Why do poor people vote for the Torys? Watch

Black Bard
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#81
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Labour was once a workers party, then university educated marxist became an ever growing presence. These soon were joined by the middle class liberals and neo liberals and before you knew it the party had changed from a brass tacks party to an ideological minefield of splinter groups. The question is how do working class people view themselves? Do they see themselves as hopeless ignorant children who must be cared for and educated by the state. Or do they see themselves as people who work to support themselves and their families. Labour is quick to lump those who have fallen through the safety net and struggle with a wide range of social issues in with the working class, who would rather not be lumped in with addicts and gang members. Middle class marxist and socialist speak about the end of capitalism and private ownership whilst enjoying all the benefits of capitalism and private home ownership. The message is clear you don't want what I have because I know what is best for you. The Tories understand this and all they have to do is acknowledge the aspirations of working class people by saying you may not have what I have but with us you can have it. Of course it is a false promise but given the choice of one bunch of middle class group preaching and another bunch of middle class group handing out the possibility of winning life's lotto it isn't really that hard to understand why working class people don't vote. And there is the rub because if more working class people did vote then we probably wouldn't have a Tory government.So the reason working class people don't vote for Labour is they don't see themselves directing the party, and that is all on Labour.
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Johnny English
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#82
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(Original post by Black Bard)
Labour was once a workers party, then university educated marxist became an ever growing presence. These soon were joined by the middle class liberals and neo liberals and before you knew it the party had changed from a brass tacks party to an ideological minefield of splinter groups. The question is how do working class people view themselves? Do they see themselves as hopeless ignorant children who must be cared for and educated by the state. Or do they see themselves as people who work to support themselves and their families. Labour is quick to lump those who have fallen through the safety net and struggle with a wide range of social issues in with the working class, who would rather not be lumped in with addicts and gang members. Middle class marxist and socialist speak about the end of capitalism and private ownership whilst enjoying all the benefits of capitalism and private home ownership. The message is clear you don't want what I have because I know what is best for you. The Tories understand this and all they have to do is acknowledge the aspirations of working class people by saying you may not have what I have but with us you can have it. Of course it is a false promise but given the choice of one bunch of middle class group preaching and another bunch of middle class group handing out the possibility of winning life's lotto it isn't really that hard to understand why working class people don't vote. And there is the rub because if more working class people did vote then we probably wouldn't have a Tory government.So the reason working class people don't vote for Labour is they don't see themselves directing the party, and that is all on Labour.
I can only echo and admire the sentiments and points made above .
The labour party is now and has been for several years more of a left wing protest party than a serious political government in waiting .
Many hard working folk will never vote Labour again over the immigration argument . Many don't want this country swamped to the extent it is . It's a national disgrace . We have lost our national pride and own cultural heritage that was once so cherished and protected. I grew up in an era where housing was cheap , communities were safe and crime levels almost non existent . What we know see in our towns and cities bears no resemblance to those halcyon days and that situation has been created in the main by Labour social models and mass immigration .
The country is under tremendous pressure to deliver those goods and services we have come to rely on but it is at breaking point.
Corbyn promises the earth but will deliver nothing . The shadow cabinet is dominated by idiots and left wing trolls who should have no place in British politics .
The Labour party is in a complete shambles from which it will never recover . God help us if they were ever involved in the Brexit negotiations. This country would be the laughing stock of Europe.
Long live Theresa May and the principles she stands for .!!
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laowaiphil
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#83
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Poor people vote Tory for the same reason they buy iPhones: corporate propaganda.
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username3786078
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#84
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(Original post by BigYoSpeck)
After a wasted attempt to appeal to reason with an uncle of mine here are the bullet points of why he's going to be voting Tory:

*Impractical and unaffordable Labour policies
*Corbyn is a lunatic left wing communist terrorist appeaser
*He doesn't like beards
*Tories are the lesser of 2 evils
*Under labour this country will disappear through a black hole of capitulation and appeasement to Europe something this country fought 2 wars to avoid
*There are a lot of Tories that are pro brexit far more than in labour or lib dems
*Labour favour mass inmmigration
*Labour wants a £10 minimum wage to people at mcdonalds
*Doesn't believe someone serving chip's should be earning close to what he earns
*Thinks it will cause job losses
As far as I'm concerned, most of those sound like very sensible, well-grounded reasons for his decision to vote for the Conservatives. You really shouldn't berate or condemn a person (much less a member of your own family) for their personal, political preferences or political views. It really isn't becoming of any person, although I've come to realise that this sort of behaviour is actually inevitable in the realm of politics.
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Mair18919
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#85
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(Original post by Zxyn)
And Tory cuts have helped with the quality of life and housing? I’m sure all those zero hours contracts in the gig economy are serving many in great ways!
The gig economy is private sector so not linked to Tory cuts. It is linked to an oversupply of cheap and flexible abour though.
Where is that coming from?

(Original post by Zxyn)
Have you ever seen a movie called The Big Short? If not, watch it or at least the ending.
I prefer to base my political views on facts thanks. I am sure it's entertaining and probably makes some very valid points, but ultimately movies are just stuff someone made up.
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username3672344
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#86
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(Original post by Johnny English)
I can only echo and admire the sentiments and points made above .
The labour party is now and has been for several years more of a left wing protest party than a serious political government in waiting .
Many hard working folk will never vote Labour again over the immigration argument . Many don't want this country swamped to the extent it is . It's a national disgrace . We have lost our national pride and own cultural heritage that was once so cherished and protected. I grew up in an era where housing was cheap , communities were safe and crime levels almost non existent . What we know see in our towns and cities bears no resemblance to those halcyon days and that situation has been created in the main by Labour social models and mass immigration .
The country is under tremendous pressure to deliver those goods and services we have come to rely on but it is at breaking point.
Corbyn promises the earth but will deliver nothing . The shadow cabinet is dominated by idiots and left wing trolls who should have no place in British politics .
The Labour party is in a complete shambles from which it will never recover . God help us if they were ever involved in the Brexit negotiations. This country would be the laughing stock of Europe.
Long live Theresa May and the principles she stands for .!!
It always makes me laugh that people complain about immigrations effect on public services yet they support the Tories austerity agenda.
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username3672344
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#87
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(Original post by Black Bard)
Labour was once a workers party, then university educated marxist became an ever growing presence. These soon were joined by the middle class liberals and neo liberals and before you knew it the party had changed from a brass tacks party to an ideological minefield of splinter groups. The question is how do working class people view themselves? Do they see themselves as hopeless ignorant children who must be cared for and educated by the state. Or do they see themselves as people who work to support themselves and their families. Labour is quick to lump those who have fallen through the safety net and struggle with a wide range of social issues in with the working class, who would rather not be lumped in with addicts and gang members. Middle class marxist and socialist speak about the end of capitalism and private ownership whilst enjoying all the benefits of capitalism and private home ownership. The message is clear you don't want what I have because I know what is best for you. The Tories understand this and all they have to do is acknowledge the aspirations of working class people by saying you may not have what I have but with us you can have it. Of course it is a false promise but given the choice of one bunch of middle class group preaching and another bunch of middle class group handing out the possibility of winning life's lotto it isn't really that hard to understand why working class people don't vote. And there is the rub because if more working class people did vote then we probably wouldn't have a Tory government.So the reason working class people don't vote for Labour is they don't see themselves directing the party, and that is all on Labour.
Labour is full of neoliberals so you're voting Tory? Hmm
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laowaiphil
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#88
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(Original post by Less(e/o)n)
As far as I'm concerned, most of those sound like very sensible, well-grounded reasons for his decision to vote for the Conservatives. You really shouldn't berate or condemn a person (much less a member of your own family) for their personal, political preferences or political views. It really isn't becoming of any person, although I've come to realise that this sort of behaviour is actually inevitable in the realm of politics.
> Voting to keep the minimum wage depressed, because low-skilled workers and their families deserve to be trapped in working poverty forever, and because massive structural inequality is sustainable and healthy.
> "Sensible, well grounded reasons"

To be blunt, if this is a common reason for voting Tory, then this country deserves what it gets. A spiteful, backward regime for a spiteful, backward electorate.
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Rakas21
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#89
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(Original post by laowaiphil)
> Voting to keep the minimum wage depressed, because low-skilled workers and their families deserve to be trapped in working poverty forever, and because massive structural inequality is sustainable and healthy.
> "Sensible, well grounded reasons"

