Oxford Graduate Application 2012/13

It's the Bachelor of Civil Law - the Oxford equivalent of the LLM. Best of luck!

I know about this option in US university application system. when you fill up the information of your referee, there is a option to choose whether you waive the right to see the reference letter. So , yes based on what you have selected you are able to see what is written inside. I din see this option in any other country. But i think referees often don like that the student can watch what they have written, so most of the students just waive the right.

You're certainly right about American grades being inflated. I have a good friend who studies engineering at Berkeley, but he spent a year abroad at my uni... his exam result of 71% (low first here, and very good) was translated into a 98% at Berkeley! Incredible.

Crikey, it's really not impressive is it? Do they even know how much torment they're causing us..? I actually emailed the Oxford MI admissions person two days ago, since I've heard zilch from them yet, saying I really don't want to wait any longer, hinting I might withdraw my app. No reply yet; typical.

71% is just above "fail" in the US system.
You need 90% to get an A, 80% to get a B and 70% to pass the class.

71% on the test means that you answered 29% of questions wrong. How can that be a good thing, even in Berkley? I rarely answer any question wrong on the test, (which is why I have high GPA)

You're very welcome! You might very well be on the shortlist if you haven't heard from them yet, so congrats for that!
I'm also applying for joint masters and PhD programs in the states, but from what I've seen most people who get in already have a masters, so I am not very hopeful. Don't be too impressed by people's stats, a lot of American schools have an inflated grade policy, which makes the average around 3.3 or 3.5... At McGill, where I am currently studying, only 10% of students graduate with 3.45 and above because of grade deflation - GPAs are really relative, so don't let that bring you down!
I'll probably end up doing an MA in the UK and then go wherever I can get funding for a PhD; I have an offer from Durham and one from Edinburgh, but my first choice is definitely Oxford. I haven't heard from anywhere in the US yet!

I am actually getting the similar kind of treatment from The University of Toronto. I applied in late September (probably i even forgot) for January session. Till now they din inform me anything!!! Any time i login to my online application system and it says 'complete'. Then i asked in December about whats going on and no reply. In january they started accepting application for Fall 2012 and still i recieved no acceptance or rejection. I assumed my application is considered for Fall session (may be) but let me know that at least. They even don bother replying my email. And i paid my highest application fees (150 canadian dollar) there. I have stopped thinking about UOT and took that as a gone case but this is just plain stupid.

Hah yeah, cheers. I'd like to think so, though realistically I'm less sure that my apps are still under consideration.

You're certainly right about American grades being inflated. I have a good friend who studies engineering at Berkeley, but he spent a year abroad at my uni... his exam result of 71% (low first here, and very good) was translated into a 98% at Berkeley! Incredible. I don't know about the US/Canada, but here a 2:1 from a top university is *very* much different in standard to one from a lesser uni (and likewise for a 1st).

Oh, I think I completely failed to recognise your username! You're not the Canadian student I attempted to give advice to regarding Leeds and Durham archaeology courses in another thread, are you? :-)

In any case, keep holding out for Oxford, absolutely... Durham and Edinburgh are both excellent unis though. Certainly world-class for your field, I would think. Let us know the news when it comes!

71% is just above "fail" in the US system.
You need 90% to get an A, 80% to get a B and 70% to pass the class.

71% on the test means that you answered 29% of questions wrong. How can that be a good thing, even in Berkley? I rarely answer any question wrong on the test, (which is why I have high GPA)

I don't think you understand quite how different the British education system is. Americans set exams to be *easy* on the whole, and expect near-perfect results. British unis set exams to be *very hard* and expect the average to be in the upper 50s or low 60s, even at top universities. Then there's scaling to equalise exam grades against other modules, which can push it up or down further.

The UC Berkeley administration *know* that 71% is a bloody good result for a UK (Imperial College) exam, and it does indeed correspond to 98% in the Berkeley system. Take an American student at a top uni who's consistently getting in the 90s and put him/her in a British uni, and they will consistently get between the 50s and 70s. *Maybe* the odd 80-something if they're really clever.

