InArduisFouette
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#21
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#21
(Original post by KenHall06)
What a complete Muppet you are! i actually think your dangerous! i could use a lot stronger language but i don’t think you would understand me! You obviously don’t have a grasp about radiation protection and all these people you talk about in IR(ME) Regs are they all Consultant ?? Hence doctors???. Also explain what are Practioners? and operators??
i'd question your understanding of IR(ME)R

referrers can be any appropriately educated health professional , personally i know of referrers who are

-Doctors
-Nurses
-radiographers with extensive additional training in clinical assessment and examination
-podiatrists
-paramedics ( working in Emergency care practitioner roles)
-physios
- dentists

Operators are mainly radiographers and radiologists but i know of a variety of other Health professionals who are operators, many dentists are operators for dental plain film , and there are increasing numbers of doctors who are operators for various items of radiological kit used in interventional procedures ( e.g. cardiologists and hand surgeons to mention a few)


practitioners as defined in IR(ME)R

"(2) The practitioner shall be responsible for the justification of a medical exposure and such other aspects of a medical exposure as is provided for in these Regulations."

Also please since you know a lot about the automatic exposure devices (AED) tell me about them?? (i never use this AED, i set my own exposures) When have YOU used this device as if you are not trained in radiation protection it really should be classed as a clinical incident! Bit like you really how scary are you!
i see the usual last resort of those who realise they cannot blag their way out of a hole rears it;s ugly head ... at what point have i ever stated that i've used medicla imaging kit ....

you are the 'scary' one that you have such a lack of insight on the accountability of the health professionals who are actually looking after the patients

You have just sited all the reason why you need Radiographers and Radiologists along with your shocking use of spelling. I hope I never have to come across you in my professional career as I could happily kick you out of my x-ray room!
what reasons would those be ?

for many straightforward plain film images the radiographer can quite easily be replaced with a pure technician operator as can be seen from the places elsewhere in the world who have pure technician operators or i nthe UK where there are Asssitant practitioners who are authorised to be operators for certain imaging investigations

i hope never to have to work with such an arrogant individual who has such a limited insight into the education of other health professionals, and such a lack of respect for Referrers
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Theo1977
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#22
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#22
(Original post by KenHall06)
even tho we are the most important people in the hosptal DONT get any grattiude for the job we do! everyone in the hospital takes us for granted, however the whole hospital will but up ****e street without us!
Get over yourself. :rolleyes: This applies to absolutely every single job in every hospital anywhere. Doctors, nurses, medical directors, janitors, cooks, cleaners, receptionists, the admin staff who look after the paperwork... if they weren't necessary, they wouldn't be there!

The only possible exception is the people who work in the vastly overpriced hospital shops.

And the most important people in any hospital are, believe it or not, the patients.
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little_miss_sunshine24
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#23
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#23
I have to say KenHall06 has hijacked most of the radiography threads and turned them into quite negative posts.

I would like to mention to KenHall06 about the post i wrote earlier on this thread when i referred the poster to look at the HPC website in order to find out what qualifications are necessary to practice as a radiographer in the UK that you cannot practice in the UK as a radiographer without being on the HPC register so whereby KenHall06 wrote that the HPC arent much help well.....you're gonna be paying them your reg fee in not quite a years time arent you??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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starz
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#24
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#24
zippyrn... worldwide, nurses are the lowest paid health professionals, why do you think this is?

I knew you couldnt possibly be a doctor by your spelling and syntax...
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KenHall06
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#25
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#25
(Original post by starz)
zippyrn... worldwide, nurses are the lowest paid health professionals, why do you think this is?

I knew you couldnt possibly be a doctor by your spelling and syntax...
Your quite right i am sorry! lets all feel sorry for Nurses shall we! I'd say prob 90% of your profession are a bunch of muppets who fail to have a grasp of Infection Control! I would dearly love to here your taken on the hospital infections!

Where i work on a regular basis you can see your profession coming into work and home in uniforms, how dirty!
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KenHall06
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#26
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#26
(Original post by little_miss_sunshine24)
I have to say KenHall06 has hijacked most of the radiography threads and turned them into quite negative posts.

I would like to mention to KenHall06 about the post i wrote earlier on this thread when i referred the poster to look at the HPC website in order to find out what qualifications are necessary to practice as a radiographer in the UK that you cannot practice in the UK as a radiographer without being on the HPC register so whereby KenHall06 wrote that the HPC arent much help well.....you're gonna be paying them your reg fee in not quite a years time arent you??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
First off you stupid little girl are you a member of the College of Radiographers?? i guess not by your post. You obviously dont have an outlook on who the best people are talk to with regards to people from overseas wanting to come work here!

