Kurdish terrorist supporters protest in Frankfurt

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    Protesters chanted "freedom for Ocalan", referring to Abdullah Ocalan, the jailed leader of the terrorist Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), with many waving flags featuring Ocalan's face.
    It is stupid to call this an "protest against Erdogan" when they are asking for the release of a Terrorist leader. This is just an obvious generic PKK rally hidden in guise of being against Erdogan's authoritarianism.

    Posters of his face were recently banned in Germany. The police told the protesters several times to take down the Öcalan banners. Because the protesters didn't comply, the police recorded them on video.

    They are taking advantage of current anti-Erdogan stance Europe has to push their agenda.

    Whats with all the apologists for PKK terrorism? People condemn terrorism when it happens in France and Germany, but when it happens in eastern Greece or Israel they defend it?

    Protests like this have no place in Europe. Turkey should stop exporting their problems over here.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-tu...-idUSKBN16P0HQ


    So, apparently many people here seem to think the PKK are wonderful chaps. They may be tame compared to ISIS, and their cause may be understandable, but their methods are far beyond the pale. I don't really like this imposter state known as "Turkey", not when they occupy rightful European clay, but I do not condone the PKK's actions. Especially when they are harming Europe.

    I think sometimes we need to take a step back and look at who exactly we are supporting. I think because many of us have such hatred for ISIS that we are overlooking the groups that we are giving support to. By supporting certain groups without looking into who they really are or their past, Is that not making us as bad as those we accuse of supporting terrorists?

    Now I can understand the anger among many Turkish Kurds. Many atrocities have happened to them over the past century but when I start to do some research into the PKK I start to realize that they are themselves quite shadowy.

    I do try stay neutral and always try to look at the situation from both sides. Some quotes and facts about the slaughter/genocides (Though genocide is disputed) against the kurds in Turkey by the Turkish.

    *After the establishment of the Republic of Turkey, which ended the caliphates and sultanate in Turkey, there have been several Kurdish rebellions since the 1920s: Koçkiri Rebellion, Sheikh Said Rebellion, Dersim Rebellion, Ararat rebellion.

    A key component of the turkification process was the policy of massive population resettlement.

    I'm sure there have been more crimes committed if you look into them yourself.

    However, the PKK has committed it's own atrocities and also seems to have some shady dealing with mafias and crime across Europe. Here are some examples:

    The ethnically Kurdish crime groups have their origin in the Southeast Anatolia part of Turkey. These groups are largely clan based and their main source of income is the trafficking of heroin and weapons. Kurdish crime bosses such as Huseyin Baybasin have been active in Western European countries, especially Great Britain. Links to the PKK exist. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_mafia

    Due to the guerrilla war much of the countryside in the southeast was depopulated, with Kurdish civilians moving to local defensible centers such as Diyarbakır, Van, and Şırnak, as well as to the cities of western Turkey and even to western Europe. The causes of the depopulation included PKK atrocities against Kurdish clans they could not control http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurds_in_Turkey

    On 14 October 2009, the U.S. Department of the Treasury's Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) targeted the senior leadership of the PKK, designating as significant foreign narcotics traffickers, Murat Karayılan, the head of the PKK, and high-ranking members Ali Riza Altun and Zubayir Aydar.[50] On 20 April 2011, the U.S. Department of the Treasury announced the designation of PKK founders Cemil Bayik and Duran Kalkan and other high-ranking members as Specially Designated Narcotics Traffickers (SDNT) pursuant to the Foreign Narcotics Kingpin Designation Act (Kingpin Act). Pursuant to the Kingpin Act, the designation freezes any assets the designees may have under U.S. jurisdiction and prohibits U.S. persons from conducting financial or commercial transactions with these individuals.[51] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdist...ug_trafficking

    On February 13, Frank Urbancic, deputy counterterrorism coordinator at the State Department, told CNN-Turk, "The PKK [Kurdistan Workers Party] is like the mafia all over Europe." He added that in addition to its terrorist presence in Europe, the PKK has an "octopus-like structure carrying out criminal activity, including drug and people smuggling" to raise funds, as well as "fronts that provide cover to the organization's criminal and terror activities." http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/p...onts-in-europe

    I'm sure many of you get the picture. Is this really a group we want to support and is it really justifiable to support them because they are fighting ISIS?

    I will just make clear that this is not aimed as Iraqi kurds or Syrian Kurds but I do believe we need to stop acting as if the PKK have halos over their heads.

    I bring this up because I see people on here supporting the PKK. Don't get me wrong, I am not taking the Turks side over this as it is very clear to see what their government is doing, and also the attitudes of the Turks themselves, but maybe there is a reason for this attitude. It seems a very complicated subject.

    The media are trying their hardest to convince us that the PKK are now the good guys and they should be taken off the terrorist list but just because they are now getting involved in the fights against ISIS; but does that mean we should forget about their crimes that they are committing in Europe and "Turkey"?

