Muslims, do you go to the pub with your work colleagues? Watch

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QE2
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(Original post by Anonymous)
QE2 Please restore some sanity to this thread, so many horrid isoc cranks spewing venom trying to derail. Thx
It's just the usual cherry-picking stuff. Muslims who want to look like they are pious and truly following the word of Allah and example of Muhammad often use this issue to virtue-signal the strength of their deen, while ignoring or rejecting other parts of Islamic doctrine (Christians are no different).
I suspect that there is often quite a bit of using it as justification for why they never get asked.
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(Original post by Mustafa0605)
Going to the pub hugely increases her chances of consuming alcohol,
Only if you intend to drink. I went to the pub last night an dd not drink, simply because I decided not to.

If her classmates cared one bit about her, they wouldn’t chose a pub, of all places, to meet up.
Why? Her classmates probably understand that you don't have to drink in the pub. What happened to free will?
Also, if 20 people are going out on a social night and 19 of them want to drink alcohol, it would be utterly selfish of the one to expect the 19 to change their plans for no practical reason. Would you expect a vegetarian to insist that their 10 meat-eating friends go to a vegetarian restaurant, our should the veggie simply order one of the veggie dishes from the regular restaurant menu?

Alcohol is an intoxicant and makes the human being, the most intelligent creature on the planet, behave worse than animals.
No it doesn't. Although it can make people behave badly, in most cases it does not.
Also, don't forget that Allah tells you that disbelievers are the worst of animals anyway, and that is without alcohol.

There is no hate or trouble making, this is the fact.
According to your god, you should have hatred towards disbelievers (60:4). So, if you are willing to ignore Allah by not hating disbelievers, what is the problem with going to the pub with your work colleagues?
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QE2
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(Original post by Mustafa0605)
Speaking to non-Muslims is not a problem. In fact the Quran, it says Christians are the closest friends to Muslims. But that does not mean going to the pub because she will have an increased chance of actually consuming the substance which causes humans to lose their brain and is severely forbidden in the religion of Islam. Attachment 851260
But then 5:51 says to not take Christians as friends, so who knows?
O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.
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QE2
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(Original post by -Quava-)
Because you're not supposed to stand around shopping centres looking for people to leap on.
It's not even the right approach for starters.
Giving dawah is a duty upon Muslims. Muhammad used to preach in public to disbelievers.
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QE2
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(Original post by ANM775)
Those white women definately were not dressed like muslims..

It looked like they were dressed for a night out imo, but i suppose it could have been an event..
Perhaps they were Muslims in kuffar fancy dress?
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Anonymous #2
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#46
This ex Muslim has always got something to say...Any questions relating to Islam, he jumps to the scene. Don't bother entertaining him.

If you're gonna quote from the Quran at least quote it properly - This guy talks about cherrypicking...Allah SWT said:

قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِىٓ إِبْرٰهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُۥٓ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَءٰٓؤُا مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدٰوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَآءُ أَبَدًا حَتّٰى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُۥٓ إِلَّا قَوْلَ إِبْرٰهِيمَ لِأَبِيهِ لَأَسْتَغْفِرَنّ َ لَكَ وَمَآ أَمْلِكُ لَكَ مِنَ اللَّهِ مِنْ شَىْءٍ  ۖ رَّب ‘َنَا عَلَيْكَ تَوَكَّلْنَا وَإِلَيْكَ أَنَبْنَا وَإِلَيْكَ الْمَصِيرُ
"There has already been for you an excellent pattern in Abraham and those with him, when they said to their people, Indeed, we are disassociated from you and from whatever you worship other than Allah. We have denied you, and there has appeared between us and you animosity and hatred forever until you believe in Allah alone except for the saying of Abraham to his father, I will surely ask forgiveness for you, but I have not [power to do] for you anything against Allah. Our Lord, upon You we have relied, and to You we have returned, and to You is the destination."
(Quran. Al-Mumtahana 60: Verse 4)

Stop twisting words to suit your agenda...It's not friends it allies as Christian & Jews are allies of one another which means they are against Muslims. Evidently, this guy clearly has something against Islam and has a bunch of notes compiled at the ready to post on every Muslim related post.