I suggest you go get back in your box with your little mate and read some more books, as after all as you say Radiotherapy is very hard and your on the hardest course in the UK for it!
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KenHall06
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#27
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#27
(Original post by Theo1977)
Get over yourself. :rolleyes: This applies to absolutely every single job in every hospital anywhere. Doctors, nurses, medical directors, janitors, cooks, cleaners, receptionists, the admin staff who look after the paperwork... if they weren't necessary, they wouldn't be there!

The only possible exception is the people who work in the vastly overpriced hospital shops.

And the most important people in any hospital are, believe it or not, the patients.
I disagree and some points i agree with your post. First off i say **** the medical directors they get paid loads to do what?? push the hospital into debt! Also Janitors just like nurse good to see they can keep the hospitals clean!!

However i do agree that the patients are the most important people in the hospital, however excuse me for saying this but most there is nothing wrong with and they just think they have the devine right to pass comments which piss me right off!

Like i said above the most important people in the hospital are the RADIOGRAPHERS as if it was left to nurses, doctors etc death rates, cancer rates would be through the roof!
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Theo1977
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#28
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#28
(Original post by KenHall06)
Like i said above the most important people in the hospital are the RADIOGRAPHERS as if it was left to nurses, doctors etc death rates, cancer rates would be through the roof!
Love it.:p:

Mr fully qualified, top notch radiographer: "Well, Mr X, I'm sorry to say we've had a good look and you do indeed have cancer. I can tell you its location, shape and size, and based on my experience I can probably give you good odds on your survival rate."

Mr X: "Oh dear. Can you cure me?"

Mr fully qualified, top notch radiographer: "Er, no. You need a doctor for that."

The point is that hospitals operate as a team. EVERYONE in that team is important.

ETA: I don't think you mean cancer rates per se. Cancer mortality rates, perhaps...
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InArduisFouette
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#29
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#29
(Original post by starz)
zippyrn... worldwide, nurses are the lowest paid health professionals, why do you think this is?

I knew you couldnt possibly be a doctor by your spelling and syntax...
sheer weight of numbers drags the modal and mean average wages towards the bottom of the range ... assumptions on that nature fall down when you look at the career structures etc...

also don't forget to factor in the following

- proportion of part time staff

- and in lots of places outside the EU 2 level registration - LPN / EN /Div 2 Nurses will drag down the average wage if you just take 'nurses with professional registration' as the population for pay purposes rather than those with a 'first level' registration.

realistically how much difference does it make whether you earn your 30 k through unsocial hours allowances like the majority of nurses do or through being promoted to band 6 relatively early in your career like PTs /OTs / radiogs ... with limited opportunties for regular unsocial hours income rather than on-calls
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InArduisFouette
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#30
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#30
(Original post by KenHall06)
I disagree and some points i agree with your post. First off i say **** the medical directors they get paid loads to do what??
you really haven't got a clue have you ... the Medical Director (singular) of a trust is a consultant physician or surgeon who spends a proportion of his/her time in clinical paractice and a proportion of his /her time representing the medical staff (i.e. Doctors) at the strategic management level... in the same way the Director of nursing represents the Nursing , midwifery and their auxilliary staff plus in some trusts is the board level representative for many HPC staff groups as well with the professional heads of service at the assistant director level

the people who push trusts into debt are clinical support services who refuse to evolve with the needs of the patient population and those who quite simply waste money by not listening to frontline clinical staff.

push the hospital into debt! Also Janitors just like nurse good to see they can keep the hospitals clean!!

However i do agree that the patients are the most important people in the hospital, however excuse me for saying this but most there is nothing wrong with and they just think they have the devine right to pass comments which piss me right off!

Like i said above the most important people in the hospital are the RADIOGRAPHERS as if it was left to nurses, doctors etc death rates, cancer rates would be through the roof!
what a load of utter tosh

radiotherapy radiographers are an important part of delivering the treatment for some cancer patients - the diagnosis and prescribing of treatment is still down to the medically lead MDT ( most cancer MDTs are medically dominated by virtue of having 3 different sets of Doctors Oncologist, surgeon and radiologist)

why do referrers refer patients for imaging examinations ?

to confirm clinical suspicions or allow a further step in formulating a differential diagnosis ...

