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Al Aqsa Mosque events Watch

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    So two men from the mosque murder two Israeli police officers then go running back into the mosque. Israeli take precautionary measures and set up metal detectors outside the mosque. Seems fair enough. Even Mecca has metal detectors. But the Imam responds by instructing the mosque goers to carry out a Day of Rage which they did creating public disorder and riot. Such is the religion of peace! Next thing is to organize praying outside the mosque on the street instead of inside the mosque. Praying outside is prohibited and they were removed swiftly. Fair enough in my view. They are on the Temple Mount in Israel yet Israel in her tolerance allows Muslims to worship there. In Palestine Jews are forbidden to practice their faith. What is your opinion on what is happening at Al-Aqsa mosque?
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    Whilst I agree Israel haven't done a lot wrong here, they really should've seen this coming.
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    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/0...113840496.html

    It seems like they are simply defending their rights? Do you suggest they just sit down and take everything? I don't disagree with metal detectors, but banning muslims under the age of 50...

    Correct me if I am misinformed here

    Israeli police also fired live ammunition, tear gas and rubber-coated bullets at Palestinians protesting against the new measures, including the barring of Muslim men under the age of 50 from the holy site and the installation of metal detectors.
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    Read this:
    http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opi...091622756.html

    They aren't doing it for 'security measures' they are doing it to appease Jewish extremists who want to see Palestinians cleansed out of Jerusalem. Don't believe a single word that comes out of Israel.
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    Interesting views. I think Israel constantly gets reported unfairly by the Western mainstream media corporations and there are many Muslims who seem to blame 'zionists' for everything. The problem as I see it is the prejudice against Jews by Islam. It's part of the religion. Therefore they cannot be interested in true peace with Israeli Jews. Muslims don't want Israel to exist so there is this unfortunate ongoing tension. I don't see how peace talks and diplomacy can solve the problem because you haven't got the necessary ingredients to even start with.
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    (Original post by Marco1)
    Interesting views. I think Israel constantly gets reported unfairly by the Western mainstream media corporations and there are many Muslims who seem to blame 'zionists' for everything. The problem as I see it is the prejudice against Jews by Islam. It's part of the religion. Therefore they cannot be interested in true peace with Israeli Jews. Muslims don't want Israel to exist so there is this unfortunate ongoing tension. I don't see how peace talks and diplomacy can solve the problem because you haven't got the necessary ingredients to even start with.
    this is the kind of thing I don't understand, why upon criticising Israel all of a sudden religion comes into play?
    Why are the Israeli government and the religion of Judaism conflated?

    it's not about some prejudice against people who are Jewish, but measures taken by the government of Israel, not the main synagogue or whatever, that hurts the rights of Palestinians.

    Their government has gone and imposed upon many innocent Palestinians collective punishment, not allowing them to pray in one of the holiest sites in the Islamic world. It's yet another example of the routine of injustice and oppression that Palestinians in Jerusalem are facing, but when people like yourself bring Judaism into the equation it stops us from having a sensible debate, and gets us embroiled into a waste of time argument about antisemitism/Islamophobia.
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    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    this is the kind of thing I don't understand, why upon criticising Israel all of a sudden religion comes into play?
    Why are the Israeli government and the religion of Judaism conflated?

    it's not about some prejudice against people who are Jewish, but measures taken by the government of Israel, not the main synagogue or whatever, that hurts the rights of Palestinians.

    Their government has gone and imposed upon many innocent Palestinians collective punishment, not allowing them to pray in one of the holiest sites in the Islamic world. It's yet another example of the routine of injustice and oppression that Palestinians in Jerusalem are facing, but when people like yourself bring Judaism into the equation it stops us from having a sensible debate, and gets us embroiled into a waste of time argument about antisemitism/Islamophobia.
    Do you think the Israel are doing it for no reason? What about the rights of Israelis to be safe and the two police officers murdered at the mosque by Palestinian gunmen? What about respect for the law and civic responsibility and compliance with the laws of the land.
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    (Original post by Marco1)
    Do you think the Israel are doing it for no reason? What about the rights of Israelis to be safe and the two police officers murdered at the mosque by Palestinian gunmen? What about respect for the law and civic responsibility and compliance with the laws of the land.
    we could talk for hours about what he did and what she did.
    what compelled the Palestinian gunmen to murder the officers? was it just for a laugh?
    of course, murder is wrong, but it's not like they killed them for no reason.