FYI, Muslims are clearly being attacked worldwide and the Christian & Jews are forming alliances whilst people are being persecuted and oppressed. Israel is a prime example. Creating more borders, dividing the Muslims.

Allah SWT said:

يٰٓأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ ءَامَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصٰرٰىٓ أَوْلِيَآءَ  ۘ  بَعْضُهُمْ أَوْلِيَآءُ بَعْضٍ  ۚ وَمَ٠†Ù’ يَتَوَلَّهُمْ مِّنْكُمْ فَإِنَّهُۥ مِنْهُمْ  ۗ إِ٠†Ù‘ÙŽ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِى الْقَوْمَ الظّٰلِمِينَ
"O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people."
(Quran. Al-Maaida 5: Verse 51)

Attachment 851304
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ANM775
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(Original post by QE2)
Perhaps they were Muslims in kuffar fancy dress?

SavaGE... [on so many levels]


-Quava- do you have a responce/comeback?
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-Quava-
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(Original post by ANM775)
SavaGE... [on so many levels]


-Quava- do you have a responce/comeback?
You want me to respond to a childish remark from a grown man? I can't even stoop to that level of immaturity even if I tried and I really don't have the time for Islamaphobic jokes.
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-Quava-
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(Original post by QE2)
Giving dawah is a duty upon Muslims. Muhammad used to preach in public to disbelievers.
The shopping centre is a place that standing there approaching women today is not good for a man.
allowing the rignt people to come and listen is good because you can control where your sight is at but to approach women nowadays would not be good hence why you don't see it that often.
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-Quava-
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(Original post by QE2)
It's just the usual cherry-picking stuff. Muslims who want to look like they are pious and truly following the word of Allah and example of Muhammad often use this issue to virtue-signal the strength of their deen, while ignoring or rejecting other parts of Islamic doctrine (Christians are no different).
I suspect that there is often quite a bit of using it as justification for why they never get asked.
Muslims are not rejecting and cherry picking.
You're a grown man and the majority of Muslim TSRians on here are young and have a lot to learn about Islam still.
You come here to argue against every young Muslim teen to make them look like they're being hypocritical or they're ignoring their own religious teaches teachings when the matter of fact is that they're so young they don't even have a lot of knowledge.

But you do you. Continue targeting young Muslims and Christians to temporarily fix this little emotional issue you have surrounding religion. If it makes you feel better, why not?

And what I don't understand about ex-Muslims is you spend many years in a religion you don't like to spend the next 20 years still obsessing over it after you've left. If I left something behind I did not like, I wouldnt even give it a second thought and I'd move on with my life but here you are studying Islam in great depth to argue with young Muslim teens on the internet right in to your adulthood. What kind of quality of life is that?
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londonmyst
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#51
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(Original post by ANM775)
Why do they always target me and try to convert me?
please ask him what sorts of people him and his friends prefer to target.

I've developed a sixth sense for detecting them. They often move in a certain way, and seem to be dressed smartly. but there's something perculiar about the way they move that seperates them from other people dressed smartly.

I saw some whilst i was sitting down and was suspicious immediately. then i saw them start speaking to people. then i saw one of them had a bible so KNEW for sure they were mormons. i got up and quickly walked in the other direction. 2 seconds later one of them approaches me from the side!

He must of actually ran me down to get to me that quick because he was a talking with someone else a bit away when i started walking away from him. this was a busy shopping centre. he could have picked anyone but he zero's in on me and catches up with me. i've always had problems with religious people making bee lines for me. it's annoying.

black religious people are the worst for this i find.

