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    (Original post by mobbsy91)
    Where did you get moving opening times from me saying having LONGER opening times...
    So you just want to try to force all GPs to work like 60 hour weeks? And for the same pay, I take it? :laugh:

    We can wave goodbye to all our GPs then...

    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    by mostly privatising it to be honest
    there are countires like singapore and taiwan that operate under mostly private delivery but they operate under some basic regulations i.e. price ceilings for certain treatments, less red tape for small business entry, etc and they are some of the best quality health systems in the world - in fact, singapore is rated higher than the UK.
    Comparing the UK and Singapore is a complete falsehood. If we had their young person to old person ratio we'd have amazing healthcare too.
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    (Original post by nexttime)
    So you just want to try to force all GPs to work like 60 hour weeks? And for the same pay, I take it? :laugh:

    We can wave goodbye to all our GPs then...



    Comparing the UK and Singapore is a complete falsehood. If we had their young person to old person ratio we'd have amazing healthcare too.
    No... are you actually reading what I've said... I also agreed with you that we need MORE GPs...

    So, MORE GPs, LONGER opening times for specific surgeries where it's clear that it's really needed, with continued monitoring to ensure that they're being deployed in the right surgeries.
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    (Original post by mobbsy91)
    No... are you actually reading what I've said...
    I specifically, clearly stated in both of my initial posts to you that if you're saying you also want more GPs then i agree with you, whereas you didn't once mention GP numbers...
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    (Original post by nexttime)
    I specifically, clearly stated in both of my initial posts to you that if you're saying you also want more GPs then i agree with you...
    So, then we're definitely in agreement! Now just to really sort the problem and get more GPs and be able to pay them all
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    (Original post by nexttime)
    Comparing the UK and Singapore is a complete falsehood. If we had their young person to old person ratio we'd have amazing healthcare too.
    then why is japan doing better than us when their population is aging much more than ours...?
    https://www.numbeo.com/health-care/r...by_country.jsp
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    (Original post by mobbsy91)
    It's going to take A LOT to save the NHS - I think at the moment, it's more about managing the current problems we have with it to a sufficient level, and then giving the funding to ensure that we can improve and increase the infrastructure to be able to handle the increasing capacity as the population grows, and people live longer...

    I think helping the services who help patients once they're discharged is key, because without those services ready to accept discharged patients, many beds are taken up when they could be given to someone who needs it...

    Also, not that I'm blaming GPs but I do think we need to have longer opening hours for GP surgeries - not for every surgery, but for those where there's evidence that the extended hours would be used... For example where waiting times are 2 weeks + I think it'd be appropriate to at least trial longer opening hours... Also educating people on when to go to A&E and when they just need to man up a bit...
    There's a recruitment crisis for GPs. It's better to educate people on visiting GPs too. Like don't book an appointment for a non-serious cold.
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    There should be far more of an emphasis being placed on prevention rather than curing. Research and development should be ramped up considerably, although that would be a rather long-term approach to it.

    I'd be more than happy to take a disbanded NHS in exchange for very capable prevention mechanisms being made available in a couple decades' time thanks to the money being invested in R&D. An example would be the funding of initiatives such as SENS.

    Other than that, the NHS could survive if only the government were to employ Modern Monetary Theory. In essence, print out money to keep the NHS going, and as such have the NHS as one of the principal drivers of the economy (rather than shoving money into the hands of banks that are too afraid to even lend it out, which is what they were supposed to do). No, inflation would be an issue if the whole issue would be managed well.
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    (Original post by Cherub012)
    There's a recruitment crisis for GPs. It's better to educate people on visiting GPs too. Like don't book an appointment for a non-serious cold.
    I most definitely agree with this, it's absolutely ludicrous some of the reasons people go...

    I saw a program where a woman went in to check she wasn't pregnant, even though she'd done many pregnancy tests, and when the doctor asked her if she had a test with her, she said yes, did it, and it was negative again, and all the doctor said what that, yes, she wasn't pregnant... bloody ridiculous!
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    then why is japan doing better than us when their population is aging much more than ours...?
    https://www.numbeo.com/health-care/r...by_country.jsp
    Interesting that you now pick a source that has Singapore lower than the UK despite just singing its praises.

    Also, whilst far from an expert on healthcare in Sri Lanka, it surprises me that that index has it rated literally 6th in the world. From a country that ranks 125th in terms of spending. Why aren't you raving about the miracles being pulled off there?

    Possible explanations for Japan doing well is a genetic preponderance for longer life, low rates of violent crime, low rates of smoking and drinking, low rates of obesity.

    I'm not here to argue that the UK is the best. That's for people much smarter than me to decide. Just to point out that the common comparison made with Singapore is not a valid one.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)

    the NHS is becoming a bit of a ruin. the last 3 times I went to the doctors (and I was actually very ill) I waited 35 minutes, then 50 minutes, then ****ing 1 hour and 15 minutes for my ****ing appointments - and the latter was for a ****ing nurse. why am I waiting so long for somebody to give me a ****ing permission slip for anti-biotics? let me get it myself ffs
    I've also been hospitalised by some drunk thug and I waited 7 HOURS to get treatments. because it took so long my injuries scarred. they never even gave me ****ing ice.
    You have a 10 minute slot. I've had some appointments which are about 2 minutes. Other take far longer because they are far more complex.
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    (Original post by aj123456)
    How would you save the NHS?
    I think this question highlights one of the reasons why the NHS is suffering.

    I, personally, could do absolutely nothing to save the NHS. Nor could any other individual.

    It is the responsibility of everyone to make sure that less pressure is placed on NHS services, be it through understanding when/when not to go to A&E or visit your GP, or living a healthier life so you don't develop a disease which is expensive to treat (such as diabetes).

