Crushing defeat for the Right in the Netherlands - a sign for the French elections? Watch

GenialGermanGent
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Xenophobe Wilders likely to not even come out in second, Macron gaining strongly on nationalistic populist Le Pen, AfD collapsing to below 10% in German polls - is the Right defeated already? Is that all they had?
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Luke Kostanjsek
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(Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil)
Xenophobe Wilders likely to not even come out in second, Macron gaining strongly on nationalistic populist Le Pen, AfD collapsing to below 10% in German polls - is the Right defeated already? Is that all they had?
Wilders had no chance in the Dutch elections; even had he topped the polls, he was never going to be able to form a government. The only real danger comes from the elections in France.
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swanderfeild
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(Original post by Mathemagicien)
Wilders was 2nd, with 20 seats this year, as opposed to 15 last year... hardly a crushing defeat by any means, except compared to the ridiculous fearmongering of the English media.
Decrease of 4 seats compared to the first election in 2010 though; increase from 15 can largely be put down to under performance in 2012 elections (due to PVV forcing snap elections within two years) rather than good performance this time around. Also in media's defense, few months ago PVV was predicted by most polls to get >30s and be in the lead.
Not really a 'crushing defeat' but definitely a noteworthy one - hopefully France will continue this.
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TaintedLight
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Its because Wilders publicly failed to bend over for Putin
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yudothis
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Ooooooh Nigel, where are you now, where are you now. Ooooooooh, oooooh, Nigel where the **** are you now?
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pol pot noodles
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(Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil)
Xenophobe Wilders likely to not even come out in second, Macron gaining strongly on nationalistic populist Le Pen, AfD collapsing to below 10% in German polls - is the Right defeated already? Is that all they had?
You're saying 'is that all they had?' as if Brexit and Trump are no big deal. Even if Le Pen doesn't win, the right have still scored major victories over the left in Western politics.
Also, the VVD and CDA are both centre-right. The three largest parties in the Dutch election are all right wing. A defeat for Wilders here isn't a win for the left. That's like saying Nigel Farage losing to the Tories in Thanet was a victory for the left. You're scrapping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to finding 'wins'.
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paul514
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(Original post by Luke Kostanjsek)
Wilders had no chance in the Dutch elections; even had he topped the polls, he was never going to be able to form a government. The only real danger comes from the elections in France.
This


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GenialGermanGent
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(Original post by pol pot noodles)
You're saying 'is that all they had?' as if Brexit and Trump are no big deal. Even if Le Pen doesn't win, the right have still scored major victories over the left in Western politics.
I didn't discount those 'victories' (it's really just one, Clinton clearly won the popular vote). It just does seem that is all the Right had.

(Original post by pol pot noodles)
Also, the VVD and CDA are both centre-right. The three largest parties in the Dutch election are all right wing.
Off Wikipedia:

'The Christian Democratic Appeal is a Christian democratic party on the centre to centre-right.[...] The CDA favours European economic, cultural, and political integration.'

'The People's Party for Freedom and Democracy (VVD) is a conservative-liberal party. As a centre-right movement,[...] The party is generally supportive of European economic integration.'

That's miles off what Wilders or your other run-of-the-mill extreme right populists stand for - and these two parties won with a huge majority. Massive win for the Left.


(Original post by pol pot noodles)
A defeat for Wilders here isn't a win for the left.
Of course it is.

(Original post by pol pot noodles)
That's like saying Nigel Farage losing to the Tories in Thanet was a victory for the left.
That is an absolutely correct statement.


(Original post by pol pot noodles)
You're scrapping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to finding 'wins'.
Starting to see a trend and getting nervous much, desperately trying to argue against the obvious fact that the Right, after their elected officials failing miserably in the old and new world, is in decline?
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Dandaman1
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A defeat for the right? A right-wing party won the election and a far-right party came in second (gaining seats in the process).

The centre of gravity is shifting right all over Europe with each election cycle. Euroscepticism is also generally on the rise.

And to reference your other post, treating the victory of a right-wing party like a victory for the left reeks far more of desperation.
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Snufkin
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(Original post by Dandaman1)
Euroscepticism is also generally on the rise.
Yet France looks set to elect a staunchly pro EU integrationist. The Eurosceptics had their day in the sun, the tide is turning.
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barnetlad
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Looks like a win for Emmanuel Macron on the second round ballot. Would have been Francois Fillon but for the jobs to the family issue.
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Dandaman1
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(Original post by Snufkin)
Yet France looks set to elect a staunchly pro EU integrationist. The Eurosceptics had their day in the sun, the tide is turning.
Even if pro-EU parties happen to win this round of elections, if trends in public Euroscepticism continue, I wouldn't be so confident in them winning the following ones.

I think the Eurosceptics' day in the sun is only just dawning.
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yudothis
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(Original post by Dandaman1)
Even if pro-EU parties happen to win this round of elections, if trends in public Euroscepticism continue, I wouldn't be so confident in them winning the following ones.

