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Why is mental health not allowed to be criticised?
THIS IS IN THE DEBATE SECTION OF THE FORUM. IF YOU ARE SENSITIVE TO THIS TOPIC I SUGGEST YOU DO NOT READ FURTHER.
Now we've got that declaration out the way, I want to discuss mental health and why the way we look at it needs to change.
In today's society one of the most delicate subjects out there is mental health and statistics show that mental health problems are soaring, higher than ever before despite living in a more prosperous world with the best health care in history.
I think that this "no criticism" approach to mental health issues such as anxiety and depression is incredibly detrimental to the progress of preventing mental health issues occurring because it allows people a free pass to believe and act that these conditions are incurable and allow them the freedom of saying "I have depression" whenever faced with an unpleasant task such as finding a job or kicking a bad habit such as drug use or alcoholism.
Further studies show that the number of people claiming to be depressed increases by a staggering 20% annually. This is absolutely shocking, again considering how prosperous we are and how much health care is available.
So is it wise that we continue to have this "untouchable unquestionable" approach to those with mental health issues such as depression? Wouldn't a better approach be to rigorously analyse why so many people are now claiming to have depression as apposed to something such as schizophrenia? Why is depression climbing so rapidly?
According to the Oxford English Dictionary Depression is described as "Feelings of severe despondency and dejection." Despondency meaning loss of hope or low spirits and Dejection meaning a sad and depressed state.
So put simply, someone has depression if they feel a loss of hope and or sad.
According to statistics the most common causes of depression is being unemployed or having recently ended a marriage / relationship.
Could these feelings simply stem from a sense of entitlement? Perhaps they believe they deserve a job or money and because they cannot achieve that they feel loss of hope?
Perhaps they were in a relationship and felt it was never going to end and then when it does end, they have a sense of entitlement, they believe the relationship should have continued thus causing sadness?
Of course there is more to it than what I've said but this current attitude towards mental health issues such as depression only seems to be inviting more people to it. I imagine back in the day people with such conditions just had to pick themselves up, dust themselves off and get on with it otherwise they wouldn't be able to survive.
I'm not saying we should ignore those with depression, but is the right approach really complete acceptance without any criticism or debate? As it stands those with mental health issues are in a sanctuary which is closed to being challenged and this is not healthy in my opinion.
Every thought, belief and scientific idea should be open to scrutiny, criticism and debate.
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(edited 7 years ago)
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Questioning and trying to understand mental health issues is something that's very important, BUT it has to be handled a certain way. It's not something we understand, so not treating it with care would be a very irresponsible thing to do and we could end up with someone getting injured or losing a life.
I actually wrote quite a lengthy reply to your post asking why LQBT and MH topics are 'off limits', but alas, twas rejected.
I actually wrote quite a lengthy reply to your post asking why LQBT and MH topics are 'off limits', but alas, twas rejected.
Doesn't state that unemployment and divorce are the most common causes, says that as individuals they are more likely to suffer from it. The reason why your opinion in that previous thread was heavily bombarded by others was because it was an opinion that wasn't based on any facts but just your perception of what depression is which was incorrect.
With your put simply comment, remember to still think about the word severe before it. I suffered from depression for a large part of my teenage life due to bullying and loneliness along with my aspergers and I can tell you that it isn't easy handling it especially when you don't want to talk to others about it.
Also about the numbers soaring, there's a difference between the actual number of people having depressing rising fast and then diagnosises being more common and detection methods improving. Yes some people do use it as an excuse just to get through stuff easy but it does affect some people severely.
With your put simply comment, remember to still think about the word severe before it. I suffered from depression for a large part of my teenage life due to bullying and loneliness along with my aspergers and I can tell you that it isn't easy handling it especially when you don't want to talk to others about it.
Also about the numbers soaring, there's a difference between the actual number of people having depressing rising fast and then diagnosises being more common and detection methods improving. Yes some people do use it as an excuse just to get through stuff easy but it does affect some people severely.
Original post by AishaGirl
THIS IS IN THE DEBATE SECTION OF THE FORUM. IF YOU ARE SENSITIVE TO THIS TOPIC I SUGGEST YOU DO NOT READ FURTHER.
