I think postal votes should be banned Watch

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FallenEyelash
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#1
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I think postal votes should be more restricted or banned because:
~ They are open to electoral fraud
~ They take away the debating aspect of the election and don't give parties enough time to campaign
~ Members of the same household can easily 'steal' each-other's votes

In Northern Ireland voters have to give a sufficient reason why they cannot vote at a polling station and there are lower levels of electoral fraud in Northern Ireland (what a surprise).

Why can't we have a similar system to that in Northern Ireland across the UK?
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L i b
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I think the extent of postal vote use does disrupt how elections are run. Campaigns are set to take account of the whole length of the election period. If I had a postal vote, I'd be sending it off now when only a minority of the candidates in my constituency have been able to get literature through my door (not their fault, incidentally, but the Royal Mail's fault).
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ByEeek
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If that is the case let's reform the whole thing. Why can't we vote online, or by text? If I vote in my polling station I simply give my name and address. No ID is required. It amazes me there is so little fraud. I don't think temoval of potal votes will make much difference.
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Unown Uzer
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Postal votes are a source of electoral fraud
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27121991
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(Original post by ByEeek)
If that is the case let's reform the whole thing. Why can't we vote online, or by text? If I vote in my polling station I simply give my name and address. No ID is required. It amazes me there is so little fraud. I don't think temoval of potal votes will make much difference.
I totally agree with you. I have a postal vote. Wouldn't be able to go and vote otherwise. With a postal vote you have to sign etc.. I know you could say some people could forge signatures etc. But they match it to the signature you signed up with. It really gets scrutinised and if there's any doubt they disregard it.

In terms of election campaign period. You don't have to send a postal vote there and then, when you get it. I think the deadline is something like two days before. And if you're still undecided you can take it to a polling station on the day and vote there.
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Guy of Gisbourne
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Postal votes are needed by people who are unable to vote on polling day. Without them the number of people voting at elections will decrease.
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SaucissonSecCy
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I agree.
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mojojojo101
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(Original post by Guy of Gisbourne)
Postal votes are needed by people who are unable to vote on polling day. Without them the number of people voting at elections will decrease.
Depending on your perspective you may not consider that a bad thing.
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barnetlad
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I would like there to be online voting, if it can be done in a secure way and without fraud.

Alternatively, why could it not be the case that if you are away in the UK you can go to the local polling station and cast your vote there? Postal votes would then only be for those abroad on polling day, who will have a flight booking or ferry crossing or Eurostar/Eurotunnel ticket as evidence of whom they are.
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artful_lounger
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So I guess you think disabled people just shouldn't be able to vote huh? This is what's called abled privilege. You can get around easily and so the concept of not being able to actually physically go somewhere hasn't even occurred to you, even though this is the daily reality for thousands of people across the UK.

Not to mention, some people's working hours mean they can't go to the polls on the day of the vote. Additionally, their employers are not obligated to honour any time off requests to go vote. This doesn't even being to account for those people who have caring and family commitments or otherwise that would make it extremely difficult to go vote on the day (do you want to listen to a screaming baby because it's being held up uncomfortably in a queue for hours on a hot day, rather than comfortably in it's crib at home?).

I mean honestly this whole thing reeks of "It's a banana, how much could it cost? Ten dollars?" level of privileged thinking. Your experiences are not universal, nor are they even a good representation of the average Briton's life if these things aren't considerations for you.
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FallenEyelash
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(Original post by artful_lounger)
So I guess you think disabled people just shouldn't be able to vote huh? This is what's called abled privilege. You can get around easily and so the concept of not being able to actually physically go somewhere hasn't even occurred to you, even though this is the daily reality for thousands of people across the UK.

Not to mention, some people's working hours mean they can't go to the polls on the day of the vote. Additionally, their employers are not obligated to honour any time off requests to go vote. This doesn't even being to account for those people who have caring and family commitments or otherwise that would make it extremely difficult to go vote on the day (do you want to listen to a screaming baby because it's being held up uncomfortably in a queue for hours on a hot day, rather than comfortably in it's crib at home?).