A muslim has never tried to convert me though. I wonder why?
I've always attracted a lot of religious zealots and secular cranks trying to convert me too. :rolleyes:
Mormonism is an evangelical religious movement that prioritises attracting new converts as central to "doing God's work", like the jehovah's witnesses.
Every healthy adult LDS member is encouraged to volunteer for "missionary work" for between 18 months-3 years, usually in a foreign country.
In 2016, there were over 100,000 evangelical volunteers seeking to attract new members.
Mormons are christians who reject the trinity, many other churches are hostile to their teachings and do their utmost to convert mormons to trinitarian christianity.

The LDS church once forbade the admission of afro-american members; now days most members are deeply ashamed of that practice and actively seek to welcome black american guys.
There has been talk of LDS leaders setting targets for recruiting members of the black community to support their claims that that racism has been eliminated from mainstream mormonism.
While the breakaway fundamentalist mormon groups doing unlimited polygamy, are preaching the same race hate as the kkk in half their sermons.
Did the group who approached you have american accents or ask if you were from the usa?

Fundamentalist churches of all sects are growing very rapidly all over Africa and are big fans of aggressive conversion tactics.
Their preaching is hate filled, solicits violence and often supports squeezing congregation members for a eye watering amounts of financial contributions.
Tithes of 10% of annual income, direct debits, weekly church collections and extra "donations" on demand.
They will try and convert anybody.

Almost all followers of Islam won't impose their religious beliefs on others.
They value good manners and understand the negative reaction that evangelical pestering & street preaching generates.
Participating in inter-faith events, academically explaining Islamic traditions & scriptural interpretation when requested and charitable work- yes.
But not public preaching, jehovah's witness style hospital harassing of the sick or door-to-door pestering in search of new converts.

Islam absolutely prohibits the use of "compulsion in religion", acting like a dictator or humans attempting to play the role of God on earth.
It also needs to be mentioned that many followers of Islam were born in developing countries where church evangelical groups behaved appalling towards local people- resorting to horrifying insults, vile threats, vicious intimidation and economic warfare as tactics to coerce mass conversions.
Having been on the receiving side of religious harassment, they know how it feels and would never shame themselves or bring their religion into disrepute by doing it.
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ANM775
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(Original post by londonmyst)
Did the group who approached you have american accents or ask if you were from the usa?

hmm...

tbh now that i think about it, I don't think it was a british accent
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QE2
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(Original post by -Quava-)
You want me to respond to a childish remark from a grown man? I can't even stoop to that level of immaturity even if I tried and I really don't have the time for Islamaphobic jokes.
It was a serious point.
So, what are you saying here? That Muslims cannot wear fancy dress? Or that they can, but they cannot dress up as non-Muslims?
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QE2
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(Original post by -Quava-)
The shopping centre is a place if fitna and standing there approaching non-mahram women today is not good for a man.
Giving street dawah and allowing the rignt people to come and listen is good because you can control where your sight is at but to approach women nowadays would not be good hence why you don't see it that often.
Ok, so it is not permitted for Muslim men to attempt to convert individual women, but they can stand in the middle of a square and tell people in general they should convert.
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Plantagenet Crown
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(Original post by StudentIZ)
Hi, I’m a hijabi and my classmates are planning to meet up at a pub and I’m the only muslim/hijabi in my class and I’m afraid if I don’t go that I’ll be forever alienated from these groups.I can resist alcohol, it doesn’t tempt me anyway and I really want to go just so that we get to know each other well and they don’t avoid me because I’m backward or whatever 🙃All I want to know is, since it’s a pub and it’s in the evening, I don’t know what to do about hijab.I don’t want to attract attention by being the only hijabi in a pub, it’s bad as well as bringing down the image of Muslim women No one is going to know if I’m drinking or no.I know I shouldn’t be going in the first place but I don’t want to say no to the first meeting.After a few of probably stop. But can someone pls tell me how should I go? With hijab seems so bad and I’ve never really gone out without hijab before, I mean I’ve atleast worn a beanie but never without anything. I’m nervous, could someone pls help me out
Hi there.

You should definitely go. It’s not at all forbidden or wrong. As you said, it’s not healthy to deliberately alienate yourself from people for no good reason and you are of course under no pressure at all to drink, so that shouldn’t be an issue. Also, what does it matter if other people don’t know if you’re drinking or not, all that matters is that you know you’re not drinking.

