Why does the British middle class lack charisma?

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tabmax22
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Why does the British upper/middle class lack charisma?

This is something I've noticed a lot. Why is that the posh type of people in UK lack charisma? A lot of them seem very reserved and unwilling to have a conversation. When they do talk, their voice is very light and quiet and they lack basic skills such as eye contact or smiling etc etc.

When I think of someone charismatic, I think of people like Dwayne Johnson, Barack Obama, Russell Brand etc who have a charm about them. They'll usually be quite boisterous and can have a laugh at almost anything. Of course I don't expect everyone to be as charismatic as them, but at least you should have some basic levels of charisma about you. I've noticed that generally British people from working class backgrounds are much more charismatic and open to a conversation compared to the British upper/middle class. They're so much calmer and casual, and often have a great sense of humour.

My main experience is just from day to day life, meeting new people through university etc. I've noticed the 'popular' ones are all from working class backgrounds, and they're well liked simply because they're quite confident and boisterous.

My second experience is from working as a cashier for two years at a supermarket. It's always the working class ones that are open to a conversation, willing to have a bit of banter. Now that could possibly be because working class customers can relate to us cashiers more, since they're from similar backgrounds themselves and have probably worked a similar job at some point in their life. Whereas the more middle class customers don't know what to really talk to us about or how to hold a conversation with ordinary working class people. I don't know. I'm just speculating. What are your thoughts? I just find that they'll often try to avoid a conversation. Now, I know not every customer wants to talk and I don't know what each customer's story is. But I've served literally thousands of customers, so I've got a general gist of what middle class customers are like and what working class customers are like.

Even when I think of our PM, Theresa May. As a leader, god she's awful. She just seems like she has no clue how to connect with ordinary people. Her banter seems rubbish. Compare that to Obama when he was the president. So bloody smooth and suave. Surely at least a world leader should be charismatic.
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Tubbz
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I'd guess because the upper/middle classes who actually work for their money rather than Russell Brand who, from what I can see, has no discernible talent or redeeming characteristics, or the Rock, who is first and foremost a gym rat and and actor, but is actually a genuinely nice guy it would seem.

The middle classes are working on the time is money philosophy, and therefore lack the time, in their heads, for the social interaction you desire.

Or maybe, they just drink and socialise in pubs you can't afford to drink in?
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donkeydong
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The rich are smart because rather than being a consumer of services and goods, they are the ones who own those services and goods or have debt securities in them.

So rather than buying that primark jumper or those greggs pasties, they own shares in ABF (the owner of primark) and Greggs. Therefore they are gaining from a productive economy. They also buy debt securities like bonds, which give them interest payments for loaning a company or government money.

The way to become rich is to spend less and use the money you get to buy exceptional businesses in the form of stocks. Essentially if you own large chunks of successful companies, you will be rich in no time.
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Serine Soul
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Yeah they can be a bit bland
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tabmax22
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(Original post by Tubbz)
I'd guess because the upper/middle classes who actually work for their money rather than Russell Brand who, from what I can see, has no discernible talent or redeeming characteristics, or the Rock, who is first and foremost a gym rat and and actor, but is actually a genuinely nice guy it would seem.

The middle classes are working on the time is money philosophy, and therefore lack the time, in their heads, for the social interaction you desire.

Or maybe, they just drink and socialise in pubs you can't afford to drink in?
Russell Brand and the Rock are entertainers. They still work for their money. But anyway, that's besides the point. I was just using as an example of people who are very charismatic. This isn't a debate about who deserves to get paid how much.

Does working for your money means you should be less charismatic and extroverted? I'm not sure what you're saying.
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tabmax22
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(Original post by donkeydong;72488948[b)
]The rich are smart because rather than being a consumer of services and goods, they are the ones who own those services and goods or have debt securities in them.[/b]

So rather than buying that primark jumper or those greggs pasties, they own shares in ABF (the owner of primark) and Greggs. Therefore they are gaining from a productive economy. They also buy debt securities like bonds, which give them interest payments for loaning a company or government money.

The way to become rich is to spend less and use the money you get to buy exceptional businesses in the form of stocks. Essentially if you own large chunks of successful companies, you will be rich in no time.
Mate I'm not talking about like the elite top 1%, I'm just talking about average middle class people working as teachers, doctors, solicitors and in other graduate jobs. Not all of them own services and goods.

Even if they do, I fail to see your point. You can be rich and charismatic. I'm merely pointing out that it seems to be a British thing to be very bland and dull.
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Pinkberry_y
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Once you get to middle/upper class status, a wooden stick is inserted up your A S S
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the bear
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when we are in a group together we have great craic... it's just when interacting with outsiders that we are less flamboyant OP :dontknow:
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Drewski
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I think your examples are rather anecdotal instead of quantitative and reflect more on your experiences than what reality might actually be.

I also think you're playing fast and loose with the whole 'posh' thing and lumping the middle and upper classes together, when these days it's not that simple.
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yungaheartz
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Because they can be

The Brits - well the world really - value money the way young people value looks.

If you're good looking you can get away with having no personality, likewise if you've got the money (or the status) then people don't really care if you've got charisma. It's sort of become an identity of the middle class because they know they can get away with being pompous

Middle class and dull > poor and charismatic

I mean there's a reason why people still prefer the likes of kate Middleton over Russell brand. Russel might be more interesting but he's still a chav.
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Tubbz
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(Original post by tabmax22)
Russell Brand and the Rock are entertainers. They still work for their money. But anyway, that's besides the point. I was just using as an example of people who are very charismatic. This isn't a debate about who deserves to get paid how much.

