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Help me please. Feminist Problem. watch

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    My friend put me on the spot today.

    Basically, he said, why do you (a feminist) support Islam (or are tolerant of it/support immigration) when women in Islam are worth half that of a man? Surely that goes against the very definition and fundamental principles of what feminism stands for?

    I just didn't know what to say.

    Maybe he is right? How can I understand what appears to be a terrible logical contradiction in my head?!

    Advice welcome
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    Maybe because women arent treated half of a man in islam?
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    He is partially right, Islam teaches some pretty abhorrent things in terms of gender.

    So why do you support it?

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    Because logic and feminism doesn't work
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    He is partially right, Islam teaches some pretty abhorrent things in terms of gender.

    So why do you support it?

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    Islam does not devalue women! We are just as important! Islam is a religion of equality! I am a feminist , a strong one but I am still a believer of Islam!
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    (Original post by aspire.1a)
    Islam does not devalue women! We are just as important! Islam is a religion of equality! I am a feminist , a strong one but I am still a believer of Islam!
    Equality is that a joke, why is it that Islamic nations are some the most unequal nations in terms of gender in the world?

    It allows wife beating and rape, sounds so equal.

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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    Equality is that a joke, why is it that Islamic nations are some the most unequal nations in terms of gender in the world?

    It allows wife beating and rape, sounds so equal.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Okay. Yes some countries impost strict rules on women I cant dispute that however those countries are not following the true islam if they allow wife beating! I am against domestic violence! Islam never allows that! Rape? Rape is considered a huge sin in our religion!!
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    (Original post by aspire.1a)
    Islam does not devalue women! We are just as important! Islam is a religion of equality! I am a feminist , a strong one but I am still a believer of Islam!
    ...right, so how's that not sitting next to men and not being allowed near the Qu'ran when you're menstruating due to "impurity" working out for you?
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    (Original post by aspire.1a)
    Okay. Yes some countries impost strict rules on women I cant dispute that however those countries are not following the true islam if they allow wife beating! I am against domestic violence! Islam never allows that! Rape? Rape is considered a huge sin in our religion!!
    The quran permits both of those things, isn't the quran the "true" word of God?

    Don't no true Scotsmen this.

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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    Equality is that a joke, why is it that Islamic nations are some the most unequal nations in terms of gender in the world?

    It allows wife beating and rape, sounds so equal.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Question: Given your extensive knowledge of Islam why are you saying that a countries cultural problems (oppressing women) are the same as so called problems with Islam.

    Under Islam women where given FAR FAR more rights than in any other western country.

    The problem lies with the cultural values of Islamic countries and their use of religion to justify their internal political means of control, not with Islam.

    Islam like any other religion is open to interpretation ( depending on your sect ) therefore do not blame the book blame the agenda of the reader.
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    (Original post by Joeking1999)
    Islam like any other religion is open to interpretation ( depending on your sect ) therefore do not blame the book blame the agenda of the reader.
    I thought the quran was supposed to be the "perfect word of god", surely the "perfect word of god" is not open to interpretation? Because that would make it imperfect.

    So how do you interpret the verse 4:34?
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    (Original post by Voi)
    My friend put me on the spot today.

    Basically, he said, why do you (a feminist) support Islam (or are tolerant of it/support immigration) when women in Islam are worth half that of a man? Surely that goes against the very definition and fundamental principles of what feminism stands for?

    I just didn't know what to say.

    Maybe he is right? How can I understand what appears to be a terrible logical contradiction in my head?!

    Advice welcome
    Yes, allah and muhammad told me to kill femenists
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    The quran permits both of those things, isn't the quran the "true" word of God?

    Don't no true Scotsmen this.

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    Have you ever read the quran? no i didn't think so stop making stuff up just because you don't like a certain religion.
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    (Original post by theoneandonlybob)
    Have you ever read the quran? no i didn't think so stop making stuff up just because you don't like a certain religion.
    Verse 4:34, permits domestic abuse.
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    Verse 4:34, permits domestic abuse.
    nope.
    http://www.islamicperspectives.com/quran-4-34.htm
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    Verse 4:34, permits domestic abuse.
    perhaps next time stuff misinterpreting things you don't see muslims doing that with the bible kinda sad really.
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    From your own source

    Beating is to be done after due admonition and suspension of sexual relations and therefore by husbands who have some moral standards and have sufficient control over their sexual passions. Moreover, this beating is not to go on and on but is to be tried as a last step to save the marriage.
    Beating is domestic abuse, so you have proved that the quran permits domestic abuse.
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    I thought the quran was supposed to be the "perfect word of god", surely the "perfect word of god" is not open to interpretation? Because that would make it imperfect.

    So how do you interpret the verse 4:34?
    1. Congratulations you know nothing about Islam

    2. In future when you decide to impose your intellectual and moral superiority on around 2 billion other people do some self reflection and some research first.

    3. The issue is that 'verse' you speak so fondly about as if you've unlocked the key to demonizing all Muslims was originally written in Arabic and I cant stop you from reading a translation which again serves an agenda.

    + If you decide to respond actually read my point don't commit to these knee jerk reactions of falling back on your favorite piece of misinformation.
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    (Original post by Joeking1999)
    1. Congratulations you know nothing about Islam

    2. In future when you decide to impose your intellectual and moral superiority on around 2 billion other people do some self reflection and some research first.

    3. The issue is that 'verse' you speak so fondly about as if you've unlocked the key to demonizing all Muslims was originally written in Arabic and I cant stop you from reading a translation which again serves an agenda.

    + If you decide to respond actually read my point don't commit to these knee jerk reactions of falling back on your favorite piece of misinformation.
    Congrats, you are condescending.

    It seems that the general consensus among islamic scholars is that it does indeed mean beating which is domestic abuse. But how would you interpret it since I am guessing you are a practising muslim.

    It also seems another muslim in this thread provided a link that confirms my understanding that it permits domestic abuse.
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    The quran permits both of those things, isn't the quran the "true" word of God?

    Don't no true Scotsmen this.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    why do people think the quran says rape is allowed?
    the point is that the women can't outright keep denying the husband sex but that doesn't mean he can violently force himself upon her. He has to arouse her and acc get her the mood etc.

    A man also can't use violence to try and get his wife to sleep with him. She also has a right to say no when menstruating and for an extremely long period after birth-giving.

    There are so many details people purposely choose to omit, I've barely outlined anything.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Also in terms of this equality shenanigan, both sexes have rights but men and women are not the same, there are obvious differences and islam accounts for the general cases of these differences.

    OP, go and research your own religion (And not from random ass websites on the internet) and come to your own decision. Views you get from other people will always be biased including mine.
 
 
 
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