Now we've got that declaration out the way, I want to discuss mental health and why the way we look at it needs to change.
In today's society one of the most delicate subjects out there is mental health and statistics show that mental health problems are soaring, higher than ever before despite living in a more prosperous world with the best health care in history.
I think that this "no criticism" approach to mental health issues such as anxiety and depression is incredibly detrimental to the progress of preventing mental health issues occurring because it allows people a free pass to believe and act that these conditions are incurable and allow them the freedom of saying "I have depression" whenever faced with an unpleasant task such as finding a job or kicking a bad habit such as drug use or alcoholism.
Further studies show that the number of people claiming to be depressed increases by a staggering 20% annually. This is absolutely shocking, again considering how prosperous we are and how much health care in available.
So is it wise that we continue to have this "untouchable unquestionable" approach to those with mental health issues such as depression? Wouldn't a better approach be to rigorously analyse why so many people are now claiming to have depression as apposed to something such as schizophrenia? Why is depression climbing so rapidly?
According to the Oxford English Dictionary Depression is described as "Feelings of severe despondency and dejection." Despondency meaning loss of hope or low spirits and Dejection meaning a sad and depressed state.
So put simply, someone has depression if they feel a loss of hope and or sad.
According to statistics the most common causes of depression are being unemployed or having recently ended a marriage / relationship.
Could these feelings simply stem from a sense of entitlement? Perhaps they believe they deserve a job or money and because they cannot achieve that they feel loss of hope?
Perhaps they were in a relationship and felt it was never going to end and then when it does end, they have a sense of entitlement, they believe the relationship should have continued thus causing sadness?
Of course there is more to it than what I've said but this current attitude towards mental health issues such as depression only seems to be inviting more people to it. I imagine back in the day people with such conditions just had to pick themselves up, dust themselves off and get on with it otherwise they wouldn't be able to survive.
I'm not saying we should ignore those with depression, but is the right approach really complete acceptance without any criticism or debate? As it stands those with mental health issues are in a sanctuary which is closed to being challenged and this is not healthy in my opinion.
Every idea, belief and scientific idea should be open to scrutiny, criticism and debate.
Sources
THIS IS IN THE DEBATE SECTION OF THE FORUM. IF YOU ARE SENSITIVE TO THIS TOPIC I SUGGEST YOU DO NOT READ FURTHER.
Now we've got that declaration out the way, I want to discuss mental health and why the way we look at it needs to change.
In today's society one of the most delicate subjects out there is mental health and statistics show that mental health problems are soaring, higher than ever before despite living in a more prosperous world with the best health care in history.
I think that this "no criticism" approach to mental health issues such as anxiety and depression is incredibly detrimental to the progress of preventing mental health issues occurring because it allows people a free pass to believe and act that these conditions are incurable and allow them the freedom of saying "I have depression" whenever faced with an unpleasant task such as finding a job or kicking a bad habit such as drug use or alcoholism.
Further studies show that the number of people claiming to be depressed increases by a staggering 20% annually. This is absolutely shocking, again considering how prosperous we are and how much health care in available.
So is it wise that we continue to have this "untouchable unquestionable" approach to those with mental health issues such as depression? Wouldn't a better approach be to rigorously analyse why so many people are now claiming to have depression as apposed to something such as schizophrenia? Why is depression climbing so rapidly?
According to the Oxford English Dictionary Depression is described as "Feelings of severe despondency and dejection." Despondency meaning loss of hope or low spirits and Dejection meaning a sad and depressed state.
So put simply, someone has depression if they feel a loss of hope and or sad.
According to statistics the most common causes of depression are being unemployed or having recently ended a marriage / relationship.
Could these feelings simply stem from a sense of entitlement? Perhaps they believe they deserve a job or money and because they cannot achieve that they feel loss of hope?
Perhaps they were in a relationship and felt it was never going to end and then when it does end, they have a sense of entitlement, they believe the relationship should have continued thus causing sadness?