I think the Eurosceptics' day in the sun is only just dawning.
Brexit and Trump and yet Wilders got crushed, and Le Pen will get crushed too. AfD's ratings going down, too. If not now when then?

Nah, keep dreaming.
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yudothis
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(Original post by Dandaman1)
A defeat for the right? A right-wing party won the election and a far-right party came in second (gaining seats in the process).

The centre of gravity is shifting right all over Europe with each election cycle. Euroscepticism is also generally on the rise.

And to reference your other post, treating the victory of a right-wing party like a victory for the left reeks far more of desperation.
Merkel is the right in Germany...
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Dodgypirate
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He was never going to win, but the fact that a right wing government is in power, that a far right party ended second, and the left-wing party got destroyed, would indicate that the right is on the rise.

You need a reality-check - so does most of the Left.
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yudothis
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(Original post by Mathemagicien)
Merkel is actually also rather populist. E.g. phasing out nuclear power, not a smart move, but helped the polls.

Merkel's party (the CDU) is more right-wing than she is, at least when it comes to immigration; especially the Bavarian sister party.
Merkel is solely a populist. But one with morals.

The CSU is a small fringe party in Bavaria. They are all morons.
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paul514
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(Original post by Dodgypirate)
He was never going to win, but the fact that a right wing government is in power, that a far right party ended second, and the left-wing party got destroyed, would indicate that the right is on the rise.

You need a reality-check - so does most of the Left.
This, the systems that the Dutch and French have mean that even if they get the most votes they still won't be in power


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pol pot noodles
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(Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil)
I didn't discount those 'victories' (it's really just one, Clinton clearly won the popular vote). It just does seem that is all the Right had.



Off Wikipedia:

'The Christian Democratic Appeal is a Christian democratic party on the centre to centre-right.[...] The CDA favours European economic, cultural, and political integration.'

'The People's Party for Freedom and Democracy (VVD) is a conservative-liberal party. As a centre-right movement,[...] The party is generally supportive of European economic integration.'

That's miles off what Wilders or your other run-of-the-mill extreme right populists stand for - and these two parties won with a huge majority. Massive win for the Left.




Of course it is.



That is an absolutely correct statement.




Starting to see a trend and getting nervous much, desperately trying to argue against the obvious fact that the Right, after their elected officials failing miserably in the old and new world, is in decline?
Popular vote doesn't decide the winner of the US presidential election. So no, Clinton didn't win. You're discounting Brexit and Trump precisely by saying 'that's all [the right] had'. What exactly has the left had then? Relying on the centre-right to beat the 'far' right in European elections?
I'm not nervous about anything. I'm just going to marvel at the fact that you think the centre-right beating the right into second place is a victory for the left. The irony of the fact that you're talking about decline when the left has declined so much that you'd celebrate a Tory victory as some kind of win for the left. Now that's what is desperate.
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GenialGermanGent
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(Original post by Dandaman1)
A defeat for the right? A right-wing party won the election and a far-right party came in second (gaining seats in the process).
You should really have read the post right above yours to avoid looking like an absolute fool.

A 'center to center-right' won the election with a big majority, the party that came in second is center-right and in favor of European economic integration. Yeah, sounds super 'right-wing'...

(Original post by Dandaman1)
The centre of gravity is shifting right all over Europe with each election cycle. Euroscepticism is also generally on the rise.
Too bad your little narrative has just been destroyed by the Dutch elections, and French and German polls will kill it.

(Original post by Dandaman1)
And to reference your other post, treating the victory of a right-wing party like a victory for the left reeks far more of desperation.
In reference to your post, making false statements about parties political orientation reeks of ignorance and stupidity. Typical right-wing then.
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GenialGermanGent
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(Original post by pol pot noodles)
Popular vote doesn't decide the winner of the US presidential election. So no, Clinton didn't win.

A clear majority of the American population voted for a center-left candidate. So, yeah, the Left won. An unqualified, disgraced buffoon in the White House (or rather, Trump Tower) who will either resign or be impeached, doesn't change that.

(Original post by pol pot noodles)
You're discounting Brexit and Trump precisely by saying 'that's all [the right] had'.
No, I am not. By saying that, I am acknowledging the existence of those events.
.
(Original post by pol pot noodles)
What exactly has the left had then? Relying on the centre-right to beat the 'far' right in European elections?
Oh, I don't know, maybe winning just about every election in the last 50 years? But you're probably just a child with very limited knowledge of politics and history, so you're only partly to blame.

(Original post by pol pot noodles)
I'm not nervous about anything.
You seem VERY nervous, maybe even starting to panic. Breathe, my xenophobic, nationalistic friend!

(Original post by pol pot noodles)
I'm just going to marvel at the fact that you think the centre-right beating the right into second place is a victory for the left.
Nobody has asked you to marvel at anything. Just acknowledge that a trend has been reversed, that people see through the lies and hateful rhetoric of the Right and that you lot will soon be again where you belong, isolated, on the fringe of society.
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