    Funny how you talk about the laws of the land.
    Like Israel aren't defying International Law by engaging in illegal settling in Palestinian majority territory.
    Also, the law of the land states the Muslims have the right to the Al-Aqsa mosque in terms of praying there, Jews have a right to visit but not to pray there (not my rule btw) but Israel has allegedly been defying this law also.

    But you see, these points that you just made are fine and valid, my problem is when you bring religion into it. It's got nothing to do with Judaism, rather the state of Israel and their actions. When people hide behind antisemitism to defend the Israeli government problems arise, it inhibits debate and fair critique.
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    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    we could talk for hours about what he did and what she did.
    what compelled the Palestinian gunmen to murder the officers? was it just for a laugh?
    of course, murder is wrong, but it's not like they killed them for no reason.

    Funny how you talk about the laws of the land.
    Like Israel aren't defying International Law by engaging in illegal settling in Palestinian majority territory.
    Also, the law of the land states the Muslims have the right to the Al-Aqsa mosque in terms of praying there, Jews have a right to visit but not to pray there (not my rule btw) but Israel has allegedly been defying this law also.

    But you see, these points that you just made are fine and valid, my problem is when you bring religion into it. It's got nothing to do with Judaism, rather the state of Israel and their actions. When people hide behind antisemitism to defend the Israeli government problems arise, it inhibits debate and fair critique.
    You're not willing to follow a discussion. I made fair points but there is evasion on your part, 'we could talk for hours' bla bla bla'. I also made a valid point about Islam's view of the Jews and you deem it completely irrelevant - But hang on a minute, two police officers were killed at the mosque who afterwards hid in the mosque. This indicates that religion just might have something to do with it. Talking frankly and forthrightly is discussion at its best. Why skirt around the houses? The metal detectors are a measured civilized response. You say 'What compelled the gunmen to murder the police officers?' - What! You're joking right? You think it could be justifiable to murder cops but not justifiable to introduce metal detectors as a safety precaution after this tragic event. Give me strength.
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    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    lol I "skirt around the houses"?
    says you who mentions nothing of the prohibition of Muslims entering the al-Aqsa mosque if they're under 50

    I clearly said the gunmen were wrong to kill ffs have you not the capacity to read for crying out load.

    Of course Islams views on Judaism are irrelevant on this matter you utter halfwit, the recent events have been triggered by divisions between the Israeli government and the Palestinian people, did Judaism introduce the metal detectors? did Judaism prevent Muslims entering the 3rd holiest site in Islam? no. But since you clearly don't have the capacity to not conflate religion with politics arguing with you is like trying to draw blood from a rock.

    When did I say it's not justifiable to introduce metal detectors?
    I didn't say anything about it because I don't believe it's a big problem to introduce metal detectors at this moment in time.

    you know what is wrong though?
    -the collective punishment upon the entire Palestinian community for what 3 men did.
    -illegal settlements
    -the fact that Israel has blocked entry and exit visas for aid workers trying to get into the Gaza Strip attempting to help people in a desolate state.
    -the fact that Israel denied 31% of visas for aid workers trying simply to help those vulnerable in the Gaza strip.
    -checkpoints where only (illegal) settlers are allowed to pass
    -the blatant apartheid in certain regions of the area
    -2000 palestinians dead since 2009-2014
    -forced displacements
    -abusive detentions

    why don't you consider what the Israeli government have done over the years as a motive for the gunmens (albeit wrong) actions instead of running to religion you moron.
    You stray from the subject and you have the gall to say I'm conflating religion with it? Firstly that is your assumption which I have disproved because I explained why it was relevant, and above you too even claim it is relevant. It seems that you are a little emotionally incontinent too and that is another blight on any serious sober discussion. Don't give me all your list of facts. You only appear to be concerned with name calling and supporting the Palestinian cause. No reference there of the many Israeli innocents who have been maimed and massacred. Get real. No reference there of Hamas and indoctrinating adolescents to hate Jews and want to kill them.
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    (Original post by Marco1)
    You stray from the subject and you have the gall to say I'm conflating religion with it? Firstly that is your assumption which I have disproved because I explained why it was relevant, and above you too even claim it is relevant. It seems that you are a little emotionally incontinent too and that is another blight on any serious sober discussion. Don't give me all your list of facts. You only appear to be concerned with name calling and supporting the Palestinian cause. No reference there of the many Israeli innocents who have been maimed and massacred. Get real. No reference there of Hamas and indoctrinating adolescents to hate Jews and want to kill them.
    are you actually for real?
    Palestinians have been killed to a far greater extent than Israelis.
    On that "list of facts" of mine that you don't like, (presumably because the truth hurts?) I mentioned how many dead.
    Wanna know how many Israelis have died?