Of course there is more to it than what I've said but this current attitude towards mental health issues such as depression only seems to be inviting more people to it. I imagine back in the day people with such conditions just had to pick themselves up, dust themselves off and get on with it otherwise they wouldn't be able to survive.
I'm not saying we should ignore those with depression, but is the right approach really complete acceptance without any criticism or debate? As it stands those with mental health issues are in a sanctuary which is closed to being challenged and this is not healthy in my opinion.
Every idea, belief and scientific idea should be open to scrutiny, criticism and debate.
Sources
I believe that the reason why depression is rising rapidly in the recent years is because people simply avoid it. The society does not position ''mental illness' as significant and believe that it could be solved easily. Depression could be seen as a sign of weakness and usually people like to show others that they are ''strong'' so they do not do anything about it.
(edited 7 years ago)
Mental illness is a medical condition - not a crime or an attitude. Criticizing one's illness is more likely to exacerbate their problems. Honestly, if a person is on crutches, would you criticize him for not walking faster?
Thread is back open for discussion 
Original post by AishaGirl
A mother can lose her child in an accident or a man can lose his wife after 40 years of marriage and they may not become depressed. On the flip side a 20 year old can break up from a 1 year relationship or struggle finding a job and they develop depression for life.
There seems to be a fundamental discrepancy here, how is it that one person can experience incredible mental trauma and not become depressed but the other can suffer a simple episode of feeling low and have it develop into full blown depression?
There seems to be a fundamental discrepancy here, how is it that one person can experience incredible mental trauma and not become depressed but the other can suffer a simple episode of feeling low and have it develop into full blown depression?
You are vastly over-simplifying the cause of depression here - which is making me think you are only so critical of it because you do not truly understand it. Not everyone with depression has suffered "mental trauma" at all. It's a known trigger of depression, yes, but it is not the only cause of it. Someone can experience an onset of depression for no obvious reason at all. Hormone imbalances, genetics, and other factors in that person's life can also play a part.
I remember you saying in another thread that people with depression are just people who feel sorry for themselves when something goes wrong in their life. As someone diagnosed with "severe depression and anxiety" I can say that I do not feel sorry for myself nor is there anything particularly wrong in my life. For the most part I'm an optimistic person: if someone met me in person they probably wouldn't have a clue I have a mental disorder and how much I struggle with simple everyday tasks. But depression is an illness and not one that I have chosen to have. I don't sit and angst about it but if I could just simply wish it away I would in a heartbeat.
Original post by AishaGirl
A mother can lose her child in an accident or a man can lose his wife after 40 years of marriage and they may not become depressed. On the flip side a 20 year old can break up from a 1 year relationship or struggle finding a job and they develop depression for life.
There seems to be a fundamental discrepancy here, how is it that one person can experience incredible mental trauma and not become depressed but the other can suffer a simple episode of feeling low and have it develop into full blown depression?
This needs to be addressed.
There seems to be a fundamental discrepancy here, how is it that one person can experience incredible mental trauma and not become depressed but the other can suffer a simple episode of feeling low and have it develop into full blown depression?
This needs to be addressed.
As someone who studies mainly neuropharmacology (And aiming for Masters next year and PhD after in psychiatric research), I can try to answer this. The answer to your question is a resounding 'we don't know'. Given the complexity in what actually 'causes' mental health problems, it's hard to pinpoint why. It's quite difficult as you'll have a myriad of factors, be it genetic, environmental, social etc that can collectively come together to form depression.
It's a lot more difficult to thus pinpoint 'X causes it', due to the many factors involved. It's not like a physical illness where you can generally say 'Y causes this'. Sure, you have things that can increase you risk of depression, but no one is able to say this is why it happens.
I agree it needs to be addressed, but then that's what research is for.
Original post by MrDystopia
As someone who studies mainly neuropharmacology (And aiming for Masters next year and PhD after in psychiatric research), I can try to answer this. The answer to your question is a resounding 'we don't know'. Given the complexity in what actually 'causes' mental health problems, it's hard to pinpoint why. It's quite difficult as you'll have a myriad of factors, be it genetic, environmental, social etc that can collectively come together to form depression.
