If you dislike Jeremy Corbyn, why? Watch

abbie559
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I'm curious. I'll answer anyone's questions ))
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George32
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(Original post by abbie559)
I'm curious. I'll answer anyone's questions ))
Ngl it's pretty hard for me to dislike Corbyn; even as a Tory.

Politics aside, I like his 'what you see is what you get' kind of vibe. Like if you put the average man from the public into parliament: he'd truly represent the working people. To me he's principled and honest and I fully respect that.

My issue with Corbyn is more ideological than personal. IMO his policies are short-sighted - he puts idealism over pragmatism, and just offers false hope.

My examples? - scrapping tuition fees, nationalising the water industry, the guaranteed "1. Full Employment" - http://www.labour.org.uk/index.php/10 -pledges. I don't understand how a party guarantees "a decent job for all"?
Plus, Corbyn seems to only consider wealth distribution and not creation;
excessive social spending will destabilise an economy. He's just populist.

Even as a young, working class, state educated minority whose parents didn't go to uni; first to go to uni, lower income background, Labour household etc. I just can't buy into his economic policies. They punish success and aspiration.

I also associate modern leftist populist political movements against the Workers' Party of Korea, the United Socialist Party of Venezuela, the Communist Party of Cuba etc. where private freedoms are limited and economic turmoil amounts. I know Corbyn's not a communist; but his more left of Labour allies concern me.

I think people latch onto the 'man of the people' idea about Corbyn. Seeing right-wing press constantly attack him puts him as an underdog; seeing his rallies, chants, growing support from young people etc. He brought many people into politics which is a good thing; and his movement's appealing.

There are many things wrong with the Tory govt atm. I can't blame anyone for wanting change; a tiny part of me even wanted May to lose this GE. Labour's campaign was pretty well done this year. If Liz Kendall or Dan Jarvis were in charge, I would've joined the party; and year props to Corbyn, it's due. I just think he's personality over policy which won't benefit anyone in the long-run.

Labour's policies on protecting women and girls who are victims of violence, tackling racial and faith-based discrimination, promoting disability and LGBT equality are however gold to me. All parties should prioritise these policies. Even though the Tories passed the Same Sex Act in 2013, more should be done here and in other areas. I just wish Corbyn moved to the centre tbh.

+ I didn't mean for my post to be this long haha. I got carried away; I don't usually get to talk politics with many people atm so TSR's a good platform.
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Dragolien
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(Original post by George32)
Ngl it's pretty hard for me to dislike Corbyn; even as a Tory.

Politics aside, I like his 'what you see is what you get' kind of vibe. Like if you put the average man from the public into parliament: he'd truly represent the working people. To me he's principled and honest and I fully respect that.

My issue with Corbyn is more ideological than personal. IMO his policies are short-sighted - he puts idealism over pragmatism, and just offers false hope.

My examples? - scrapping tuition fees, nationalising the water industry, the guaranteed "1. Full Employment" - http://www.labour.org.uk/index.php/10 -pledges. I don't understand how a party guarantees "a decent job for all"?
Plus, Corbyn seems to only consider wealth distribution and not creation;
excessive social spending will destabilise an economy. He's just populist.

Even as a young, working class, state educated minority whose parents didn't go to uni; first to go to uni, lower income background, Labour household etc. I just can't buy into his economic policies. They punish success and aspiration.

I also associate modern leftist populist political movements against the Workers' Party of Korea, the United Socialist Party of Venezuela, the Communist Party of Cuba etc. where private freedoms are limited and economic turmoil amounts. I know Corbyn's not a communist; but his more left of Labour allies concern me.

I think people latch onto the 'man of the people' idea about Corbyn. Seeing right-wing press constantly attack him puts him as an underdog; seeing his rallies, chants, growing support from young people etc. He brought many people into politics which is a good thing; and his movement's appealing.

There are many things wrong with the Tory govt atm. I can't blame anyone for wanting change; a tiny part of me even wanted May to lose this GE. Labour's campaign was pretty well done this year. If Liz Kendall or Dan Jarvis were in charge, I would've joined the party; and year props to Corbyn, it's due. I just think he's personality over policy which won't benefit anyone in the long-run.

Labour's policies on protecting women and girls who are victims of violence, tackling racial and faith-based discrimination, promoting disability and LGBT equality are however gold to me. All parties should prioritise these policies. Even though the Tories passed the Same Sex Act in 2013, more should be done here and in other areas. I just wish Corbyn moved to the centre tbh.

+ I didn't mean for my post to be this long haha. I got carried away; I don't usually get to talk politics with many people atm so TSR's a good platform.
I can see why you'd think his policies were lowering the value of aspiration. But I'd probably say that any reduction in the cost of university would probably help more people to achieve more. I simplify this greatly, but generally the less debt for the working class, the higher their chances.
The intended result of trying to cap pay is to reduce the ridiculous wages and bonuses that many heads of top companies undeservedly get. Even if a CEO resides over an absolutely terrible period where they might have been bailed out, their pay will not reflect that. And by capping wages based on the pay of the lowest paid worker, it encourages pay rises throughout the company rather than at the top.