    If we give ourselves this idea that the only thing which could 'save' the NHS is some man or woman who can wave a magic wand and make it better is never going to help improve the situation of health in this country, which is pretty poor.
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    (Original post by nexttime)
    Interesting that you now pick a source that has Singapore lower than the UK despite just singing its praises.
    I *did* say singapore *and* taiwan.
    taiwan is 3rd and basically has the exact same system as singapore

    Also, whilst far from an expert on healthcare in Sri Lanka, it surprises me that that index has it rated literally 6th in the world. From a country that ranks 125th in terms of spending. Why aren't you raving about the miracles being pulled off there?
    okay I will?

    Possible explanations for Japan doing well is a genetic preponderance for longer life, low rates of violent crime, low rates of smoking and drinking, low rates of obesity.
    this is the index of "health care", not "health" though
    and, again, surely they balance their generally better health with an aging population factor?

    I'm not here to argue that the UK is the best. That's for people much smarter than me to decide. Just to point out that the common comparison made with Singapore is not a valid one.
    I don't think the UK is the worst system in the world, not by a long shot, I just think that it's inefficient. the USA is worse though in the way they have their over-regulated private~ style of provision.
    fine then, maybe I confused singapore with south korea - I haven't even look at these figures in years
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    (Original post by Tiger Rag)
    You have a 10 minute slot. I've had some appointments which are about 2 minutes. Other take far longer because they are far more complex.
    yeah but they aren't going to take longer calling for the next appointee if they've already finished with their last one who took a shorter time. surely not. my appointments are always about 5 minutes yet I spend an eternity in the waiting room. and what really rubs salt into the wound is the fact that I can't even listen to music in there when I have to listen up for them calling my name. call me fussy but I'm just so used to being put in a horrendously long queue for a diagnosis that I already understand. i.e. I've had tonsillitis 3 times in my life and I've had iritis twice - sitting in a room to wait for them to tell me what I already know I have is such a waste of time and tax money. they really ought to be some kind of system of exceptions for people who have the basic sense and memory to understand that what they probably have is what it is. the prescription system is so cumbersome to people with this kind of situation.
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    the fundamental problem the NHS faces, is it;s status as a religion ofthe left, and becasue of the way Labour is funded by Unions a religion of Labour and especially the clause4 istas

    Here is an uncomfortable truth for those people - THE VAST MAJORITY OF NHS FUNDED PATIENT INTERACTIONS , HAVE ON CONTINOUS BASIS SINCE 1948 TAKEN PLACE IN 'PRIVATE' SETTINGS .

    GPs always been private, Dentists always been private, community Pharmacy always been private, Opticians always been private ...

    There is no implicit or explicit reason why any service has to be state owned , instead the Union types and clasue 4 istas insist o nthe nHS draggign round 70 years of useless baggage and outdated working practice.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    You clicked on it 65 times? lol

    Its a lot less effort for me to type it 64 times than it is for you to click on it 64 times.

    I write both things once, and have 2 levels. Copy paste. Copy paste. Copy paste. Copy paste. Copy paste. Done

    But you?
    "Hmm, I wonder what's in the spoiler"
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    "Wow, that was worth it" - ehh, probably not.
    Reported for spam.

    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    why am I waiting so long for somebody to give me a ****ing permission slip for anti-biotics? let me get it myself ffs.
    What do you mean?
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    why am I waiting so long for somebody to give me a ****ing permission slip for anti-biotics? let me get it myself ffs
    .
    Because you might be the kind of idiot who takes antibiotics for a viral infection. Antibiotic resistance is no joke.
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    (Original post by Captain Haddock)
    Because you might be the kind of idiot who takes antibiotics for a viral infection. Antibiotic resistance is no joke.
    nah, nah I promise you I'm not. if I have the same illness as many times as that, I know what the problem is. I don't need a doctor to run me through the symptoms. if the doctor takes 50 minutes to see me about it only to confirm what I already know, then surely for both my time and my taxes I am maybe owed at the very least some kind of fast track? if they have my records and they know I've had this kind of condition multiple times then I don't see it being abused very easily.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Euthanise old people.

    Spoiler:
    Show


    I clicked on every one of them. Cool.
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    (Original post by Cherub012)
    Reported for spam.



    What do you mean?
    what I'm saying that if I have had an illness whereby the treatment requires a doctor's prescriptions (i.e. let's say steroids for iritis or antibiotics for tonsillitis) my time that I have to wait to see a doctor ought to be in proportion to the certainty that I have the same illness again. if I've had it twice, I ought to see a doctor twice as quickly for it. if I have it three times, then maybe three times quicker, etc. I shouldn't be made to wait almost an hour just to reaffirm my own knowledge on what the obvious condition is. if I'm not allowed or trusted to get the prescription myself (which I think I ought to be if I have a history of a certain condition that I can prove), then at the very least I ought to have better access, because making me wait for almost an hour for no good reason for a very quick appointment is ****ing stupid.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    what I'm saying that if I have had an illness whereby the treatment requires a doctor's prescriptions (i.e. let's say steroids for iritis or antibiotics for tonsillitis) my time that I have to wait to see a doctor ought to be in proportion to the certainty that I have the same illness again. if I've had it twice, I ought to see a doctor twice as quickly for it. if I have it three times, then maybe three times quicker, etc. I shouldn't be made to wait almost an hour just to reaffirm my own knowledge on what the obvious condition is. if I'm not allowed or trusted to get the prescription myself (which I think I ought to be if I have a history of a certain condition that I can prove), then at the very least I ought to have better access, because making me wait for almost an hour for no good reason for a very quick appointment is ****ing stupid.
    Except, they're not making you wait for no good reason. For all you know, the GP could be seeing someone has a much more serious medical problem than you.
 
 
 
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