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Rakas21
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- 24-07-2017 19:28
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Saunders16
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- 24-07-2017 19:50
Much better, aye.
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Cognition!
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- 24-07-2017 19:54
This looks difficult to enforce.
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ns_2
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- 24-07-2017 19:57
(Original post by Cognition!)
This looks difficult to enforce. -
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- 24-07-2017 20:02
Forcing schools to call meetings is silly, the bills cannot be enforced because a lot of the time indoctrination is at a school-wide level, and there is no information on the change guilty schools will undergo.
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ns_2
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- 24-07-2017 20:14
(Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
Forcing schools to call meetings is silly, the bills cannot be enforced because a lot of the time indoctrination is at a school-wide level, and there is no information on the change guilty schools will undergo.
i.e. long-term action will be done on a case-by-case basis, and regardless, this will only be the case for those with 'tangible links to proscribed organisations' e.g. terrorism groups - in having tangible links, pupils are at risk - a risk that must be mitigated. -
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- 24-07-2017 20:16
Aye.
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barnetlad
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- 24-07-2017 21:14
I understand the intention of the Bill to be generally well-intentioned (no Daesh sympathising or support for the Real IRA, for example). However, playing 'Free Nelson Mandela' at the time of its release at a school would have fallen within the scope of the Act. Also, I do not think school governors who are voluntary largely can be compelled. Two independent witnesses could be grumpy parents or someone with an axe to grind, as it could include adult evening classes on school premises.
As for actions, there should just be a specific offence, for which the Police and CPS can make decisions on, with upon conviction, a sentence.
Better than the previous Bill but not one i can support in its present form. -
04MR17
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- 24-07-2017 21:17
My main issue with this is that the current rules are close to this anyway.
It is not permitted to encourage students to support political parties, terrorist groups or anything particularly "partisan"
(Original post by ns_2)
A review will be conducted by CONTEST, the Government's long-standing counter-terrorism subsection, alongside the Home Office and the Department for Education to assess whether the problem lies within the individual or whether it is a systematic issue within the educational institution. -
TitanCream
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- 24-07-2017 21:29
giVING IT AN AYE.
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ns_2
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- 24-07-2017 21:34
(Original post by 04MR17)
My main issue with this is that the current rules are close to this anyway.
It is not permitted to encourage students to support political parties, terrorist groups or anything particularly "partisan"
What Nigel was saying was that it is difficult to identify indoctrination in the first place if it is a school-wide problem involving leadership. There are no whistle-blowers in good positions in effect to "sound the alarm" (for want of a better phrase) and trigger the process. -
04MR17
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- 24-07-2017 21:40
(Original post by ns_2)
I understand exactly what you are saying - I tried to address it in the first bill - under the title of the Educational Impartiality Bill 2017, however, people claimed it went too far - hence, I have focused on the most potent issue underlying indoctrination - extremism.
I support the rights of teachers to not have their entire career scrutinised to the finite detail as occurs now.
Talk of penalties here does not reflect the opposition having any respect for the teaching profession. I am not making that an accusation, I am highlighting that your legislation conveys that. -
ns_2
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- 24-07-2017 21:47
(Original post by 04MR17)
I think prevent was strong enough without this.
I support the rights of teachers to not have their entire career scrutinised to the finite detail as occurs now.
Talk of penalties here does not reflect the opposition having any respect for the teaching profession. I am not making that an accusation, I am highlighting that your legislation conveys that. -
ns_2
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- 24-07-2017 21:48
(Original post by 04MR17)
I think prevent was strong enough without this.
I support the rights of teachers to not have their entire career scrutinised to the finite detail as occurs now.
Talk of penalties here does not reflect the opposition having any respect for the teaching profession. I am not making that an accusation, I am highlighting that your legislation conveys that.
Without teachers, and the immense contribution they make, our society, our economy, our people would be nothing. -
04MR17
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- 24-07-2017 21:51
(Original post by ns_2)
I concede that my earlier bill's scope was 'unrestricted' and 'over-controlling'; however, this bill is designed for the sole protection of pupils and members of educational staff alike - preventing them from being indoctrination with the tangled and wrong views of those from 'proscribed organisations' - with evident links to terrorism.
(Original post by ns_2)
The Conservative and Unionist Party as a whole respects fully the contribution teachers make to society; teachers prompt development and initiate a process of investment - it is the actions of teachers now that will fund society in the future.
Without teachers, and the immense contribution they make, our society, our economy, our people would be nothing. -
ns_2
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- 24-07-2017 21:54
(Original post by 04MR17)
And what's wrong with what's currently in place doing exactly that?
So why make these heavy punishments behind them? This will not improve teaching for the majority and is not fair on teachers. -
That Bearded Man
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- 24-07-2017 22:02
I'd actually prefer my kids learn about global warming thanks.
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- 24-07-2017 22:21
what in seven hells is this?
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LifeIsFine
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- 24-07-2017 22:43
(Original post by That Bearded Man)
I'd actually prefer my kids learn about global warming thanks.
I'd also want children to know that the holocaust was real, and that Stalin was a crazed despot. -
Saunders16
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- 24-07-2017 23:01
(Original post by LifeIsFine)
This.
I'd also want children to know that the holocaust was real, and that Stalin was a crazed despot.
That's not an argument against this bill.
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