How can we stop terror when people fight against strategies such as Prevent?

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Iridocyclitis
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Organisations like the NUS and others actively oppose Prevent, for example. The Lib Dems watered-down control orders when they were in government.

How can we possibly prevent radicalisation and terrorism if so many are actively trying to obstruct this?
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ByEeek
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Because it is not the job of teachers and other educationalists to spy on their pupils. That is the job of the security services.... unless we want to live a former East Germany like state where everyone was terrified to say anything because there were so many secret informers and spies.
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Iridocyclitis
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Because it is not the job of teachers and other educationalists to spy on their pupils. That is the job of the security services.... unless we want to live a former East Germany like state where everyone was terrified to say anything because there were so many secret informers and spies.
Teachers and other educationalists already "spy" on pupils - they will report any concerns about mental health, for example. So if a teacher can report a pupil who appears mentally ill so they can receive help, why can't a teacher report a pupil who is exhibiting signs of radicalisation so they can receive help?
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MildredMalone
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(Original post by Iridocyclitis)
Teachers and other educationalists already "spy" on pupils - they will report any concerns about mental health, for example. So if a teacher can report a pupil who appears mentally ill so they can receive help, why can't a teacher report a pupil who is exhibiting signs of radicalisation so they can receive help?
Because it's waycist, duh,
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bex.anne
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Because essentially it's just a policy where it makes teachers report students if they think they are being radicalised, as young as 11 years old? A student can be doing as much as deciding to put a hijab on and a teacher will report them, and that student and their family will then have to undergo surveillance and have their houses and personal belongings searched just based on the personal inklings of a teacher.
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Meany Pie
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(Original post by bex.anne)
A student can be doing as much as deciding to put a hijab on and a teacher will report them, and that student and their family will then have to undergo surveillance and have their houses and personal belongings searched just based on the personal inklings of a teacher.
Has that actually happened?
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Iridocyclitis
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(Original post by bex.anne)
A student can be doing as much as deciding to put a hijab on and a teacher will report them, and that student and their family will then have to undergo surveillance and have their houses and personal belongings searched just based on the personal inklings of a teacher.
Source?
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bex.anne
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(Original post by Meany Pie)
Has that actually happened?
(Original post by Iridocyclitis)
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Happened to someone I know. They decided to come in with a hijab one day, start praying and teachers believed they were being radicalised.

They then reported her to prevent and she and her family were investigated for a long time. Nothing came of it of course because it was just a girl who was following her religion.
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Meany Pie
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(Original post by bex.anne)
Happened to someone I know. They decided to come in with a hijab one day, start praying in school and teachers believed they were being radicalised.
I can see why if they went from normal teenager to devout muslim in a short amount of time.
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bex.anne
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(Original post by Meany Pie)
I can see why if they went from normal teenager to devout muslim in a short amount of time.
So it's not normal if you put a hijab on? Freedom of religion is a thing in this country.
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Meany Pie
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(Original post by bex.anne)
So it's not normal if you put a hijab on? Freedom of religion is a thing in this country.
Its not normal to go from not wearing one to doing so and praying all the time.

Is anyone stopping her practicing her religion? No? Don't know why you felt the need to say that.
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Arran90
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Because Prevent is a disastrous policy based on a discredited ideology of a conveyor belt theory.

Public sector workers with a poor knowledge of Islam and the complex geopolitical situation in the Middle East are now required to spy on people, including children in nursery class, for so called signs of radicalisation after receiving a minimalist amount of training.

A kid in primary school was reported by a teacher for writing "I live in a terrorist house" rather than "I live in a terraced house". It really is that daft.
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bex.anne
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(Original post by Meany Pie)
Its not normal to go from not wearing one to doing so and praying all the time.

Is anyone stopping her practicing her religion? No? Don't know why you felt the need to say that.
Just think about what you are saying for a minute.

How do you think wearing a hijab works? You go from not wearing one, to wearing one.

It's not a transition, you dont not wear one, then wear half of one, then wear a whole one. This girl literally wore a headscarf one day because she wanted too and the teachers decided that it was an issue.

And she wasn't praying all the time, once a week or so she would go to the multi faith room for the friday prayer. They reported her because she used to have her hair out then decided to cover her hair. It's clearly unfair.

If you're 16 years old and you decide to wear a peice of material on your head, you should be able to do so without someone thinking you're radicalised.
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Meany Pie
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(Original post by bex.anne)
Just think about what you are saying for a minute.

How do you think wearing a hijab works? You go from not wearing one, to wearing one.

It's not a transition, you dont not wear one, then wear half of one, then wear a whole one. This girl literally wore a headscarf one day because she wanted too and the teachers decided that it was an issue.

And she wasn't praying all the time, once a week or so she would go to the multi faith room for the friday prayer. They reported her because she used to have her hair out then decided to cover her hair. It's clearly unfair.

If you're 16 years old and you decide to wear a peice of material on your head, you should be able to do so without someone thinking you're radicalised.
Better safe than sorry.
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QE2
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(Original post by bex.anne)
Happened to someone I know. They decided to come in with a hijab one day, start praying and teachers believed they were being radicalised.

They then reported her to prevent and she and her family were investigated for a long time. Nothing came of it of course because it was just a girl who was following her religion.
Not an unreasonable course of action.
A bit like if a pupil develops red spots and starts scratching. You would suggest they stay at home and have it checked to ensure that it wasn't a contagious disease. If it turns out to be a touch of acne, no biggie. If it turns out to be smallpox, you may have saved many lives.
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QE2
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(Original post by Arran90)
A kid in primary school was reported by a teacher for writing "I live in a terrorist house" rather than "I live in a terraced house". It really is that daft.
No he wasn't. The child in question was reported to child services because in his essay, he also wrote 'I hate it when my uncle beats me'. Authorities stated that they assumed the "terrorist house" was a spelling mistake and was not the reason for the investigation.

Just because a child is "Muslim" doesn't mean that they are not subject to the same child protection protocols as other children.
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sek510i
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Having seen friends highlighted by Prevent, I'm pretty sure that it's just wasting time and money at this point.

One person I know was referred for calling himself a socialist in a history debate, to cite just one anecdotal example. Also, even if it did somehow one day spot somebody who held radical views, that doesn't mean that they're going to stop holding those views. Many people are already on security services' watch lists, but it doesn't stop them radicalising others or carrying out attacks.

Even if, one day, prevent were to actually find somebody, I still don't think it would help. What would help is more police with better training, dealing with local communities, who can actually act on the reports they get of both religious fundamentalists and the islamophobia that helps to motivate them.

In the Manchester bombing, for example, the bomber was already on a watch list because he had been reported to the police by his family. It didn't stop him, so why would less reliable reports from teachers help? Just a waste of money that could be better spent elsewhere.
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