To be blunt, if this is a common reason for voting Tory, then this country deserves what it gets. A spiteful, backward regime for a spiteful, backward electorate.
The minimum wage rises by almost 5% in April. Your about 19 years out of date in terms of Tory policy.
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laowaiphil
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(Original post by Rakas21)
The minimum wage rises by almost 5% in April. Your about 19 years out of date in terms of Tory policy.
4.4% is not almost 5%, but it is in line with the annual increase in railway fare exploitation so I'll give you that. Truly, the Tories have found communism. Come April, I expect the proles will be throwing their extra 33p into the air, singing songs of thanksgiving for such lavish gifts.

In any case, I wasn't referring to Tory policy. I was referring to the prejudices of Tory voters, who perceive Labour's support for a real living wage as a threat to their prerogative to sneer at fast food workers.
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Arran90
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#91
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Calvinism. Millions of working class folk are not one bit religious and they have never even heard of John Calvin but they adhere strongly to his ideology and work their backsides off because they believe it is the right and morally correct thing to do rather than scrounge off the state or others. The Conservatives are for workers and Labour are for shirkers, as for the Greens with their UBI, it's morally wrong and they would rather see the money spent on foreign wars instead.
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laowaiphil
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#92
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(Original post by Arran90)
as for the Greens with their UBI, it's morally wrong and they would rather see the money spent on foreign wars instead.
Lol wut.
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L i b
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#93
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(Original post by Mair18919)
The gig economy is private sector so not linked to Tory cuts. It is linked to an oversupply of cheap and flexible abour though.
Where is that coming from?
That's hardly the main cause. The gig economy is, in a good part, simply the economy evolving in line with technological change. Labour doesn't have to be especially cheap in this equation, simply that it is easily accessible: connectivity has made it far more possible as well as making advertising easier and giving guarantees around consumer rights.
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bob072
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#94
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Because they don't want to be made even poorer from taxes?
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Alder0
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#95
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Well most poor people were strong Labour supporters up until the mid-late 2000s. After that then most poor people have swung away from Labour to other parties. Probably due to the Financial Crisis, Gordon Brown or Tony Blair's Failures...
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So-Sarah
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#96
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(Original post by Moura)
I see so many working class people unsure whether to vote for Labour or Tory or are actively saying they will vote Tory... I fail to understand this.
Labour are the party for the middle-classes, Tory for poor and uppers


Why vote Labour if poor as all they'll do is import shite load of refugees /immmigrants and waste a fortune on foreign aid, whilst emasculating the nation's armed forces, no thanks
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Johnny English
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#97
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Not so long ago clowns like Corbyn and Diane Abbott would have been regarded as enemies of the state .
Some might argue they still are following their reluctance to criticise Russias faux pas
. There is no way back for Labour. This is the end .
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Arran90
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(Original post by laowaiphil)
Lol wut.
I can assure you of this. My own experience is that support for UBI is strongest amongst certain comfortably well off educated types (of various political ideologies) but it doesn't resonate much with the lower classes. There is definitely support amongst the poor for more generous benefits and a kinder hearted DWP but I think deep down that the majority of these people believe in earning a living and benefits as a short term safety net.
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username1738683
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#99
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'Poor people' may vote Tory because poverty doesn't necessarily equal stupidity. Lowest-earners have all benefited from the increase in the tax allowance from 6.5 to 11.5k since 2010, putting more money in their pockets.

They have also been helped by the freeze on the exorbitant council-tax increases under Labour and by an economic picture where unemployment is historically low. It may work differently for poor people who don't work, in which case Labour may well be a more generous option.

Labour would be a bottomless pit for public money, with everyone being stuffed into 'the public services' for their Union membership fees and political control. Future generations to pay for it all forever, they have no idea what would hit them.
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Arran90
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The Conservatives have been just as in favour of mass immigration as Labour has except they have been more subtle about it. There is precious little evidence that they will make good their past deficiencies and deception on the issue. Part of the problem is that when the City tells the Conservatives to jump, they jump.
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