the diagnostic radiographer cannot operate in splendid isolation unless they are prepared to invest thousands of hours in developing their skills , knowledge and experience i nthe clinicla assessment of the patient to be able to formulate their won working diagnoses ... this is very apparent i nthe continued attitude of some diagnostic radiographers that any 'negative' plain film result is an unwarranted exposure when in fact it's answered a question - a classic example of this is the typical scenario in the emergency department of the 'Ottawa Positive Ankle' - we know from lots or trials and metanalyses of these many trials the rule is very sensitive in that it doesn't miss fractures, however it's not very specific in that a proportion of ottawa positive ankles 'only' have a severe sprain ... yet still diagnostic radiographers chelp about having to perform the examination idf it comes back as a sprain ... forgettign that if we didn't have the rules there's two possible outcomes

1. we overtreat sprains and create problems down the road...

2. we miss fractures with the associated problems that brings ...
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little_miss_sunshine24
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#31
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#31
Just to clarify i am a member of the society of radiographers KenHall06. The role of the HPC is to oversee the various courses that are approved by the HPC such as radiography,OT, physio etc. By overseeing the courses they lay down the preferred standards as they are the ones that will allow you to practice and if you are not registered with the HPC you cannot work in the UK. The Society of Radiographers represents all radiographers and puts views forward to policies etc.
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KenHall06
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#32
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#32
(Original post by zippyRN)
you really haven't got a clue have you ... the Medical Director (singular) of a trust is a consultant physician or surgeon who spends a proportion of his/her time in clinical paractice and a proportion of his /her time representing the medical staff (i.e. Doctors) at the strategic management level... in the same way the Director of nursing represents the Nursing , midwifery and their auxilliary staff plus in some trusts is the board level representative for many HPC staff groups as well with the professional heads of service at the assistant director level

the people who push trusts into debt are clinical support services who refuse to evolve with the needs of the patient population and those who quite simply waste money by not listening to frontline clinical staff.



what a load of utter tosh

radiotherapy radiographers are an important part of delivering the treatment for some cancer patients - the diagnosis and prescribing of treatment is still down to the medically lead MDT ( most cancer MDTs are medically dominated by virtue of having 3 different sets of Doctors Oncologist, surgeon and radiologist)

why do referrers refer patients for imaging examinations ?

to confirm clinical suspicions or allow a further step in formulating a differential diagnosis ...

the diagnostic radiographer cannot operate in splendid isolation unless they are prepared to invest thousands of hours in developing their skills , knowledge and experience i nthe clinicla assessment of the patient to be able to formulate their won working diagnoses ... this is very apparent i nthe continued attitude of some diagnostic radiographers that any 'negative' plain film result is an unwarranted exposure when in fact it's answered a question - a classic example of this is the typical scenario in the emergency department of the 'Ottawa Positive Ankle' - we know from lots or trials and metanalyses of these many trials the rule is very sensitive in that it doesn't miss fractures, however it's not very specific in that a proportion of ottawa positive ankles 'only' have a severe sprain ... yet still diagnostic radiographers chelp about having to perform the examination idf it comes back as a sprain ... forgettign that if we didn't have the rules there's two possible outcomes

1. we overtreat sprains and create problems down the road...

2. we miss fractures with the associated problems that brings ...
As i really have give up speaking to you as you are cleary not very good at what your doing!

Like i said before if you ENP's and Drs manage to work out justification for request as per Protocol then x-rays will get done.

Also you should note for yourself that us radiographers can operate as ENP's in dept's just look a pindefield hopsital and Southhampton General their radiographers have done MINTS training so they can over rule your dumb ENP's and save the patient a dose. However i dunno why i'm telling you think as you talk a load of rubbish.

I live in hope that one of my professional gives you a slap and bring you back down to earth.

Can i ask why profession are you again?? i'm going for nurse!
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InArduisFouette
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#33
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#33
if i were you i'd go and have another look what the radiographers at Pinderfields actually do do and that is discharge no abnornmality found patients referred by the (off site) WiC after they have been approrpaitely imaged .... MINTS by the way is recognition of the skills knowledge and experience of the people you so dearly deeem to hate - none advanced practitioner Emergency Dept Nurses - recognition that they can accurately assess 'diagnose' and treat a range of minor injuries including sprains, wounds and provide a high quality initial assessment of suspected fractures

i'm not aware of any radiographer Emergency care practitioners vs paramedic , Nurse or physio by initial registration ones...

your comments about requests which can be justified is absolutrly untrue because the same patient with the same presentation who has been knocked back at triage has been imaged when seen by an EM SpR or consultant who has written to all intents and purposes " i agree with the triage nurses initial findings why were they knocked back from imaging ? "