I mean honestly this whole thing reeks of "It's a banana, how much could it cost? Ten dollars?" level of privileged thinking. Your experiences are not universal, nor are they even a good representation of the average Briton's life if these things aren't considerations for you.
Read my post, I said if they're able... The Northern Ireland system allows you to vote by post if your disabled or due to other commitments. Read this link before you start going off on one: http://www.eoni.org.uk/vote/voting-by-post-or-proxy
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artful_lounger
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(Original post by FallenEyelash)
Read my post, I said if they're able... The Northern Ireland system allows you to vote by post if your disabled or due to other commitments. Read this link before you start going off on one: http://www.eoni.org.uk/vote/voting-by-post-or-proxy
While it's nice that you've conveniently ignored the rest of my post to attempt to straw man my argument into a single issue refutal,

a) the problem with this is disabled people don't want tools to allow them to act the same as their otherwise abled counterparts to be a "thing". It is in itself discriminatory to e.g., have a disabled access, but that access to lead through the kitchens, or to have a disabled space on a bus, but require a five minute process where the bus driver has to manually lower a ramp then have it raised then put it away just for that passenger, when instead they could just design the main access to allow wheelchair entry, or to have an automatically descending ramp for all passengers to disembark on.

b) as noted this extends far beyond disabled individuals and fails to take into account the huge variance in individuals circumstances, and rather than arbitrarily forming more and more highly specific requirements on how and when people can vote which in itself leads to voter fraud through disenfranchisement, it suffices to create a system where there are different options available to all people who have the freedom to choose the one which is most appropriate to their circumstance.
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Guy of Gisbourne
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(Original post by barnetlad)
I would like there to be online voting, if it can be done in a secure way and without fraud.

Alternatively, why could it not be the case that if you are away in the UK you can go to the local polling station and cast your vote there? Postal votes would then only be for those abroad on polling day, who will have a flight booking or ferry crossing or Eurostar/Eurotunnel ticket as evidence of whom they are.
Online voting is a bad idea, the computer systems could be hacked and the outcome of the election decided by those with malicious intent.
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viffer
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(Original post by 27121991)
I totally agree with you. I have a postal vote. Wouldn't be able to go and vote otherwise. With a postal vote you have to sign etc.. I know you could say some people could forge signatures etc. But they match it to the signature you signed up with. It really gets scrutinised and if there's any doubt they disregard it.

In terms of election campaign period. You don't have to send a postal vote there and then, when you get it. I think the deadline is something like two days before. And if you're still undecided you can take it to a polling station on the day and vote there.
100% correct ref the two bits in bold

I have just spent several sessions at my local Council opening postal votes. It is quite sophisticated software that compares the signatures and DOBs. We 'rejected' several for further scrutiny/validation by the Electoral Services Team.

There is of course as much chance of the original application being hijacked to enable a fraudulent vote as there is of an impersonator turning up in the Polling Station.

You can indeed hand in postal votes to the Polling Station but it has to be the postal vote ballot paper you were sent. You can't get an alternative 'in person' ballot paper.
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viffer
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(Original post by Guy of Gisbourne)
Online voting is a bad idea, the computer systems could be hacked and the outcome of the election decided by those with malicious intent.
I would be very much against online voting
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Empirical
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(Original post by FallenEyelash)
I think postal votes should be more restricted or banned because:
~ They are open to electoral fraud
~ They take away the debating aspect of the election and don't give parties enough time to campaign
~ Members of the same household can easily 'steal' each-other's votes

In Northern Ireland voters have to give a sufficient reason why they cannot vote at a polling station and there are lower levels of electoral fraud in Northern Ireland (what a surprise).

Why can't we have a similar system to that in Northern Ireland across the UK?
Well sorry but I work away from home and it's the only way I can vote.


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MildredMalone
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(Original post by viffer)
There is of course as much chance of the original application being hijacked to enable a fraudulent vote as there is of an impersonator turning up in the Polling Station.
What would happen in such a situation? If I showed up to a polling station where a friend of the same gender and a similar age should vote but I knew wasn't, but the polling officers knew the person so knew I was lying, what would they actually do?
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ThomH97
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It is a security risk, so unless someone has a real reason why they can't get there on the day, they should actually bother to spend the 10 minutes it takes to vote in person.
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Sheena1234izatio
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(Original post by FallenEyelash)
I think postal votes should be more restricted or banned because:
~ They are open to electoral fraud
~ They take away the debating aspect of the election and don't give parties enough time to campaign
~ Members of the same household can easily 'steal' each-other's votes

In Northern Ireland voters have to give a sufficient reason why they cannot vote at a polling station and there are lower levels of electoral fraud in Northern Ireland (what a surprise).

Why can't we have a similar system to that in Northern Ireland across the UK?
Definitely agree. BAN THEM
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