Finally, wearing a hijab shouldn’t be a problem, most people nowadays don’t bat an eyelid at hijabis, especially in somewhere like London. You can just go there, socialise and integrate with your colleagues without touching a drop of alcohol. It’s totally OK and fine
Last edited by Plantagenet Crown; 2 months ago
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IH8Studying
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#56
you’re definitely going to get looks and you’ll
most likely be trending on twitter
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QE2
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(Original post by -Quava-)
Muslims are not rejecting and cherry picking.
Many clearly do, to some extent.

You're a grown man and the majority of Muslim TSRians on here are young and have a lot to learn about Islam still.
You come here to argue against every young Muslim teen to make them look like they're being hypocritical or they're ignoring their own religious teaches teachings when the matter of fact is that they're so young they don't even have a lot of knowledge.
I only argue with people who come on here and make claims or statements. If they don't know what they are talking about, perhaps they shouldn't come onto a religious debate forum and tell others who are better informed that they are "ignorant", "arrogant", to "educate themselves", etc.

I really don't see what age has to do with it. Aisha was only 9 but y'all claim she was mentally a mature adult.

But you do you. Continue targeting young Muslims and Christians to temporarily fix this little emotional issue you have surrounding religion. If it makes you feel better, why not?
I don't "target" anyone. I simply respond to others.

And what I don't understand about ex-Muslims is you spend many years in a religion you don't like to spend the next 20 years still obsessing over it after you've left. If I left something behind I did not like, I wouldnt even give it a second thought and I'd move on with my life but here you are studying Islam in great depth to argue with young Muslim teens on the internet right in to your adulthood.
When people recover from cancer, or kick drugs, or survive some avoidable trauma, of have been victims of some scam, etc, they often campaign to try and prevent others suffering in the same way.

The real question is, why wouldn't you?

What kind of quality of life is that?
If someone enjoys doing something, how is doing it negatively affecting their quality of life?

It always makes me laugh when people who devote literally their entire life to obsessing over following the rituals of ancient Middle Eastern superstition, who worry about avoiding ordinary, everyday things, whose every waking hour is consumed by a desire to gain some celestial reward or avoid punishment, accuse others of being obsessed or having odd lives. lol!
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londonmyst
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#58
(Original post by -Quava-)
Muslims are not rejecting and cherry picking.
You're a grown man and the majority of Muslim TSRians on here are young and have a lot to learn about Islam still.
You come here to argue against every young Muslim teen to make them look like they're being hypocritical or they're ignoring their own religious teaches teachings when the matter of fact is that they're so young they don't even have a lot of knowledge.

But you do you. Continue targeting young Muslims and Christians to temporarily fix this little emotional issue you have surrounding religion. If it makes you feel better, why not?

It's wonderful that you haven't been scared away from TSR by all the trolls, pervs and other creeps. :yy:
This message is a bit long, sorry.

All religious sects, leaders and individuals choose from a huge amount of scriptural quotes/teachings according to their intentions.
Over the millennia religious teachings has been used for a variety of purposes, to promote a variety of personal agendas- good, bad and evil.
Charity, education, forgiveness, redemption, love, compassion, mercy = for people who value these positive elements.
Political power, money, violence, hate, punishment, separatism and supremacy = for those who want to harness these less pleasant elements.

All elements are present within religion, reflected within both history and society- as ripe for abuse today as they were centuries ago.
Every religion under the sun- the abrahamic trio, hinduism, sikhism, scientology, mormonism, raelianism, jehovah's witnesses.
We must learn the lessons of history to avoid reliving some of the darkest events in history.
So many truly evil cults abusing religion and the faith of vulnerable members for purposes that would horrify you.