Does working for your money means you should be less charismatic and extroverted? I'm not sure what you're saying.
My point is you've picked two people who are wealthy purely for having extroverted personalities... That is quite literally their job.

When you're having to do some actual work rather than just rambling all day, it tends to get in the way a bit of being over the top extroverted like the two examples you've cited.

Don't forget, as well, the types of middle class jobs you're referring to have most required a dedicated mindset and a lot of hard work. It's hard to get into that mindset and let your hair down when you're away from work, so people can come across as a bit stiff.

That, or you just don't socialise with those people in the correct environment. I know a lot of people who you would consider "middle class" who are incredibly serious in an around their job, then are completely different at the weekend.

I'd say it's more professionalism than lack of charisma.
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tabmax22
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(Original post by Tubbz)
My point is you've picked two people who are wealthy purely for having extroverted personalities... That is quite literally their job.

When you're having to do some actual work rather than just rambling all day, it tends to get in the way a bit of being over the top extroverted like the two examples you've cited.

Don't forget, as well, the types of middle class jobs you're referring to have most required a dedicated mindset and a lot of hard work. It's hard to get into that mindset and let your hair down when you're away from work, so people can come across as a bit stiff.

That, or you just don't socialise with those people in the correct environment. I know a lot of people who you would consider "middle class" who are incredibly serious in an around their job, then are completely different at the weekend.

I'd say it's more professionalism than lack of charisma.
I wasn't speculating why they're charismatic. I was merely giving example of what I mean when I talk about charisma.

Wait what? I remember having teachers that were amazingly charismatic, but not very many of them. You're missing my point. Having a dedicated mindset and being hard working etc all those things are not mutually exclusive with having charisma. You can have a good time at work too. I'm just talking about a general level of extrovertedness as a personality. Middle class British people don't seem to be very extroverted, but rather only open and wild with people who they comfortably know.

Again, being professional and charismatic aren't mutually exclusive. I'd say I'm quite professional and hard working, but if someone strikes a conversation with me at a bus stop or at a supermarket then I would happily have a conversation. I've noticed the British middle class (especially Londoners) lack this trait. Northerners are quite friendly and easy to talk to.
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tabmax22
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(Original post by yungaheartz)
Because they can be

The Brits - well the world really - value money the way young people value looks.

If you're good looking you can get away with having no personality, likewise if you've got the money (or the status) then people don't really care if you've got charisma. It's sort of become an identity of the middle class because they know they can get away with being pompous

Middle class and dull > poor and charismatic

I mean there's a reason why people still prefer the likes of kate Middleton over Russell brand. Russel might be more interesting but he's still a chav.
I don't see the two mutually exclusive though that's what I mean. You can value money, value time, hard work, and all those important things but yet still be charismatic and charming and basically not boring.

true, good looking people do tend to have less extravagant personalities. @ bold: see this is what I meant, and the comments on this thread are only vindicating what I was saying, Brits seem to have this mentality that if you have status you can be a ****. It's quite clear even going by what people are commenting on this thread. I just don't get why the brits see the two things as mutually exclusive.

As for the Middleton and Brand comment, I'm really not sure what people here have against Russell Brand. I think he's brilliant. He's a comedic genius and is incredibly captivating to listen to. I don't necessarily agree with his political views but that doesn't mean he's not talented. Really, I don't think what people prefer about Kate Middleton. I don't think Kate is anywhere near as likeable as Russell Brand, personality wise.
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Tubbz
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(Original post by tabmax22)
I wasn't speculating why they're charismatic. I was merely giving example of what I mean when I talk about charisma.

Wait what? I remember having teachers that were amazingly charismatic, but not very many of them. You're missing my point. Having a dedicated mindset and being hard working etc all those things are not mutually exclusive with having charisma. You can have a good time at work too. I'm just talking about a general level of extrovertedness as a personality. Middle class British people don't seem to be very extroverted, but rather only open and wild with people who they comfortably know.

Again, being professional and charismatic aren't mutually exclusive. I'd say I'm quite professional and hard working, but if someone strikes a conversation with me at a bus stop or at a supermarket then I would happily have a conversation. I've noticed the British middle class (especially Londoners) lack this trait. Northerners are quite friendly and easy to talk to.
You're getting in to North/South divide as well now.

They're not mutually exclusive traits no, but there's a time and a place. I certainly don't want my solicitor jumping up in court screaming "Banter" and then getting the jury chanting "Lads, lads, lads"

You're always going to be more extroverted around people your comfortable with, that's just human nature.

I really don't think you've got a point. People in those sorts of jobs conduct themselves "properly" when appropriate.

Now we're getting to what you actually mean, being receptive, and willing to engage in conversation isn't really a class trait, that's just a British trait, and agreed, is particularly bad in London. If someone is unreceptive to conversation, it's not a class thing, they're probably just wanting to get to work where they're going to have to spend all day making idle chit chat, who wants to do that on the commute with the bus nutter?
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ddrrzzeerr
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Like beauty, charisma is in the eye of the beholder. You are more likely to find people of your own background charismatic because you are more in tune with the culture.

Having said that, I find people from higher social class more charismatic. It helps to be intelligent and well educated and you need eloquence to be charismatic. All of those are more common in higher social classes.
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ddrrzzeerr
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They are subjective. OP thinks Russell Brand is charismatic, I think he is a ******. I can't even stand listening to him. If he is on TV, I have to change the channel.
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