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    (Original post by habeas.corpus)
    Rape is penetration without consent. Even if someone was drunk, they didn't ask for it. Also the exact same thing can happen to a man so I fail to see how it's chauvinistic.
    I don't think you read my message properly; I said "people think girls can't consent to sex after drinking alcohol" as if consent did exist while being delegitimised or unrecognised by people making commentaries. I think that anybody can consent to sex so long as their intoxication was voluntary in the first place, because it starts a chain of voluntary acts - they voluntarily consent to alcohol, which then led to voluntary engagement in sex, etc.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Perhaps the legal definition of rape would be a starting point? Did you have a different one that has some credibility?


    The Sexual Offences Act 2003:

    1-(1) A person (A) commits an offence if—(a) he intentionally penetrates the vagina, anus or mouth of another person (B) with his penis(b) B does not consent to the penetration, and(c) A does not reasonably believe that B consents.
    (2) Whether a belief is reasonable is to be determined having regard to all the circumstances, including any steps A has taken to ascertain whether B consents.
    part 1 means that the person penetrated without believing the other person consented. I agree with that definition. what's the problem?
    part 2: "whether a belief is reasonable", concerns the male, not the female; a female doesn't have a "reasonable belief" in her own consent. and if a woman is drunk, that doesn't mean that her consent itself "shouldn't be believed" as if it's not reasonable. her consent literally will speak for itself.
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    (Original post by Bubblyminty)
    That's an odd first reaction. My first reaction would be concern and compassion, not scepticism and judgment. And also, men can be raped too.
    why can't I have both compassion *and* scepticism?
    I can have sympathy while at the same time doubting that a real rape really happened. she might just be very angry and confused, for instance, and be using terms like "rape" to express that fact. for instance, a lot of girls these days would tell you, without any kind of reasonable principle involved, that having sex with a drunk girl is rape. it's not though, is it.
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    (Original post by PurpleNerple)
    part 1 means that the person penetrated without believing the other person consented. I agree with that definition. what's the problem?
    part 2: "whether a belief is reasonable", concerns the male, not the female; a female doesn't have a "reasonable belief" in her own consent. and if a woman is drunk, that doesn't mean that her consent itself "shouldn't be believed" as if it's not reasonable. her consent literally will speak for itself.
    What are you babbling about?. I already know what it means. It is the legal definition of what rape is. We already have case law on what consent means. What is your point?
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    What are you babbling about?. I already know what it means. It is the legal definition of what rape is. We already have case law on what consent means. What is your point?
    ...errr...what?
    you quoted me the legal definition of rape...
    ...yet you're asking *me* what *my* point is when I tell you "the definition of rape doesn't contradict what I said"?
    ...what?
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    But I can't stop thinking whether she is secretly horrified and thinks I am damaged/ contaminated, because that's how I feel.
    I doubt she thinks that but anyone who thinks you are contaminated because of it is a scummy person so I wouldn't feel bad about it. You are only damaged in that you have been attacked by someone which will understandably make you feel like you have been harmed. You are not damaged in the sense you are "damaged goods". You haven't done anything wrong at all.
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    (Original post by PurpleNerple)
    why can't I have both compassion *and* scepticism?
    I can have sympathy while at the same time doubting that a real rape really happened. she might just be very angry and confused, for instance, and be using terms like "rape" to express that fact. for instance, a lot of girls these days would tell you, without any kind of reasonable principle involved, that having sex with a drunk girl is rape. it's not though, is it.
    I hope to God no one ever chooses to confess that they've been raped to you
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    Suggest she should go for counselling
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    (Original post by bones-mccoy)
    I hope to God no one ever chooses to confess that they've been raped to you
    probably because you know that these days the word "rape" just means "regretful sex" to women, right? you need to get with the times. this is what rape truly is to most young women. I can't change that. we're living in the post-modern age influenced by the depressing works of feminists like catherine mackinnon whereby sex is an inherently aggressive act against a woman unless she says "yes, I consent" at every hurdle of the encounter. it's why california has truly absurd sexual consent laws now, and I'd be surprised if the UK doesn't fall in line.
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    (Original post by PurpleNerple)
    probably because you know that these days the word "rape" just means "regretful sex" to women, right? you need to get with the times. this is what rape truly is to most young women. I can't change that. we're living in the post-modern age influenced by the depressing works of feminists like catherine mackinnon whereby sex is an inherently aggressive act against a woman unless she says "yes, I consent" at every hurdle of the encounter. it's why california has truly absurd sexual consent laws now, and I'd be surprised if the UK doesn't fall in line.
    I'm sorry that you have such a twisted view of the world, but most young women know what rape is and you don't need to patronise them. It's such a sad cop out to blame feminists when you disagree with anything relating to women.
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    (Original post by bones-mccoy)
    I'm sorry that you have such a twisted view of the world, but most young women know what rape is and you don't need to patronise them. It's such a sad cop out to blame feminists when you disagree with anything relating to women.
    um, what world do you live in exactly?
    if I had sex with a drunk girl do you *honestly* think I wouldn't be accused of "rape"?
    and I'm not disagreeing with "anything relating to women" unless you're agreeing that women DO generally conceive of "rape" in that way.
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    OP, I think my first reaction would be full of compassion and sadnsss for what you went through. I'd do my very best to support you in the best way possible, whether that's escorting you to counselling or just being a ear and a shoulder to cry on. Would I think of you any differently? No, except I may worry that you are in an emotionally vulnerable state.