I will also stand by my comments aobut clinical support services such as radioology and labs being one of the blocks to good patient throughput in both the Emergency dept and other assessment settings becasue of the hundreds of incident forms i have written about delays in investigations causing ED 4 hour breaches or otherwise delaying the patient journey, it;s also a recurrent theme in nearly every piece of work that is done to identify why underperfornming emergency and acute assessment services underperform.
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KenHall06
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#34
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#34
(Original post by zippyRN)
if i were you i'd go and have another look what the radiographers at Pinderfields actually do do and that is discharge no abnornmality found patients referred by the (off site) WiC after they have been approrpaitely imaged .... MINTS by the way is recognition of the skills knowledge and experience of the people you so dearly deeem to hate - none advanced practitioner Emergency Dept Nurses - recognition that they can accurately assess 'diagnose' and treat a range of minor injuries including sprains, wounds and provide a high quality initial assessment of suspected fractures

i'm not aware of any radiographer Emergency care practitioners vs paramedic , Nurse or physio by initial registration ones...

your comments about requests which can be justified is absolutrly untrue because the same patient with the same presentation who has been knocked back at triage has been imaged when seen by an EM SpR or consultant who has written to all intents and purposes " i agree with the triage nurses initial findings why were they knocked back from imaging ? "

I will also stand by my comments aobut clinical support services such as radioology and labs being one of the blocks to good patient throughput in both the Emergency dept and other assessment settings becasue of the hundreds of incident forms i have written about delays in investigations causing ED 4 hour breaches or otherwise delaying the patient journey, it;s also a recurrent theme in nearly every piece of work that is done to identify why underperfornming emergency and acute assessment services underperform.
Well i guess im a totally and utterly wrong then aren't i ZippRN.

The end of the day i am really bored of you now, you keep saying nurses this and that and referring to all this information some of which you don’t even understand correctly or what is meant by the terminology so what is the point in me trying to explain the radiographers point of view i bet your hated by the radiographers at the trust your at or they probably just say what a Knob!

If you are so some and know all they why ain’t you a Radiologist writing our protocols for us mere button pushers.

That’s all I have to say as there is no talking to a nurse who hasn’t even got a clue what they are talking about!
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InArduisFouette
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#35
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#35
ken can't find you on the regsiter

you post unsustainable and inaccurate information which is not backed up by other Health professionals - little miss sunshine has posted far more accurate radiographty information ...

If you are a radiography student or even a qualified radiogrpaher ( which given there is no Ken/ Kenneth / Keith Hall on the register, in fact no one called 'Hall' was so ever in Wolverhampton, i truely worry that there is a student / relatively junior radiographer swanning round under the delusion they are the 'most important person' in the hospital,


sorry the 'most important person' in the the hospital is the patient ... the m'most important people' to making the hospital run are Medical staff and Nursing and Midwifery staff becasue when everyone else has gone home or gone to bed it's those staff who keep the care delivery going.

I've got a clue what i'm on aobut thankyou very much , obviously enough of a clue to convince the Radiologists and Consultant Radiographers in the trust i work for that i can be a referrer ...

any Radiologists or Advanced Practitioner Radiographers qualified in USS guided acromio - clavicular chipectomys present ? or do we need to get the Orthopods to do it as an open procedure ?
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little_miss_sunshine24
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#36
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#36
Thanks for your posts ZippyRN i find them interesting. I agree that nurses etc keep the care delivery going, without them what we do wouldnt be much use.
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little_miss_sunshine24
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#37
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#37
(Original post by KenHall06)
Well i guess im a totally and utterly wrong then aren't i ZippRN.

The end of the day i am really bored of you now, you keep saying nurses this and that and referring to all this information some of which you don’t even understand correctly or what is meant by the terminology so what is the point in me trying to explain the radiographers point of view i bet your hated by the radiographers at the trust your at or they probably just say what a Knob!

If you are so some and know all they why ain’t you a Radiologist writing our protocols for us mere button pushers.

That’s all I have to say as there is no talking to a nurse who hasn’t even got a clue what they are talking about!

err no KenHall06 they probably say that about you.
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InArduisFouette
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#38
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#38
(Original post by little_miss_sunshine24)
err no KenHall06 they probably say that about you.
LOL

looks like someone is pushing Ken's buttons today ...
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ataylor222
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#39
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#39
this thread is just one big argument!
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threeportdrift
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#40
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#40
(Original post by ataylor222)
this thread is just one big argument!
And it had been dead and buried for nearly two years until you came along :rolleyes:
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