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Erdogan reminds Merkel of the misleading nature of the phrase 'Islamist terrorism' watch

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    Edit: Sorry, wrong thread
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    What happened to you mathemagicien? You used to be clever.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    I started going to a very left-wing university, and realised the error of my ways.
    I feel like you're trolling. I mean, quoting a tyrant and using that as a defence against the use of the term "Islamic terrorism" when it is clearly appropriate seems like you're trying to stir up an argument. Which is fair enough I suppose, it is a debate forum.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Trump isn't the only Western leader to be making diplomatic faux pas, it seems.

    Turkish President Erdogan on Thursday rebuked German Chancellor Angela Merkel for using the expression "Islamist terrorism", saying the phrase was not correct and saddened Muslims.

    Speaking after a critical bilateral meeting with Erdogan, Merkel spoke of the need for Turkey and Germany to cooperate even further to fight against terror, including "Islamist terrorism".

    "We spoke in detail about... the questions of the fight against Islamist terrorism, against every form of terrorism," she said alongside Erdogan at his palace in Ankara. "We agree we want to cooperate, we are all affected by this. We agreed to have closer cooperation in the future."

    Erdogan, sitting next to Merkel, was stony-faced as she spoke.

    Muslims oppose the ham-fisted equating of Islam and terror, arguing those who commit crimes purportedly in the name of Islam have nothing to do with the religion, which espouses peace.

    "This expression 'Islamist terror' seriously saddens us Muslims," Erdogan replied. "Such an expression is not correct because Islam and terror cannot be associated. The meaning of Islam is peace."

    He said it would be "saddening" if the term was used because of the crimes of the so-called Islamic State (IS) extremist group, which some have blamed for a string of attacks in Turkey over the last year.

    "Please let's not use it. As long as it is used we need to stand against it. As a Muslim president personally I cannot accept that," he said.

    The president's comments came after the two leaders tackled a series of hugely sensitive issues during the one day visit to Ankara by the German chancellor, at a time of rising tensions between Ankara and Berlin.

    The phrase is controversial and previous US president Barack Obama recognised that the phrase "Islamic terrorism" distorted and perverted Islam.

    But new President Donald Trump has not shied away from using the term, speaking of "radical Islamic terror" during the election campaign and even condemning Obama for not using the term.

    Indicating that her use of the phrase was no accident, Merkel used it again at her later news conference with Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim, saying she had discussed the threat of "Islamist terrorism" with the premier.

    https://www.thelocal.de/20170202/erd...mist-terrorism

    Am I missing something here? If someone is a Muslim, and commits a terrorist action in the name of their religion, in what way aren't they an Islamic terrorist?
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Erdogan is not a tryrant. He has the support of a clear majority of Turkish voters.

    As for stirring up a healthy debate, yes, that is the purpose of this subforum. Problem is that most users unfortunately aren't debating in a healthy manner. Its good to be a devils advocate just to keep this place from becoming a giant circlejerk.
    Whenever I leave and return it always seems different. It's either taken over by the alt-right, the liberal pragmatists, or delusional leftist tellytubbies. It seems to be the last at the moment.

    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Erdogan is not a tryrant.
    You don't need to try and troll me.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Trump isn't the only Western leader to be making diplomatic faux pas, it seems.

    Turkish President Erdogan on Thursday rebuked German Chancellor Angela Merkel for using the expression "Islamist terrorism", saying the phrase was not correct and saddened Muslims.

    Speaking after a critical bilateral meeting with Erdogan, Merkel spoke of the need for Turkey and Germany to cooperate even further to fight against terror, including "Islamist terrorism".

    "We spoke in detail about... the questions of the fight against Islamist terrorism, against every form of terrorism," she said alongside Erdogan at his palace in Ankara. "We agree we want to cooperate, we are all affected by this. We agreed to have closer cooperation in the future."

    Erdogan, sitting next to Merkel, was stony-faced as she spoke.

    Muslims oppose the ham-fisted equating of Islam and terror, arguing those who commit crimes purportedly in the name of Islam have nothing to do with the religion, which espouses peace.

    "This expression 'Islamist terror' seriously saddens us Muslims," Erdogan replied. "Such an expression is not correct because Islam and terror cannot be associated. The meaning of Islam is peace."

    He said it would be "saddening" if the term was used because of the crimes of the so-called Islamic State (IS) extremist group, which some have blamed for a string of attacks in Turkey over the last year.

    "Please let's not use it. As long as it is used we need to stand against it. As a Muslim president personally I cannot accept that," he said.

    The president's comments came after the two leaders tackled a series of hugely sensitive issues during the one day visit to Ankara by the German chancellor, at a time of rising tensions between Ankara and Berlin.

    The phrase is controversial and previous US president Barack Obama recognised that the phrase "Islamic terrorism" distorted and perverted Islam.

    But new President Donald Trump has not shied away from using the term, speaking of "radical Islamic terror" during the election campaign and even condemning Obama for not using the term.