I agree with your worries about some of Corbyn's allies; I'm not sure about McDonnell. I notice that you advocate Liz Kendall for the Labour leadership; is this because of or despite her "Blairite" status?
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Captain Poldark
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I don't dislike him personally I just don't agree with his left wing views.
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George32
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(Original post by Dragolien)
I can see why you'd think his policies were lowering the value of aspiration. But I'd probably say that any reduction in the cost of university would probably help more people to achieve more. I simplify this greatly, but generally the less debt for the working class, the higher their chances.
The intended result of trying to cap pay is to reduce the ridiculous wages and bonuses that many heads of top companies undeservedly get. Even if a CEO resides over an absolutely terrible period where they might have been bailed out, their pay will not reflect that. And by capping wages based on the pay of the lowest paid worker, it encourages pay rises throughout the company rather than at the top.

I agree with your worries about some of Corbyn's allies; I'm not sure about McDonnell. I notice that you advocate Liz Kendall for the Labour leadership; is this because of or despite her "Blairite" status?
Despite her Blairite status. I liked her the most during Labour's election; she was the most grounded candidate IMO, even over Burnham. Though I'd be lying if I said her more-centrist stance wasn't an appeal.

I found a BBC article - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33652204 - from ages ago when she was asked if she'd oppose the Tories' benefit cap, to which she replied...

"As leader I won't oppose anything unless we show how we can pay for the alternative. That is it, full stop. That would be a general rule under my leadership."

-- applied more generally, I think those on the left of Labour could learn a lesson or two.
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Lanterne Rouge
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1. He lies repeatedly. I know that is true of most politicians, but Labour's entire campaign was built around lies in nearly every aspect. Some often repeated ones:
– the manifesto is fully costed
– the Tories take from the poor and give to the rich
– Income inequality is rising
– Tuition fees have stopped poor people going to uni
– Corbyn helped to negotiate with the IRA
– Selling bonds isn’t borrowing
– food poverty has increased
– renationalisation of industry/services won’t cost anything
– reducing corporation tax will cost us money

2. His economic policies would bankrupt the country. They are grounded in fantasy rather than logic. They punish success and aspiration (politics of envy), target the businesses that provide us with jobs, incomes, and products, whilst heavily increasing borrowing levels. I expect large rises in inflation and unemployment, whilst the debt skyrockets and investment declines. Lets not forget the influence of the trade unuons either, who hold the country to ransom if given the chance.

3. He's consistently supported terrorist groups. The IRA in particular. Whilst many of the Corbyn personality cultists argue that he was integral in securing peace, he did nothing of the sort. He was nowhere near the peace negotiations, and attended memorials for IRA bombers whilst clearly supporting their cause. Look up the 1985 Anglo-Irish Agreement. A primary step towards peace, that Corbyn actually voted down because the IRA were against it.

4. Other parts of his defence/security policies are inherently flawed. Trident is the biggest example, although I would also cite his "shoot-to-kill" views. On Trident, he has decided to keep the weapons system, yet has refused to use them if we're in imminent danger. However unlikely the threat is, there really is no point in having a nuclear deterrent if you refuse to use it. It ceases to become a deterrent, as you aren't deterring anything. It is simply stupidity.

5. His actions at Grenfell this week have lowered my opinion of him far more than before. Encouraging strikes and civil disorder, whilst advocating the requisitioning of private property from the rich. Disgusting politics, using a tragedy for his political aims.

6. His shadow cabinet. I don't think you could find a more repulsive group of politicians than Abbott (the racist joke), Thornberry (hater of the working class and the England flag), and McDonnell (full-blown communist - far more extreme than Corbyn).

7. His lack of competence for this job. He's never held any ministerial position, he got 2 E's at school, he has never held a proper job in his life, 80% of his party have no confidence in him, and he seems deluded at many parts of the political process. I still don't understand how/why he thought he could form a government after the election, despite being about 65 seats short of a majority, with no prospect of a coalition large enough to gain power.

8. His fans on social media. This is far from everyone, because many of my close friends voted for him and I don't hold anything against them, but the amount of vicious, nasty, hateful comment against anyone to the right on social media have been hugely frustrating me these last few months. We may not agree about how to run the country, but no need to get spiteful against people who vote the other way (43% of the popn no less). I know this isn't his fault, but I associate it with him.
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jelly1000
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I absolutely loath the man. Some of my reasons have already been covered by Lanterne Rouge, in particular supporting of terrorist groups, his shadow cabinet and fans of social media. My points to add would be:

