disagreeable is either delusion or dishonesty on your part (I suspect the former; you're probably part of a social media bubble in which you genuinely think Trump is popular).

    It's actually a good thing for the left that Trump won. After eight years in power the left needs a break. Can you imagine how bad the reversal would be if Clinton had won? Now the left can look forward to a man who will make George W Bush look sane and popular. The right will be so discredited by the Trump years that the democrats will be cashing the Trump cheque for years to come. His legitimacy is already low because of his getting 3 million votes less than Clinton, and then on top having been supported by the Russian state.

    That state of affairs will only get worse now that the buck stops with him and he can't blame anyone but himself for the monumental failures that are to come (although he will no doubt try to blame the media, left-wing protesters and other easy targets... that's easy, that's playing to his mindless base. But middle America will not be impressed)
    Wrong on all counts.

    Of course its not only the left that are outraged at Trums victory, establishment Republicans are as outraged too, if not more so.

    It is fantastic how many people have developed the ability to see into the future since Trump won the election.

    the monumental failures that are to come

    Wow,simply amazing!

    How about tonights lottery,couldn't give me the numbers could you?
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    There's something completely dystopian and weird about this Trump rally. It's even scarier when the fat, stupid audience members start clapping at 0:24
    yeah, I'll happily admit: that child "dancing and singing for politicians" stuff is creepy as sin
    you could compare it so much to this:

    even if trump *was* elected and isn't a dictator, the fact that you're resorting to using kids as political ammunition is just wrong. it's kind of the same as telling children what to believe religiously - they're just too young to really understand it enough and it just screams "brainwashing"
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    (Original post by Len Goodman)
    I see nothing wrong with gender roles whatsoever. The world has worked perfectly fine operating under traditional gender roles - if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
    I say we go back to when female humans were polygamous.
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    (Original post by jambojim97)
    Well if you're going via that narrative then you can, because the girls (children) were dressed in a rather sexualised manner acting out stereotypical gender roles. Plus it seems a tad paedophilic.
    Agreed. It's weird to dress young girls in clothing like that and get them to act all sassy. But in Trumpland this is considered normal behaviour (in fact, the Trump supporters seemed to think them quite talented; a withering indictment if ever there was one)
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    (Original post by HopelessMedic)
    but the lengths which you go to in order to attack him is embarrassing.
    What, like pointing out things he's actually said and done? How underhanded

    From your numerous threads before, during and after the election you seem unable to comprehend the fact that some people disagree with you on Trump
    I don't realise there are people who have a different opinion to mine on Trump? Hmm.

    and instead just continue to bash him in the hop that everyone will finally see the light and adapt your viewpoint.
    You should probably pack in the poundshop pop psychology. You're not very good at it.

    You don't seem able to grasp the idea that seem people might post on here as a forum through which to express one's opinion, rather than out of a desire to convert people. If people do change their opinion of Trump I would be gratified indeed, but if they are credulous enough to support him now, in full-knowledge of what a scumbag he is, it's unlikely that any new outrages to which I draw their attention is going to change their position.

    I post on here about Trump because I like to express my opinion. There are people on here who agree with my opinion.

    In short, stop being such a cuck. If you're such a snowflake that someone expressing an emphatic political opinion upsets you, then feel free not to click onto the thread. No-one is forcing you to read something that will cause you offence. One might even conclude that you get off on feeling offended

    Whilst the whole thing was completely cringeworthy there was absolutely nothing paedophilic about those kids singing a song
    I didn't say there was something paedophilic about singing a song. I agreed with the other poster who said it seemed a "tad" paedophilic, and said (in my words) that it seems weird. And it is weird; it's messed up to dress young girls in skimpy clothing and get them to act all sassy.


    , if it had occurred at any other event you wouldn't have cared.[/QUOTE]
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    It is quite funny how alt-reich special snowflakes are so sensitive about protests against Trump. They claim to be for free speech but they just cannot stand being protested against. It's almost like, deep down, they crave respectability; they desperately want the left to think well of them.
    Trump is the president of the people. Except all the people in population centres protesting :-/

    Also +1 on the Russia thing.
 
 
 
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