BBC Leaders Special: Corbyn v May - The Final Verdict

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Poll: BBC Question Time Special - who won?
Theresa May (25)
25.51%
Jeremy Corbyn (73)
74.49%
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Movementmoments
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#81
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#81
(Original post by Lanterne Rouge)
It doesn't. Which is what I just said. The extra funding tuition fees provide means that each uni can offer more spaces, better bursaries for the poor, and higher quality facilities/tuition during the course.
I'm sorry if this just me being grossly misinformed but won't the same level of funding be going to universities? Does Free tutition not mean the government pay 9.25k to the uni per student instead of us, the students, paying? So the same amount of tutition fees are payed just without the burden of debt on the students?
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TSLW
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#82
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#82
I'm watching this debate now (I had it paused for a while).
You can see Corbyn crumbling throughout the programme. He's getting agitated by the studio audience's questions, and refused to answer a question - unacceptable.
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Movementmoments
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#83
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#83
(Original post by JMR2017)
Are you this guy?
Attachment 656674
Guys that look like this have a 2008/2008 chance of knowing nothing about economics
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interact
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#84
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#84
(Original post by JMR2017)
Are you this guy?
Attachment 656674
Lol no, but i dunno what his problem is. Youre wanting to be prime minister just bloody say ye. he could have done so much better.
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Captain Haddock
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#85
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#85
Those ****ing trident questions. "At the end of TV shows they tell you to push the red button, so what I want to know is: would you initiate a nuclear holocaust?"
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Lanterne Rouge
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#86
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#86
(Original post by Movementmoments)
I'm sorry if this just me being grossly misinformed but won't the same level of funding be going to universities? Does Free tutition not mean the government pay 9.25k to the uni per student instead of us, the students, paying? So the same amount of tutition fees are payed just without the burden of debt on the students?
Yes. That is entirely true. But Corbyn's justification for scrapping it is that it holds poor students back. That is simply wrong. And by scrapping tuition fees, he has to unnecesarily raise taxes on businesses that provide jobs, incomes, and services to our economy in order to fund the unis to the same level. It is idiocy.
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TSLW
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#87
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#87
(Original post by JMR2017)
Audience: How dare you not condemn the IRA killers!
Audience: How dare you not be prepared to kill millions of people!
There's a vast difference between the two.
If a nuclear missile was being fired at our country, there is very little to stop it. Our country, and its citizens, are doomed. Would you not want the country responsible for firing those missiles at us to be held accountable? Eye for an eye, and all that...

The IRA are a terrorist group that are just as bad as ISIS, in my opinion. Why can he not condemn them? They frequently attacked British citizens on British soil.
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JMR2020.
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#88
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#88
(Original post by captain haddock)
those ****ing trident questions. "at the end of tv shows they tell you to push the red button, so what i want to know is: Would you initiate a nuclear holocaust?"
breaking news: Question time audience get their hands on the nuclear codes

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Lanterne Rouge
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#89
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#89
(Original post by JMR2017)
Audience: How dare you not condemn the IRA killers!
Audience: How dare you not be prepared to kill millions of people!
:congrats:
If you can't see the difference between condemning a terrorist group and being prepared to use a nuclear deterrent when threatened, then you are a complete moron.
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JMR2020.
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#90
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#90
(Original post by TSLW)
There's a vast difference between the two.
If a nuclear missile was being fired at our country, there is very little to stop it. Our country, and its citizens, are doomed. Would you not want the country responsible for firing those missiles at us to be held accountable? Eye for an eye, and all that...

The IRA are a terrorist group that are just as bad as ISIS, in my opinion. Why can he not condemn them? They frequently attacked British citizens on British soil.
If there is a 'nuclear missile fired at our country' then the idea of 'deterrence' has already failed.
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TSLW
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#91
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#91
(Original post by JMR2017)
If there is a 'nuclear missile fired at our country' then the idea of 'deterrence' has already failed.
Yes, obviously, the deterrence has failed. But we should hold the enemy government accountable for killing our citizens. And if that means doing what they did to us, so be it.
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A Slice of Pi
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#92
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#92
(Original post by Saunders16)
I've seen him avoid questions before, quite obviously because his personal opinion differs to the party message, and it's confusing to me. He could very easily state that, as Trident will be kept under the policies he is defending, all possible options are open to him. It really hurt his performance tonight and thanks to May's better performance, it could really hurt him in the polls. Again, he lacks leadership qualities when, as you stated, he refuses to rule out not getting a deal with the European Union. I agree that it would be catastrophic for the country, but '"no deal is better thatn a bad deal" is clearly a popular line for May - why not counter her by agreeing and convincing Brexit voters of your dedication?

tl;dr: Corbyn's actions in this election are just as baffling as May's.
I agree with all of that. It was the "no deal is worst" comment yesterday that took me aback. Not a very smart negotiating strategy that seriously throws into question whether he is to be trusted. The current confusing campaign is rather reminiscent of the remain campaign a year ago. May campaigned for remain (but was not as vocal as some of the other campaigners) and has since U-turned, but Corbyn's view was itself rather confused, with some debating whether he was actually a eurosceptic.
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JMR2020.
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#93
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#93
(Original post by TSLW)
Yes, obviously, the deterrence has failed. But we should hold the enemy government accountable for killing our citizens. And if that means doing what they did to us, so be it.
It's a lose-lose situation at that point, what's worse, not holding them to account or jeopardising the future of Planet Earth by retaliating?
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JMR2020.
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#94
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#94
Rep if you agree!
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TSLW
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#95
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#95
(Original post by JMR2017)
It's a lose-lose situation at that point, what's worse, not holding them to account or jeopardising the future of Planet Earth by retaliating?
Personal opinion - mine is to retaliate. Yours is, I presume, not holding them to account.
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Exceptional
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#96
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#96
(Original post by TSLW)
Yes, obviously, the deterrence has failed. But we should hold the enemy government accountable for killing our citizens. And if that means doing what they did to us, so be it.
Well, if a nuclear warhead targeted Britain, allies like America who are less sensitive to violence at that scale would attack the initiator. Our enemies would be neutralised before Corbyn stopped dithering about whether to retaliate in the first place, if he hadn't died with millions of other Brits in the process.

Also, if nuclear weapons were used against us successfully, it's the result of a small minority of extremists. Does that warrant killing millions of innocent people in response? Contentious, I know.

190+ countries don't use nuclear weapons. We don't need them either.
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A Slice of Pi
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#97
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#97
(Original post by Reality Check)
Exactly. Also, the disinclination of him to outrightly condemn IRA terrorism was a big problem for me and I suspect many others.
His answers were very odd regarding that. I think an audience member asked if he views the IRA as terrorists (something along those lines) and he wouldn't give a direct answer. Surely, if he wanted to end any speculation, his answer would be more direct.
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JMR2020.
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#98
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#98
(Original post by TSLW)
Personal opinion - mine is to retaliate. Yours is, I presume, not holding them to account.
Yeah but I don't understand your logic. How will us all being dead with a burnt Earth to live with be better than trying to negotiate peacefully?
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Reality Check
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#99
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#99
(Original post by A Slice of Pi)
His answers were very odd regarding that. I think an audience member asked if he views the IRA as terrorists (something along those lines) and he wouldn't give a direct answer. Surely, if he wanted to end any speculation, his answer would be more direct.
You'd think so, wouldn't you? He was given the opportunity to close this whole 'does he or does he not condemn the IRA' debate and he yet again refused to take it.
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JMR2020.
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#100
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