    "Israeli security forces used lethal force against suspected attackers in more than 150 cases, including in circumstances that suggest excessive force and at times extrajudicial executions. Overall, between January 1 and October 31, 2016, Palestinians killed at least 11 Israelis, including 2 security officers, and injured 131 Israelis, including 46 security officers, in the West Bank and Israel. Israeli security forces killed at least 94 Palestinians and injured at least 3,203 Palestinians in the West Bank, Gaza, and Israel as of October 31, including suspected assailants, protesters, and bystanders, according to the United Nations."

    Palestinians shouldn't have shed blood either but,
    the Israeli forces killing bystanders ffs?
    but poor old Israel hey? woe to Israel am i right?

    and the whole point of that list was to explain that these issues extends beyond religion, it's about the actions of the Israeli state as much as any division between Islam and Judaism, but your blatant ignorance of my inconvenient facts suggests you blindly support the Israeli regime.

    Oh, and btw, I'm perfectly comfortable with calling out the Palestinian regime when they're wrong, unlike you with the Israelis. They shouldn't engage in violence even though they're often wronged, the Arab world shouldn't have been so anti-Israel in the 40's and 60's.
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    Not surprising that the islamic brigade has come to undermine the deaths of innocent jews at the hands of their kin.

    History repeats itself
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    (Original post by TheBBQ)
    Not surprising that the islamic brigade has come to undermine the deaths of innocent jews at the hands of their kin.

    History repeats itself
    assuming my religion now are you?

    not surprising that in a blind defence of the Israeli government the "oh my god that's antisemitic" brigade come running along obscuring the actions of a sovereign state behind religion.

    bet you didn't give a f*ck when you saw those dead Palestinian boys blown to smithereens because they were playing footie, at the beach.

    and next time be man enough to @ people instead of sending indirects.
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    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    assuming my religion now are you?

    not surprising that in a blind defence of the Israeli government the "oh my god that's antisemitic" brigade come running along obscuring the actions of a sovereign state behind religion.

    bet you didn't give a f*ck when you saw those dead Palestinian boys blown to smithereens because they were playing footie, at the beach.

    and next time be man enough to @ people instead of sending indirects.
    I'm not talking about just you.

    I never said it's antisemitic. There's nothing wrong with metal detectors at a place of worship. Many have them in dangerous areas such as Northern India where tibetan monks have taken refuge.

    The fact that people are up in arms over a metal detector rather than the deaths of innocent jews shows more than enough about them, and you.

    Did you see the baby that got killed by a palestinian sniper in Israel?

    Next time try to hide your extremist views.
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    (Original post by TheBBQ)
    I'm not talking about just you.

    I never said it's antisemitic. There's nothing wrong with metal detectors at a place of worship. Many have them in dangerous areas such as Northern India where tibetan monks have taken refuge.

    The fact that people are up in arms over a metal detector rather than the deaths of innocent jews shows more than enough about them, and you.

    Did you see the baby that got killed by a palestinian sniper in Israel?

    Next time try to hide your extremist views.
    oh. my. god.
    please tell me I read that right.
    I'm an "extremist" for believing that people under the age of 50 should be allowed to access their mosque?

    okay, pal. clearly you have no idea what extremism is.

    don't care that metal detectors are being introduced. I see it as pretty rational.
    do care that the entire Palestinian community is having collective punishment enforced upon them because of what 3 murderers did.

    also acknowledge the fact that the murder of Israelis was wrong. Completely. I don't defend murderers.

    the fact that you're ignorant of the fact the Palestinians suffer far more hardship than Israelis shows more than enough about you.

    I actually cba arguing with someone who believes voicing valid opinions that may go against his/hers makes you an extremist.
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    (Original post by Marco1)
    So two men from the mosque murder two Israeli police officers then go running back into the mosque. Israeli take precautionary measures and set up metal detectors outside the mosque. Seems fair enough. Even Mecca has metal detectors. But the Imam responds by instructing the mosque goers to carry out a Day of Rage which they did creating public disorder and riot. Such is the religion of peace! Next thing is to organize praying outside the mosque on the street instead of inside the mosque. Praying outside is prohibited and they were removed swiftly. Fair enough in my view. They are on the Temple Mount in Israel yet Israel in her tolerance allows Muslims to worship there. In Palestine Jews are forbidden to practice their faith. What is your opinion on what is happening at Al-Aqsa mosque?
    Well closing down the mosque which hasn't been closed for 69 yrs you tell me. whilst Muslims pray before a roadblock whilst these Zionist mother****ers stand in front which is huge sign of disrespect. OH YH WHAT ABOUT THOSE THREE MUSLIM PALESTINIANS THAT WERE KILLED FOR NO REASON?
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    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    oh. my. god.
    please tell me I read that right.
    I'm an "extremist" for believing that people under the age of 50 should be allowed to access their mosque?