1.Clear failure to properly investigate anti antisemitism in the Labour Party. As someone who is Jewish this was very disappointing.
2. And addition to Lantern Rouge point 3 re supporting terrorists: Calling Hamas his friends. Hamas not only want to wipe Israel off the face of the earth, spend money on ammunition instead of food for Gazans e.c.t but have it in their charter to kill all Jews.
3. Working for Press TV. For those who haven't heard of it, it is Iranian state TV, with their wonderful human rights record including stoning for adultery.
4. Association with the Palestinian Solidarity Campaign. Being Jewish whilst I don't agree with all the actions of the Israeli government the right of Israel to exist in peace (alongside a Palestinian state of course) is fundamental for me, and organisations like the PSC which are trying to delegitimise Israel whilst ignoring the wider picture are a disgrace in my books.
5. Shortly after Jo Cox murder he addressed a baying crowd of supporters some of whom had called for 'death to MP's' and he did nothing to condemn that language.
6. Again shortly after Jo Cox murder a number of female Labour MP's complained Corbyn was doing nothing to address their safety concerns.
7. Basically let Momentum take over in some areas with all this talk of deselecting MP's and calling them traitors. At the end of the day as leader he should be backing all his MP's loud and clear whether they voted for him or not.
8. Now he's acting like he's won this campaign when Labour still lost.

I also disagree with many of his policies but wouldn't consider that a reason to dislike him personally.
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limetang
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If you'd asked me this question before the election I'd have told you that I didn't really dislike him, that I may have disagreed with how feasible some of his policies were and that I disliked how cozy he has historically been to terrorist groups (Hamas, the IRA etc.).

Now though I'm afraid my answer is quite different. Since the election he has shown himself to be a power hungry demagogue with contempt for democracy. Labour won 262 seats vs the Conservatives 317 (and a smaller portion of the popular vote) and with no feasible way of cobbling together enough seats in a coalition that would surpass the 317 seats the conservatives had, let alone getting enough seats to make an overall majority, he had made it clear that he thought himself the true victor of this election and that he should be prime minister.

Not even mentioning his blatant attempt to use the death of at least 58 people in the Grenfell tower disaster to score political points. The man is sickening in his lust for power.
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username878267
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(Original post by limetang)

Not even mentioning his blatant attempt to use the death of at least 58 people in the Grenfell tower disaster to score political points. The man is sickening in his lust for power.
If you aren't willing to look into the reasons why this incident happened and all teh decisions that led to it happening, then you are being unhelpful.

The residents themselves are blaming the government and the council. Why won't you listen to the victims of this incident?
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limetang
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(Original post by Bornblue)
If you aren't willing to look into the reasons why this incident happened and all teh decisions that led to it happening, then you are being unhelpful.

The residents themselves are blaming the government and the council. Why won't you listen to the victims of this incident?
I am very willing for a full, proper and impartial inquiry to be taken out which properly assigns blame to those who are responsible. I don't think it's unhelpful that I'm unwilling to quickly jump on the band wagon which places all blame at the feet of Theresa May in favour of actually taking our time to objectively figure out what went wrong

Further, (and I'm sorry if this sounds indelicate) the residents who genuinely have my extreme sympathy, are not a reliable authority by themselves for assigning blame. They have just suffered a major trauma and are very understandably traumatised and angry and very understandably are looking for someone to place blame on.They're not at the top of my list for people who I'd go to for an objective assessment of the situation.

Now back to what I said. Jeremy Corbyn has shown himself to be very willing to rile people up around this before there has been any time to properly conduct an investigation for his own political gain, to try and remove a sitting government so that he can take their place. We should rightly want to figure out who and what is responsible for this, if anything else so we can learn from it and ensure it never happens again. I can be for that whilst being very much against the way Corbyn is using this situation.
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username878267
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(Original post by limetang)
I am very willing for a full, proper and impartial inquiry to be taken out which properly assigns blame to those who are responsible. I don't think it's unhelpful that I'm unwilling to quickly jump on the band wagon which places all blame at the feet of Theresa May in favour of actually taking our time to objectively figure out what went wrong

Further, (and I'm sorry if this sounds indelicate) the residents who genuinely have my extreme sympathy, are not a reliable authority by themselves for assigning blame. They have just suffered a major trauma and are very understandably traumatised and angry and very understandably are looking for someone to place blame on.They're not at the top of my list for people who I'd go to for an objective assessment of the situation.

Now back to what I said. Jeremy Corbyn has shown himself to be very willing to rile people up around this before there has been any time to properly conduct an investigation for his own political gain, to try and remove a sitting government so that he can take their place. We should rightly want to figure out who and what is responsible for this, if anything else so we can learn from it and ensure it never happens again. I can be for that whilst being very much against the way Corbyn is using this situation.
He isn't 'using' the situation. He is asking for answers and demanding support for all those affected.

By the looks of it, ministers and the council made big errors and they should be held accountable for those errors.
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Nswfree
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What do you think to Corbyn saying
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Nswfree
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(Original post by abbie559)
I'm curious. I'll answer anyone's questions ))
Do you think Corbyn is a leader? T B H he doesn't seem to make any decisions
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Nswfree
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(Original post by abbie559)
I'm curious. I'll answer anyone's questions ))
Does Corbyn actually make any decisions?
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