Evolution requires more faith than religion.

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lol at this double standard, So it's fine for religion to have a god created from nothing but not for science?

Where does any credible scientific source actually posit "creation" from nothing? That just seems like a popsci myth to me. The only mainstream conjecture about the early Universe is this concept of a singularity, which was arrived at using classical physics which is widely expected to be inadequate at the temperatures and energies involved in the Big Bang (slightly misleading name), and which in any case does not amount to ex nihilo creation.

Any position in addition to naturalism automatically requires more faith, since it can't be empirically validated, hasn't been otherwise validated and has an enormous burden of proof as it is so complex (in terms of the size and quantity of what it posits).

Edit: I realise the OP was referring primarily to evolution; I just wanted to argue against this idea that the scientific explanation is that "everything came from nothing." I don't really know enough about evolution and abiogenesis to talk about it, but the amino acids and elements which made them up came from asteroid impacts mostly during the heavy bombardment phase (as far as I know), which definitely isn't "nothing."

(edited 6 years ago)

Reply 22

Zorox1911

No I mean fossil records showing evolution taking place. Funnily enough there aren't any (or nowhere near enough to show evolution)

Original post by Tian1Sky

-if you mean fossil records from a human common ancestor, they exist, if you mean fossil records from the earliest common ancestor of all life, they don't exist because that would have been some kind of microscopic organism without a skeleton.
-White skin would not be preferable in hotter areas, as it would burn. Please get away from your computer, go outside and experience sunburn, then read what you just wrote again and laugh at yourself.

Reply 23

black1blade

Do you understand anything about probability and how big the universe is and how incredibly long it took for evolution to occur and even for those basic micoorganisms to come into existence? Of course we don't have a time machine so we can never go back and see the very moment that life can into existence although we can make theories based on logical reasoning. I think it's fine to have faith in religion however don't dismiss science just because it doesn't match a literal (quite a reductive way to interpret especially a spiritual text) interpretation of Abrahamic religion. If you're religious then a far more sensible thing to believe is that God in some way guided the development of our universe. Creating something from nothing (ie big bang) as incredibly complex and amazing as our universe seems like a pretty godlike thing to do if you ask me. One of the scientists that actually proposed the big bang theory based on an extrapolation back in time from Einstein's equations was also a priest. He famously said that there are 2 paths to the truth and I chose to walk both of them or something along those lines.

Reply 24

Zorox1911

There's no double standard, science claims that somehow the cosmos was made from nothing, without supernatural intervention. Religion claims that a god who exists outside his creation ( and therefore it's constraints and laws) created the cosmos, I can't see the double standard.

Original post by Kravence

lol at this double standard, So it's fine for religion to have a god created from nothing but not for science?

Reply 25

Tian1Sky

Original post by Zorox1911

No I mean fossil records showing evolution taking place. Funnily enough there aren't any (or nowhere near enough to show evolution)

Evolution is a process, a fossil is static, therefore one fossil cannot "show" evolution. To see evolution, you have to compare multiple fossils. Fortunately that has been done, and that's basically where the idea of evolution came from.

Reply 26

Zorox1911

Well, I'm not sure you can call it evidence but...

Original post by Vikingninja

Which is a completely nonsensical theory which doesn't have any proof that he existed before it, atleast evidence exists for the other scientific theories that you say against.

Reply 27

historydoggo

Original post by Zorox1911

No I mean fossil records showing evolution taking place. Funnily enough there aren't any (or nowhere near enough to show evolution)

But there is, There's plenty of fossil records that show subtle changes in animals, like horses which came up in a biology exam once

Reply 28

zeldor711

Evolution is almost completely without doubt due to the overwhelming amount of evidence in its favour. Events like the Big Bang have evidence,but not enough that they can be definitively proved beyond all reasonable doubt. We may never know for sure what caused the Big Bang (which is absolutely fine), but we should not just create an explanation that suits our needs with no corroborating evidence.

This is an entirely separate issue from evolution. Check the facts before making such a claim

Reply 29

lolfloplol

Original post by Zorox1911

The Big Bang theory is based on the idea that everything was brought into being from nothing, that's impossible... even a child realises you can't create something from nothing.

Also, how can cells become sentient if they weren't in the first place? How did evolution ( a highly random process) produce such an intricate body with such little room for manoeuvre (for example in body temperature) all of this points to inteligent design as opposed to some cell magically transforming itself into organ systems and creating humans and other living beings...

If you're going to use this line of argument, explain how god was created. p

If you want that answer, go and ask an expert scientist. You know very well no one here can answer that properly. You religious fanatics will never debate a scientist.

Reply 30

Kravence

Original post by Zorox1911

You're seriously trying to claim saying supernatural intervention which cannot be proved is valid
lmao you're a joke

Reply 31

ImZachie

What is interesting is that your God is just as probable as any other god that has ever been theorised. We could have been created by aliens or Vishnu or millions of other gods that people believe in - what makes your god THE creator and not something else? What makes a specific religion correct? There's way to many different religions with vivid descriptions begging everyone to come and listen... I can't even beat my d*ck without getting convicted.

Reply 32

Formless

Weather or not god exists, Science saves live, cures the weak, explains the supernatural, gets us to the moon, allows you to type on this tsr thread and the list goes on. I invest myself and time in ideas that work and have intrinsic value, God/Religion does not provide any of this. Evolution is one of the most well documented scientific facts that exist, your lack of knowledge is the source of your cognitive dissonance.

Reply 33

user382

What so logic vs the idea that a bearded **** in a skirt is our all mighty saviour.

Reply 34

Racoon

Original post by Vikingninja

Where did the god come from?

God has always been and will always be.....

Reply 35

Racoon

Original post by Zorox1911

In my opinion, evolution requires more faith than religion.
...............................
If anyone has arguments to the contrary I would love to hear them

I totally agree, in the past I've even asked all those who 'believe' in evolution to convince me so I can be converted, but to date nothing.

The posts usually end up very angry and comments aim to belittle rather than dealing with the facts so I give up.

Reply 36

Racoon

Original post by historydoggo

But there is, There's plenty of fossil records that show subtle changes in animals, like horses which came up in a biology exam once

There isn't one. I challenge you to find one.

You will find an immense variety of fossils of living creatures we have never seen, that's because they are extinct, not because they are part of a progression of evolution.