    okay, pal. clearly you have no idea what extremism is.

    don't care that metal detectors are being introduced. I see it as pretty rational.
    do care that the entire Palestinian community is having collective punishment enforced upon them because of what 3 murderers did.

    also acknowledge the fact that the murder of Israelis was wrong. Completely. I don't defend murderers.

    the fact that you're ignorant of the fact the Palestinians suffer far more hardship than Israelis shows more than enough about you.

    I actually cba arguing with someone who believes voicing valid opinions that may go against his/hers makes you an extremist.
    The fact that you think that the palestinian gunman had a reason to kill the police says enough.

    The palestinian people have been supporting a government bent on terrorising the israeli and jewish population. So much so that soldiers have been killed by mobs simply for accidentally straying into certain areas. The anti jewish propaganda is built into childrens cartoons and shows.

    The fact that you think that there is some kind of justification to these deaths shows and that you are ignorant of the plight of israelis that they face in their daily life with the threat of hamas firing missles or experiencing again one of hundreds of attacks over the years, makes you an extremist.
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    (Original post by TheBBQ)
    The fact that you think that the palestinian gunman had a reason to kill the police says enough.

    The palestinian people have been supporting a government bent on terrorising the israeli and jewish population. So much so that soldiers have been killed by mobs simply for accidentally straying into certain areas. The anti jewish propaganda is built into childrens cartoons and shows.

    The fact that you think that there is some kind of justification to these deaths shows and that you are ignorant of the plight of israelis that they face in their daily life with the threat of hamas firing missles or experiencing again one of hundreds of attacks over the years, makes you an extremist.
    incredible.

    There is motive behind almost every murder. You yourself clearly believe there was motive, you believe the motive is some kind of anti-israeli one. I believe that may well be the case, I also say don't rule out the injustices faced by the Palestinian people.

    Not once did i "justify" the murder of the Israeli soldiers, that is a 100% lie. You literally lied bro like why am I even wasting my time on someone who makes up reality as he goes along.

    I'm not ignorant of the the suffering of the Israeli people, like where do you get this stuff from? I said that Palestinians resorting to violence is wrong. Always.

    and even if I was ignorant of the plight of Israelis, that wouldn't make me extreme, that would make me ignorant.
    what would make me extreme would be believing that Israelis deserve to be murdered and maimed, which I obviously don't, so please, when making unsubstantiated and false claims about people, at least get your unsubstantiated and false claims right.
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    (Original post by SuperHuman98)
    It seems like they are simply defending their rights? Do you suggest they just sit down and take everything?
    I, for one, suggest they accept very reasonable security precautions around the area. Sitting down isn't required: they can do this standing up too.

    I don't disagree with metal detectors, but banning muslims under the age of 50...
    Men under 50. Restrictions were also placed on Jewish access around the Temple Mount. It's a short-term reaction to control public order and prevent further riots.

    (Original post by desaf1)
    They aren't doing it for 'security measures' they are doing it to appease Jewish extremists who want to see Palestinians cleansed out of Jerusalem. Don't believe a single word that comes out of Israel.
    They could have barred access to the Temple Mount decades ago if the Israeli Government was so minded. Instead they've upheld that access and helped to enable it.

    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    Their government has gone and imposed upon many innocent Palestinians collective punishment, not allowing them to pray in one of the holiest sites in the Islamic world.
    It's not a "punishment", it's a preventative measure: and one that I suspect works.
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    (Original post by hamzakalinle)
    we could talk for hours about what he did and what she did.
    what compelled the Palestinian gunmen to murder the officers? was it just for a laugh?
    of course, murder is wrong, but it's not like they killed them for no reason.
    Yes, they were no doubt compelled by murderous racial hatred. There's no suggestion that the Israeli police involved did anything at all improper.

    Also, the law of the land states the Muslims have the right to the Al-Aqsa mosque in terms of praying there, Jews have a right to visit but not to pray there (not my rule btw) but Israel has allegedly been defying this law also.
    The State of Israel made that law and it is Israeli police that enforce it. The idea that they can "defy" it is nonsense. Some Jewish people want to pray there despite most - I believe - understanding that it is improper to set foot on the Mount due to its sacredness. Some may pray on it, and I actually I think it's pretty rough that Israeli law prevents that.
 
 
 
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