It's a lot more difficult to thus pinpoint 'X causes it', due to the many factors involved. It's not like a physical illness where you can generally say 'Y causes this'. Sure, you have things that can increase you risk of depression, but no one is able to say this is why it happens.
I agree it needs to be addressed, but then that's what research is for.
It's a lot more difficult to thus pinpoint 'X causes it', due to the many factors involved. It's not like a physical illness where you can generally say 'Y causes this'. Sure, you have things that can increase you risk of depression, but no one is able to say this is why it happens.
I agree it needs to be addressed, but then that's what research is for.
Why is the amount of people claiming to have depression increasing by 20% a year? Not to sound harsh to those that genuinely have depression but right now, today, could diagnose myself with depression or go to a doctor and tell them I have the same symptoms of depression and suddenly I have a free pass to say "I can't do x or y because I have depression" and that's it, nobody is allowed to challenge this or analyse this. They just have to accept it because it would be too offensive to question them.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
Original post by AishaGirl
According to statistics the most common causes of depression is being unemployed or having recently ended a marriage / relationship.
Could these feelings simply stem from a sense of entitlement? Perhaps they believe they deserve a job or money and because they cannot achieve that they feel loss of hope?
According to statistics the most common causes of depression is being unemployed or having recently ended a marriage / relationship.
Could these feelings simply stem from a sense of entitlement? Perhaps they believe they deserve a job or money and because they cannot achieve that they feel loss of hope?
I do think this is to fundamentally misunderstand the nature of depression. As Mr Dystopia eloquently says, we simply don't fully understand the true nature of it - there's no gene we can point to as the 'depression' gene. It's probably a combination of environmental, developmental and genetic factors which combine. You raise an interesting point about why depression rates 'seem to be soaring', but that could be due to a number of things - the main one being that mental health fortunately suffers from less stigma than before and more people are coming forward to report it.
You are entitled to suggest that 'these feelings could stem from a sense of entitlement', but I think you are entirely misguided. I think you're making an unwarranted link between a traumatic event such as a divorce causing depression. It could well be that it didn't cause it as such, but pushed an individual already predisposed to depression over the edge.
Original post by AishaGirl
Why is the amount of people claiming to have depression increasing by 20% a year? Not to sound harsh to those that genuinely have depression but right now, today, could diagnose myself with depression or go to a doctor and tell them I have the same symptoms of depression and suddenly I have a free pass to say "I can't do x or y because I have depression" and that's it, nobody is allowed to challenge this or analyse this. They just have to accept it because it would be too offensive to question them.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
Refer to my previous post about the 20% rise. Also that's not how a diagnosis works.
There's a difference between criticising and hating, and unfortunately the latter is what you've done in that depression thread.
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Original post by AishaGirl
Why is the amount of people claiming to have depression increasing by 20% a year? Not to sound harsh to those that genuinely have depression but right now, today, could diagnose myself with depression or go to a doctor and tell them I have the same symptoms of depression and suddenly I have a free pass to say "I can't do x or y because I have depression" and that's it, nobody is allowed to challenge this or analyse this. They just have to accept it because it would be too offensive to question them.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
Again, there could be a myriad of reasons. We live in an ever increasingly troubling world. Politically, economically we aren't as sound as previous generations. As well, the rise of the internet means we're ever more connected to each other and the media, increasing the exposure people may have to potential triggers of depression.
And no you wouldn't. If you went to the doctor and said 'I am depressed', you would have to be assessed as such. Do not conflate 'feeling depressed' and 'suffering from clinical/diagnosed depression'. They are two different things. Moreover, why when someone says 'I have anaemia' would you accept it, but feel the need to challenge them on 'I've been diagnosed with depression?'
In regards to your point on 'we need to collect data'...what do you think researchers do out of interest?
Since you're now straying into politics, which benefits do you find disagreeable with then?
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by HAnwar
There's a difference between criticising and hating, and unfortunately the latter is what you've done in that depression thread.
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And I apologised and deleted those posts as I acknowledged they were pretty harsh, or did you not notice that bit?
