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Muslim sues school for asking her not to wear burka on premises Watch

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    (Original post by YaliaV)
    Covering your face is not generally acceptable. They probably don't allow baseball caps or hoodies, so why should they allow burkas?
    They are most unlikely to prohibit baseball caps or hoodies amongst parents.

    You are clearly living in a different country if you think that wearing a burka is not generally acceptable in the UK. No-one will arrest you in the street, no-one will prevent you being served in a bank or Post-Office and in the overwhelming majority of schools you will not be turned away from parents' evening if wearing a burka.
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    (Original post by YaliaV)
    It's cultural and not religious. Anyway, why should that make a difference? Culture and religion shouldn't be an excuse to behave badly or be granted special rights. Everybody is equal and everybody has to obey the rules


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    It's not about obeying the rules but rather expressing the freedom that we all strive towards. If we do something like this, it's just a step backward for all of us. This is essentially forcing one to conform to this society when we should be allowing people to express their culture however they like. England is diverse, many cultures make us up so depriving one of their culture is depriving England of its essence.
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    (Original post by HotDetermination)
    It's not about obeying the rules but rather expressing the freedom that we all strive towards. If we do something like this, it's just a step backward for all of us. This is essentially forcing one to conform to this society when we should be allowing people to express their culture however they like. England is diverse, many cultures make us up so depriving one of their culture is depriving England of its essence.
    We are all forced to conform in many ways - that's a society for you. There are rules and responsibilities. Special dispensations result in an unequal society


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    (Original post by QE2)
    But covering the face is not an explicit requirement of Islam, it is a quasi-cultural development that is considered as a requirement by some. Just like FGM. Should that also be allowed "for religious reasons"?

    I'm confused now.
    Do you think that visitors on school premises should have to remove masks and other face coverings, or not?
    If you think it is acceptable for visitors to school premises to hide their faces, then that applies to everyone, not just people covering their faces due to non-mandatory religious custom. If you think it is unacceptable, the same principle applies.
    FGM is an entirely different case, as that has many implications. The burka is simply a piece of clothing that Muslim women wear: it's how we perceive it that's resulted in this unnecessary stigma. It doesn't explicitly bring harm to anyone.

    Yes, visitors should be made to remove face coverings when entering a school. Rules don't have to be the same for everyone: for people who wear religious clothing should never be made to take off what is extremely important to them. Yes, logically it seems unfair but in practice it will make sense. Why should someone be allowed to wear a bandana? Does this have sacred religious connotations? If not, they should be made to take it off.
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    (Original post by YaliaV)
    We are all forced to conform in many ways - that's a society for you. There are rules and responsibilities. Special dispensations result in an unequal society


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    Yes but our society is already unequal: we are not living under a communist government. If this was a communist country, then I would have to agree with you but this is different. This an item of religious clothing: it would be morally wrong to force them to take it off.
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    (Original post by HotDetermination)
    It's not about obeying the rules but rather expressing the freedom that we all strive towards. If we do something like this, it's just a step backward for all of us. This is essentially forcing one to conform to this society when we should be allowing people to express their culture however they like. England is diverse, many cultures make us up so depriving one of their culture is depriving England of its essence.
    Yeah exactly, this is the UK. If the culture of another is not compatible with the home culture here and the other cultures which manage to exist peacefully here, then we have a problem with this incompatible culture.

    We don't need the UK to become a free-for-all in the name of 'freedom'. I think you are deluded by your 'goals' of freedom.
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    (Original post by HotDetermination)
    Yes but our society is already unequal: we are not living under a communist government. If this was a communist country, then I would have to agree with you but this is different. This an item of religious clothing: it would be morally wrong to force them to take it off.
    The origin of the wearing of the burka is cultural, as has been pointed out several times. Muslim women are required to dress modestly
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    (Original post by Moonstruck16)
    Yeah exactly, this is the UK. If the culture of another is not compatible with the home culture here and the other cultures which manage to exist peacefully here, then we have a problem with this incompatible culture.

    We don't need the UK to become a free-for-all in the name of 'freedom'. I think you are deluded by your 'goals' of freedom.
    And I believe I am not deluded in my 'goals' of freedom. It's not incompatible with the UK: this rule was initially a paranoid one it conveys a lack of trust between us as a society. A free for all society would be lovely: we can ignore things like ethnicity and grow together as humans. Optimism is what will help us to grow as a country: we have no room for pessimism!
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    (Original post by Moonstruck16)
    The origin of the wearing of the burka is cultural, as has been pointed out several times. Muslim women are required to dress modestly, nothing in the Quran says that they need to dress up as the reaper.
    An insensitive comment isn't going to help us here. Yes, it's cultural so let them partake in their culture. We don't need to complicate this: it's their choice what they do with themselves and exceptions will be made when it comes to religion.
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    (Original post by Moonstruck16)
    The origin of the wearing of the burka is cultural, as has been pointed out several times. Muslim women are required to dress modestly, nothing in the Quran says that they need to dress up as the reaper.
    The origin of the bowler hat was as protective headware when riding. Does that mean I am not allowed to wear one if I don't have a horse?
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    (Original post by HotDetermination)
    And I believe I am not deluded in my 'goals' of freedom. It's not incompatible with the UK: this rule was initially a paranoid one it conveys a lack of trust between us as a society. A free for all society would be lovely: we can ignore things like ethnicity and grow together as humans. Optimism is what will help us to grow as a country: we have no room for pessimism!
    I think you are because it will never happen and if it did it would last all of about 1 second. You can't rewire hundreds of thousands of years of human behaviour. And by free-for-all you do realise it will not be at all harmonious lmao.
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    (Original post by HotDetermination)
    An insensitive comment isn't going to help us here. Yes, it's cultural so let them partake in their culture. We don't need to complicate this: it's their choice what they do with themselves and exceptions will be made when it comes to religion.
    Why should we permit a culture that is often considered incompatible with the culture of this country? You don't see people trying this when they move to Saudi Arabia lol.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    The origin of the bowler hat was as protective headware when riding. Does that mean I am not allowed to wear one if I don't have a horse?
    Ah, an idiotic comparison. I was waiting for one to pop up.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    The origin of the bowler hat was as protective headware when riding. Does that mean I am not allowed to wear one if I don't have a horse?
    I think the point being made it is not a religious item of clothing, but a cultural one and removing it does not impact religious freedoms.
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    (Original post by Meany Pie)
    I think the point being made it is not a religious item of clothing, but a cultural one and removing it does not impact religious freedoms.
    No, but it impacts on the freedom to wear a black bedsheet with eyeholes.
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    (Original post by Moonstruck16)
    I am so offended I might report you :O
    So you can joke and offend other people but you yourself cannot take a joke.

    Got it.
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    (Original post by popo111)
    So you can joke and offend other people but you yourself cannot take a joke.

    Got it.
    You have just made my day xxx
    100% correct
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    They are most unlikely to prohibit baseball caps or hoodies amongst parents.

    You are clearly living in a different country if you think that wearing a burka is not generally acceptable in the UK. No-one will arrest you in the street, no-one will prevent you being served in a bank or Post-Office and in the overwhelming majority of schools you will not be turned away from parents' evening if wearing a burka.
    Not to mention that the woman making the claim has been wearing a burka for 14 years and had not had any issues collecting her children from school prior to this incident.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    No, but it impacts on the freedom to wear a black bedsheet with eyeholes.
    That isn't a freedom protected by law is it?
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    Sorry since when did schools dictate what a parent wears? If it was actual written policy fair enough, but it wasn't.
 
 
 
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