    I apologize if this post was not written very well but I have a migraine and it's late.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Whats with all the apologists for PKK terrorism? People condemn terrorism when it happens in France and Germany, but when it happens in eastern Greece or Israel they defend it?
    I don't recall terrorists in France or Germany ever breaking off their own resources and aims to save tens of thousands of people from genocide. Because that's what the PKK did at Sinjar in August 2014. And the PKK are still part of the only democratic force fighting ISIS on the ground in Syria.

    Also, what terrorism are you referring to in "Eastern Greece"? That's all small islands, isn't it?
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    I don't recall terrorists in France or Germany ever breaking off their own resources and aims to save tens of thousands of people from genocide. Because that's what the PKK did at Sinjar in August 2014. And the PKK are still part of the only democratic force fighting ISIS on the ground in Syria.
    Its hardly a surprise that the PKK try to stop the genocide of Kurds. But the fact is that the PKK, 'democratic' or not, has committed many of its own atrocities. Its like the IRA; their cause might be a just one, but their methods are ones of terror.

    Also, what terrorism are you referring to in "Eastern Greece"? That's all small islands, isn't it?
    Anatolia and Constantinople.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Its hardly a surprise that the PKK try to stop the genocide of Kurds.
    They weren't Kurds, they were Yazidis.



    Anatolia and Constantinople.
    That's called Turkey.

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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    Anatolia and Constantinople.
    Who taught you geography?

    You seem to be using some pretty outdated names.
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    (Original post by Willy Pete)
    Who taught you geography?

    You seem to be using some pretty outdated names.
    1453 was Fake News.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    x
    Are you showing your support for the PKK?
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    You and Ambitious1999, two sides of the same coin.
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    It is stupid to call this an "protest against Erdogan" when they are asking for the release of a Terrorist leader. This is just an obvious generic PKK rally hidden in guise of being against Erdogan's authoritarianism.
    Why? It takes a brave person to accept that the side that you oppose have views, dreams and aspirations too. Can you remember the UK and NI during the 70s, 80s and 90s? Remember when IRA bombs blew up Warrington, Manchester and the Canary Wharf in London?

    And then some brave people accepted that what some people called terrorists were perhaps seeking recognition and understanding? They all sat down around a table and at the end of the process came up with a deal that suited all, shook hands on it and by and large lived in peace ever since.

    One mans terrorist is another's freedom fighter. Peace will exist if all are recognised. You seem to want to bat down the Kurds as an irrelevance not worthy of entering a discussion. Naturally, the only way they can be heard is by raising their voice through violence. So what is the solution? More violence?
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    I get that you're an Islamophobic troll looking to ironically support Salafis but this is pretty low. The Kurds are good people and their integrity should not be mocked or called into question without clear and proper reason.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    PRSOM
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    (Original post by l'etranger)
    I get that you're an Islamophobic troll looking to ironically support Salafis but this is pretty low. The Kurds are good people and their integrity should not be mocked or called into question without clear and proper reason.
    The PKK are terrorists.
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    (Original post by Willy Pete)
    The PKK are terrorists.
    get out
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    (Original post by l'etranger)
    get out
    Oh, do you support terrorists?
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    (Original post by Willy Pete)
    Oh, do you support terrorists?
    I support Kurdish liberation and if necessary a Kurdish majority in Turkey.
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    (Original post by l'etranger)
    I support Kurdish liberation and if necessary a Kurdish majority in Turkey.
    So you support the PKK?
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    (Original post by Mathemagicien)
    You and Ambitious1999, two sides of the same coin.
    Lazy horseshoer
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    (Original post by Willy Pete)
    Are you showing your support for the PKK?
    I'm showing support for Rojava! *raises fist*

    That Oclam dude renounced his Marxist-Leninism and now espouses democratic confederalism based on the writings of Murray Bookchin (someone else who I admire and who's widow has been to see it in person)), these principles are being put into practise in Rojava in the battle against all forces of reaction in the middle east. The dude played a big part in keeping alive an ideal of liberation and Rojava is a small but significant enclave that represents that ideal is still alive in the world.

    So I guess you could say I "support" him. I definitely think it is disgraceful that Turkey (a NATO member) is spending more time killing kurds etc than fighting ISIS (which is basically supports) and we do nothing.

    Also the Obama was helping the PKK in the fight against ISIS.
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    (Original post by Willy Pete)
    So you support the PKK?
    The UN has never designated the PKK a terrorist organisation.
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    One mans terrorist is another's freedom fighter. Peace will exist if all are recognised. You seem to want to bat down the Kurds as an irrelevance not worthy of entering a discussion. Naturally, the only way they can be heard is by raising their voice through violence. So what is the solution? More violence?
    Nothing gets people on your side like killing innocent civilians.
 
 
 
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