Original post by AishaGirl
Why is the amount of people claiming to have depression increasing by 20% a year? Not to sound harsh to those that genuinely have depression but right now, today, could diagnose myself with depression or go to a doctor and tell them I have the same symptoms of depression and suddenly I have a free pass to say "I can't do x or y because I have depression" and that's it, nobody is allowed to challenge this or analyse this. They just have to accept it because it would be too offensive to question them.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
You yourself say science doesn't know so isn't this even more of a reason to rigorously investigate and collect as much data as we can about people who claim to have depression and then perhaps we can start curing it.
The real danger arises when these people can use their unchallenged diagnosis of depression to get a myriad of benefits from the government and an excuse that has almost unlimited usage.
I know mental health is a delicate subject but it should still be scrutinised.
Please can you give some examples of where depression is used in a widespread way to obtain 'free passes'?
Original post by MrDystopia
And no you wouldn't. If you went to the doctor and said 'I am depressed', you would have to be assessed as such. Do not conflate 'feeling depressed' and 'suffering from clinical/diagnosed depression'. They are two different things. Moreover, why when someone says 'I have anaemia' would you accept it, but feel the need to challenge them on 'I've been diagnosed with depression?'
This. An important thing to consider when inviting others to debate, OP... Is to either remain impartial to facilitate a debate, or to at least have an understanding of the nature of what you wish to debate, rather than coming across as overly arrogant and stating something which is entirely incorrect - you'll just end up insulting people.
Empathy and compassion are required to a certain extent in order to even begin to understand (or attempt to, given how difficult it is with these things) mental health and, by extension, depression (clinical or not). I think it's important to note that arrogant statements which offer no challenge and are closed-ended will offend those that have struggled all of their lives with a mental illness such as depression or otherwise.
(edited 7 years ago)
I apologise if I'm misjudging, but from your post I get the feeling you've never had depression.
It's not just feeling sad, it's the psyche's inability to construct a future for itself. I'm sure lots of people who have been down probably thought it was depression or called it depression. But if real hopelessness ever truly sets in you know the difference.
Feeling sad is perfectly normal, it's the minds way of motivating you towards finding happiness and avoiding things that cause you sadness.
Depression is the abject loss of any hope, something in the mind is broken and won't recover like it should. You can't criticise a broken bone back together, and you can't criticise a broken mind to recover. A depressed person can't simply dust them self off and get over it. They don't want to get over it because they don't care, they have no hope left.
The problems are that it's not visible, you can't put the mind in an x-ray and see where it's broken, so some people confuse being sad with depression, and for some people it's also easy to feign. So yes, you can just say you have depression, not an awful lot that can be done about that as there isn't some blood test or scan to diagnose it so it's both open to abuse for people who want to claim they have a disability, and the word is misused to the point of diminishing its meaning.
I've heard people claim they are literally starving, it doesn't mean there is any reason to criticise the genuinely hungry.
It's not just feeling sad, it's the psyche's inability to construct a future for itself. I'm sure lots of people who have been down probably thought it was depression or called it depression. But if real hopelessness ever truly sets in you know the difference.
Feeling sad is perfectly normal, it's the minds way of motivating you towards finding happiness and avoiding things that cause you sadness.
Depression is the abject loss of any hope, something in the mind is broken and won't recover like it should. You can't criticise a broken bone back together, and you can't criticise a broken mind to recover. A depressed person can't simply dust them self off and get over it. They don't want to get over it because they don't care, they have no hope left.
The problems are that it's not visible, you can't put the mind in an x-ray and see where it's broken, so some people confuse being sad with depression, and for some people it's also easy to feign. So yes, you can just say you have depression, not an awful lot that can be done about that as there isn't some blood test or scan to diagnose it so it's both open to abuse for people who want to claim they have a disability, and the word is misused to the point of diminishing its meaning.
I've heard people claim they are literally starving, it doesn't mean there is any reason to criticise the genuinely hungry.
Original post by AishaGirl
And I apologised and deleted those posts as I acknowledged they were pretty harsh, or did you not notice that bit?
Oh really? Judging by your recent comments it doesn't look like you feel any remorse.
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