You know the powerful emotions that religion can stir up, the appeal of a united and welcoming religious community that preaches traditional righteousness as the sole path to an afterlife of eternal bliss.
You also know the history of this country.
Involvement in papal ordered violence against other religions, what Henry VIII did to end his marriage, how he used religion to torture/murder his critics, the brutal mass murders in the name of religion ordered by his daughter that earned her the nickname "Bloody Mary", Oliver Cromwell's lunatic puritanism, the Gunpowder Plot by terrorists to destroy parliament by means of mass murder and the witch-hunts that saw thousands of women accused of witchcraft then drowned or burned at the stake.
All warnings from history in relation to religious absolutism, the enforcement of fundamentalist religion and the use of both by sinister/deranged individuals.

If you read english language translations of all the abrahamic religious texts, I guarantee that you will find hundreds of quotes and brutal descriptions that will have you feeling absolutely nauseous.
Centuries of papal pronouncements and vatican decrees that are even worse.

Catholicism teaches papal infallibility (the pope is never wrong), that the pope is God's representation on earth and his orders must be obeyed by everyone.
There are always an unpleasant few who want to resurrect the religious fanaticism that dominated life during the ancient and medieval era.
Some within catholic congregations still openly celebrate ancient mass murders and instances of torture as "the one true religion punishing unbelievers".
My mother's family were textbook examples of this, my maternal grandmother has been doing it for the last 60 years.
Others preach an identical messages more subtly under the guise of "Christophobia" or "Generation Identity".
Their vision is practically identical to that of the evil doers of centuries ago who used religion as their weapon during the medieval era.

Do you understand now why so many of the worst dark age and medieval atrocities occurred?
It is vital it is that the history, theology and real life potential for the abuse of each are shared.
People with the knowledge must speak out to ensure that such a situation is never allowed to occur again.
Television channels like God TV & TBN UK have other plans; they have invested tens of millions into pushing a toxic religious agenda waging ideological war upon both religious multiculturalism and modern life.
The consequences for human life and society are far too serious to maintain the age old convenient silence.
Particularly in these times of widespread aggression and instability.
Last edited by londonmyst; 2 months ago
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-Quava-
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#59
(Original post by londonmyst)
(Original post by -Quava-)
Muslims are not rejecting and cherry picking.
You're a grown man and the majority of Muslim TSRians on here are young and have a lot to learn about Islam still.
You come here to argue against every young Muslim teen to make them look like they're being hypocritical or they're ignoring their own religious teaches teachings when the matter of fact is that they're so young they don't even have a lot of knowledge.

But you do you. Continue targeting young Muslims and Christians to temporarily fix this little emotional issue you have surrounding religion. If it makes you feel better, why not?

It's wonderful that you haven't been scared away from TSR by all the trolls, pervs and other creeps. :yy:
This message is a bit long, sorry.

All religious sects, leaders and individuals choose from a huge amount of scriptural quotes/teachings according to their intentions.
Over the millennia religious teachings has been used for a variety of purposes, to promote a variety of personal agendas- good, bad and evil.
Charity, education, forgiveness, redemption, love, compassion, mercy = for people who value these positive elements.
Political power, money, violence, hate, punishment, separatism and supremacy = for those who want to harness these less pleasant elements.

All elements are present within religion, reflected within both history and society- as ripe for abuse today as they were centuries ago.
Every religion under the sun- the abrahamic trio, hinduism, sikhism, scientology, mormonism, raelianism, jehovah's witnesses.
We must learn the lessons of history to avoid reliving some of the darkest events in history.
So many truly evil cults abusing religion and the faith of vulnerable members for purposes that would horrify you.

You know the powerful emotions that religion can stir up, the appeal of a united and welcoming religious community that preaches traditional righteousness as the sole path to an afterlife of eternal bliss.
You also know the history of this country.
Involvement in papal ordered violence against other religions, what Henry VIII did to end his marriage, how he used religion to torture/murder his critics, the brutal mass murders in the name of religion ordered by his daughter that earned her the nickname "Bloody Mary", Oliver Cromwell's lunatic puritanism, the Gunpowder Plot by terrorists to destroy parliament by means of mass murder and the witch-hunts that saw thousands of women accused of witchcraft then drowned or burned at the stake.
All warnings from history in relation to religious absolutism, the enforcement of fundamentalist religion and the use of both by sinister/deranged individuals.

