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Do you think that Brexit will be a good thing for this country long term? watch

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    (Original post by Alfissti)
    It will bring about new challenges and new opportunities.

    Don't ever fret that UK won't be able to trade with the EU just because there isn't membership of the single market.

    20 years ago everyone said UK will die standing because it wasn't part of the Eurozone. If it didn't die then, it won't die now or in the future.
    No, actually 20 years ago most people in the country, including parliament, said that we should not join the Eurozone.

    Of course we will still be able to trade with the EU - just on less favourable terms than they trade with each other. Difficult to see the advantage that gives us.
    • Thread Starter

    (Original post by MagicNMedicine)
    I don't think a lot of people realise what trade deals involve.

    There is a trade off between having trade integration and having sovereignty, which is what the issue was with the EU.

    Sign a trade deal with the US for instance, and they are likely to demand a large say over the UK's regulation standards. Because a lot of US products don't meet the safety requirements to get in the EU they will want to be able to export to the UK so they will lock the UK in to not being able to prohibit a lot of chemicals especially in teh food sector. They will also want a lot of say over the UK environmental regulations as they will want to prevent the UK from bringing in environmental protections that harm the profits of US businesses. And they may well push for us to open up the NHS and care services to private competition from the UK.

    Also all the trade deals the US pushes for involve a supranational court that will be above any British court so if a US firm had a dispute with a rule a future UK government would bring in, they would be able to sue the government at a supranational court and get compensation from the UK taxpayer.

    Also when we look to sign a deal with India or other fast growing developing countries, they are likely to push for liberalisation of visa rules for their nationals, so to get access to their markets we will be pressured in to making it easier for their nationals to come to the UK.

    And a lot of people in the left behind industrial working class communities of the UK that currently complain about jobs going to immigrants, will find that jobs are going to cheap competition from elsewhere, because when we sign trade deals with China and other developing countries it will mean they have tariff free access to sell cheap goods in the UK which will knock out a lot of UK industry.

    Now a lot of people on the Brexit side will not mind this kind of stuff, because they want to scrap food safety / environmental regulations anyway, they see all that as "red tape", and also they will be more than happy to lock the UK in to trade deals that restrict the actions of a future government, eg if a Labour/Liberal coalition were to come in and want to restore environmental protections, the US-UK trade deal will prevent that just like EU rules prevented a lot of the freedom of movement of UK governments while we were inside it.

    The alternative is that if all these trade deals are subject to full parliamentary scrutiny, many of them will not get through because even on the Conservative side there are MPs that would be horrified at the idea of Britain surrendering a lot of the freedom of future Parliaments to make our own laws and certainly horrified at teh idea of supranational investor-state dispute settlement courts coming in over the heads of British courts. Which will mean that not many trade deals actually get done, in which case the UK will have maximum sovereignty it just means there will be some barriers to trade.

    What we may see is a real push to try and keep the detail of trade deals out of scrutiny from Parliament and out of the eyes of the media. TTIP was a classic example, that deal was shrouded in secrecy because they didn't want too much attention drawn to what was being discussed. In the end the Europeans decided they couldn't stomach it and it died. The big battle for sovereignty ahead will be fought around trade deals - particularly with the US, but don't be surprised if many of those who argued against the EU on sovereignty grounds are very eager for us to sign away sovereignty to the US, because it will lock the UK in to being the kind of low-regulation anything goes economy that they would like.
    Surely we could still impose tariffs on goods imported from those countries also the first paragraph doesn't make sense. Also people keep talking about 'trade deals' but surely having a successful economy is based on having a product that people want to buy. If you look at Japan they sell cars both to the US and Europe as an independent nation.

    I love Brexit, it means that people, such as the Pope are kicked out of the country.
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