    Best wishes lovely xxx

    (Original post by PurpleNerple)
    why can't I have both compassion *and* scepticism?
    I can have sympathy while at the same time doubting that a real rape really happened. she might just be very angry and confused, for instance, and be using terms like "rape" to express that fact. for instance, a lot of girls these days would tell you, without any kind of reasonable principle involved, that having sex with a drunk girl is rape. it's not though, is it.

    My guess is that you are just completely emotionally detached from the prospect of another individual telling you they were raped. All you can see is a platform for online forum debate. Not a real life scenario involving rape.

    But in reality, I hope, at least I like to think, that you're first reaction would be of caring and compassion towards your friend. Otherwise I quite clearly hope you never have the privilege of calling another human a "friend" because you aren't worthy.


    I'm disgusted that a thread created by a rape victim has turned into the usual petty debate. There are plenty of other threads to discuss the legality of rape. Quite simply a victim is asking how you'd react to her telling you she was raped, whether you'd think any differently of her. If you can't possibly bring yourself to answer that, then don't bother.
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    My first reaction would probably be shock,and not knowing how to react, and then trying to offer some comfort [I don't know how good I'd be at it though]

    but then as I read further down the thread I saw some of Purple Nurples posts. He gave a valid Answer to the OP IMO, that's what his first reaction would be . You can't chastise the man for giving an honest answer just cause you disagreed with it Twinpeaks...
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    (Original post by ANM775)
    My first reaction would probably be shock,and not knowing how to react, and then trying to offer some comfort [I don't know how good I'd be at it though]

    but then as I read further down the thread I saw some of Purple Nurples posts. He gave a valid Answer to the OP IMO, that's what his first reaction would be . You can't chastise the man for giving an honest answer just cause you disagreed with it Twinpeaks...
    She she "chastising" him for effectively claiming that being drunk and raped isn't real rape. Rape is penetration without consent (explicit or implied). This is the legal definition so I don't see what the debate is about.

    And whilst I appreciate the honesty of the other poster, "did you really get raped?" is an odd and callous first reaction.
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    (Original post by Twinpeaks)
    OP, I think my first reaction would be full of compassion and sadnsss for what you went through. I'd do my very best to support you in the best way possible, whether that's escorting you to counselling or just being a ear and a shoulder to cry on. Would I think of you any differently? No, except I may worry that you are in an emotionally vulnerable state.

    Best wishes lovely xxx




    My guess is that you are just completely emotionally detached from the prospect of another individual telling you they were raped. All you can see is a platform for online forum debate. Not a real life scenario involving rape.

    But in reality, I hope, at least I like to think, that you're first reaction would be of caring and compassion towards your friend. Otherwise I quite clearly hope you never have the privilege of calling another human a "friend" because you aren't worthy.


    I'm disgusted that a thread created by a rape victim has turned into the usual petty debate. There are plenty of other threads to discuss the legality of rape. Quite simply a victim is asking how you'd react to her telling you she was raped, whether you'd think any differently of her. If you can't possibly bring yourself to answer that, then don't bother.
    Thank you for your kind words Twinpeaks. That was lovely and reassuring :cute:. Maybe I need to stop ovethinking how my friend may have reacted.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    She she "chastising" him for effectively claiming that being drunk and raped isn't real rape. Rape is penetration without consent (explicit or implied). This is the legal definition so I don't see what the debate is about.

    And whilst I appreciate the honesty of the other poster, "did you really get raped?" is an odd and callous first reaction.

    Some months back there was a topic where a drunk girl had sex with her male friend and went to her current bf and said to him he convinced her into it etc etc ..and pretty much all the girls who replied to the topic said it rape, but with the male posters there was a much more obvious split of opinions with many doubting it was definitely rape.

    basically what a male regards as rape and what females regard as rape can clearly differ ... so his first reaction, although yes, it might seem a bit harsh to some, is still a legitamate reaction and one that could be not so uncommon considering that there isn't really much consensus amoungst males on the issue on alcohol and rape
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    If one of your close friends told you that she had been raped in the past, what would your first reaction be? And what would you think of her?
    First reaction of mine would be to console her, and try to support her.

    Next would probably planning in my head on finding the f****r that raped her, and making the rest of his life a living hell!


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