If you read english language translations of all the abrahamic religious texts, I guarantee that you will find hundreds of quotes and brutal descriptions that will have you feeling absolutely nauseous.
Centuries of papal pronouncements and vatican decrees that are even worse.

Catholicism teaches papal infallibility (the pope is never wrong), that the pope is God's representation on earth and his orders must be obeyed by everyone.
There are always an unpleasant few who want to resurrect the religious fanaticism that dominated life during the ancient and medieval era.
Some within catholic congregations still openly celebrate ancient mass murders and instances of torture as "the one true religion punishing unbelievers".
My mother's family were textbook examples of this, my maternal grandmother has been doing it for the last 60 years.
Others preach an identical messages more subtly under the guise of "Christophobia" or "Generation Identity".
Their vision is practically identical to that of the evil doers of centuries ago who used religion as their weapon during the medieval era.

Do you understand now why so many of the worst dark age and medieval atrocities occurred?
It is vital it is that the history, theology and real life potential for the abuse of each are shared.
People with the knowledge must speak out to ensure that such a situation is never allowed to occur again.
Television channels like God TV & TBN UK have other plans; they have invested tens of millions into pushing a toxic religious agenda waging ideological war upon both religious multiculturalism and modern life.
The consequences for human life and society are far too serious to maintain the age old convenient silence.
Particularly in these times of widespread aggression and instability.
I put a post up on the thread saying I was supposed to be back temporarily for UCAS purposes but I got sidetracked.
I understand what you're saying but come one there's context behind my personal shots. A few weeks ago he was comparing these debates to a "race" so it is not even about sharing knowledge. It's literally all to make other people look hypocritical or stupid which like I said, is really sad.
I totally understand and I do agree that some sick poeple will use religion to dominate and control. Totally with that. In fact I know some personally that do.
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-Quava-
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#60
(Original post by QE2)
Many clearly do, to some extent.
I only argue with people who come on here and make claims or statements. If they don't know what they are talking about, perhaps they shouldn't come onto a religious debate forum and tell others who are better informed that they are "ignorant", "arrogant", to "educate themselves", etc.

They're literally a bunch of kids. How is a grown man taking them so seriously?

I really don't see what age has to do with it. Aisha was only 9 but y'all claim she was mentally a mature adult.
Y'all? So you're American now?
I heard she was in her late teens. Now this is a new one.
I'm also a personal believer that once you have the ability to reproduce, you're an adult. Obviously, this society and law disagrees and that's absolutely fine, I respect that.

I don't "target" anyone. I simply respond to others.
Hmmm.... respond? When did I initiate conservation with you to respond here?

When people recover from cancer, or kick drugs, or survive some avoidable trauma, of have been victims of some scam, etc, they often campaign to try and prevent others suffering in the same way.
The real question is, why wouldn't you?

Trust me I would. I'd go out and do something crazy, raise some money and contribute fininacially.... as I already do. If I can't do that, I will volunteer my time to help those in need.... as I already do.
I probably wouldn't sit and waste my entire day arguing with a bunch of children that are going to walk away and completely forget every point I made.

If someone enjoys doing something, how is doing it negatively affecting their quality of life?
People do really strange things and yes they enjoy them but unfortunately it does negatively affect the quality of their life but they're unaware.

It always makes me laugh when people who devote literally their entire life to obsessing over following the rituals of ancient Middle Eastern superstition, who worry about avoiding ordinary, everyday things, whose every waking hour is consumed by a desire to gain some celestial reward or avoid punishment, accuse others of being obsessed or having odd lives. lol!
LOOOOOOOOOL.
It is so strange how people have escaped from this so called-prison of religion to be free and then spend every waking hour obsessing over it and being consumed by a desire to to gain some self-satisfaction of putting religious people down and then having the audacity to say religious people have odd lives.
LMAO man, come on, MOVE ON!
*sigh*
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