Thanks! I don't recall asking advice about either Leeds or Durham, but I'm happy to know that Durham is considered to be a good university, despite the fact that it is completely unknown in Canada!

Both system are indeed very different. Grades also vary dramatically according to subjects. Of course you may answer all the questions right in a science exam, but if you write an English, or classics, or history paper, chances of getting 100% are sub-0, both in the UK or the US. From what I understand, UK science exams also involve longer essay questions that prevent you from getting that 98%.
I must say however that when I went on an exchange to Bristol University, I found it easier to get firsts in all my papers than it is to get an A or A- at my home university (85% and up). The main difference is that a full course load at Bristol is 3 classes, whereas at McGill it is 5 - and McGill classes require the same amount of work or more as the ones at Bristol. (i.e. same number of examinations and similar length and number of essays) That could have been because Bristol isn't that great in classics though, and it's purely based on my personal experience!

It must have been another Canadian student who was coming over to England to study archaeology! She was debating between Durham and Sheffield (not Leeds, though they're really close) actually. Heh, guess it's a popular thing to do over in the old Canadian colonies. ;-)

Durham is awesome. I can seriously recommend the Archaeology department here, it's excellent.

Hehe that's because there isn't much to dig here anyway (no offence to all of those who are into native american arrow heads...) Plus we tend to be well trained for archaeology because we have years of practice at shovelling snow.



I'm so glad to hear it! I've been in communication with Dr. Penelope Wilson who digs in Egypt, and she seems really lovely. If Oxford doesn't want me then it'll be a very good second choice!

Hehe that's because there isn't much to dig here anyway (no offence to all of those who are into native american arrow heads...) Plus we tend to be well trained for archaeology because we have years of practice at shovelling snow.



I'm so glad to hear it! I've been in communication with Dr. Penelope Wilson who digs in Egypt, and she seems really lovely. If Oxford doesn't want me then it'll be a very good second choice!

I am actually getting the similar kind of treatment from The University of Toronto. I applied in early September for January session. Till now they din inform me anything!!! Any time i login to my online application system and it says 'complete'. Then i asked in December about whats going on and no reply. In january they started accepting application for Fall 2012 and still i recieved no acceptance or rejection. I assumed my application is considered for Fall session (may be) but let me know that at least. They even don bother replying my email. And i paid my highest application fees (150 canadian dollar) there. I have stopped thinking about UOT and took that as a gone case but this is just plain stupid.

I don't think you understand quite how different the British education system is. Americans set exams to be *easy* on the whole, and expect near-perfect results. British unis set exams to be *very hard* and expect the average to be in the upper 50s or low 60s, even at top universities. Then there's scaling to equalise exam grades against other modules, which can push it up or down further.

The UC Berkeley administration *know* that 71% is a bloody good result for a UK (Imperial College) exam, and it does indeed correspond to 98% in the Berkeley system. Take an American student at a top uni who's consistently getting in the 90s and put him/her in a British uni, and they will consistently get between the 50s and 70s. *Maybe* the odd 80-something if they're really clever.

I understand very well. Exams are not easy, they reflect what has been covered in the course. And they expect you to have a perfect knowledge of everything that was covered to get close to 100%.
However, this is not the point, the point is that the system is different and it is ridiculous to try and claim that since 71% in Britain = 98% at Berkley it means Berkley is "easy". It is different, that is all. Not easier, not harder - different.

Do not forget one thing - there is a lot more American schools in top 50 than British

ah so if that's you feel then why on Earth are you thinking of applying to Oxford then?

Personal reasons. Besides, I never said Oxford or Cambridge are bad schools, did I? But surely you can not claim that US system is weaker because of the grading scale, as seems to be a suggestion here. Grade deflation or not, this is the best university education in the world, or one of the best, anyway.