    Indicating that her use of the phrase was no accident, Merkel used it again at her later news conference with Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim, saying she had discussed the threat of "Islamist terrorism" with the premier.

    https://www.thelocal.de/20170202/erd...mist-terrorism

    Erdogan is a psychopathic dictator. Are you seriously relying on him to score points for your morally hollow worldview?
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    (Original post by jape)
    Erdogan is a psychopathic dictator. Are you seriously relying on him to score points for your morally hollow worldview?
    He's just trying to stir up debate. He's really anti-Islam actually.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    What dates have you left and returned? There have always been waves of bannings.
    I was here for a long time, left about 6 months ago when it had become 90% teletubbies and any dissenting views were being silenced.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Erdogan is not a tryrant. He has the support of a clear majority of Turkish voters.
    Whether or not he has widespread support is 100% irrelevant as to his record on democracy and human rights and whether he is a tyrant or not.

    A man who seems to want more power for himself as president and whose government has arrested many journalists, activists and politicians under bogus "anti terror" laws could certainly qualify as a tyrant in the eyes of some.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Someone has to. I think only FullOfSurprises and yudothis are pro-Islam, out of the regular posters.
    There used to be a large demographic of muslims on here, some were pretty radical and would get loads of reps for saying the most disgusting crap. Have they moved to another forum? Also used to be quite a lot of Islam apologists.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    I think they tend to ignore this forum now. IIRC, both of the rather extreme Islamists were banned a while back, and haven't returned.

    We also seem to get very few of those holocaust threads, which is nice, although we get spammed with the most random **** from Chat now.
    Sounds good. The antisemitism and Islamism was disturbing.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Tbh, I found it interesting to see how Islamists thought.
    Yeh, it was interesting. What was disturbing was posts praising the lashing or stoning of women in Islamic countries getting reps in the double digits.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Might happen outside of this subforum, but I haven't seen that for a very long time. Then again, the topic rarely comes up - the omnipresent Trump trumps all debates, despite the mods' misguided attempts to create other discussions around mundane events, which add absolutely nothing to the quality of threads here.

    Honestly, its gone pretty downhill.
    Yeh it does seem to have done. Many of the really smart ones seem to have gone. Used to be loads of Islam threads which got tiring but was always entertaining. It does look like the spark has gone a bit, but then I expected it to considering the widespread and rather partisan censorship that this site suffers from.
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    Interesting. I think my last straw was when a thread got derailed by some kids who did not understand the most basic math. A couple of old users came in to try and correct them but it was too late, and it got taken down. I just couldn't believe what I was seeing.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Muslims oppose the ham-fisted equating of Islam and terror, arguing those who commit crimes purportedly in the name of Islam have nothing to do with the religion, which espouses peace.
    not u too
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    (Original post by לזייןהאיסלאם)
    There used to be a large demographic of muslims on here, some were pretty radical and would get loads of reps for saying the most disgusting crap. Have they moved to another forum? Also used to be quite a lot of Islam apologists.
    A lot of them were idiots really with some pretty poor points, I don't dislike/hate Muslims, but the points by the apologists (or whatever people want to call them) made were stupid like the nonsense about how only Israel commits war crimes when Palestine does equal back and tried wiping them off the face of the Earth.
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    -TRUMP IS HITLER
    -ERDOGAN IS NOT A TYRANT.
    is this a joke?
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    (Original post by Vikingninja)
    A lot of them were idiots really with some pretty poor points, I don't dislike/hate Muslims, but the points by the apologists (or whatever people want to call them) made were stupid like the nonsense about how only Israel commits war crimes when Palestine does equal back and tried wiping them off the face of the Earth.
    Tbh, any argument which has its basis in defending or supporting an absurd ideological system is usually going to be absurd itself.
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    (Original post by לזייןהאיסלאם)
    Tbh, any argument which has its basis in defending or supporting an absurd ideological system is usually going to be absurd itself.
    There were people who went really indepth with quotes etc but then some people just came up with total bullocks. Believe one person came up with a Muslim invention (something to do with countering a thread after a terrorist attack) appreciation thread... the source used was the huffingtonpost and none of the inventions were invented by Muslims, one was glasses where a Muslim scholar (don't know what you would call them around Medieval times) did actually discover properties of lenses... but did not invent glasses nor the process of how they work, rest were improvements after a LONG time. Then there was one person who basically bashed Israel and abandoned the thread when someone posted something back about Palestine doing **** to them or debunked a picture they posted.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Erdogan is not a tryrant. He has the support of a clear majority of Turkish voters.

    As for stirring up a healthy debate, yes, that is the purpose of this subforum. Problem is that most users unfortunately aren't debating in a healthy manner. Its good to be a devils advocate just to keep this place from becoming a giant circlejerk.
    I thought you had changed. Still dont know what to make of it. People do seem very one eyed. Quora is much better.
 
 
 
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