Would you support a nurses strike?

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Smile88egc
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As a result of government austerity, nurses along with other public sector workers have experienced 5 years of a 1% cap on their pay rises. This followed 2 years of an absolute freeze with 0% rises.
The result is a 14% real terms pay cut over the last 7 years once the rising cost of living I taken into account.
1 in 9 nursing posts in the NHS is now vacant. The Royal College of Nursing have been leading protests against the pay cap, arguing it is harming recruitment and retention of nurses, and ultimately affecting how safe patients are in hospital with so many nurses absent.
It is likely the RCN will ballot nurses in the next few months on whether to take strike action.
Would you support nurses if they choose to go on strike?
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Etomidate
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Absolutely, confident in the fact that the nursing workforce would do so in a safe, responsible and professional manner. My only hope is that the RCN has more balls than the BMA does and sticks to their guns. I don't see what there is to entice people into nursing these days given how challenging a career it is and how much sacrifice in entails, especially with less student support and an ever decreasing return on your labor.

That being said, I'm surprised the vacancy rate is only 1 in 9. It seems much more vast than that, certainly in my area anyway.

I sincerely hope they vote in favor of industrial action.
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BigYoSpeck
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(Original post by Smile88egc)
Would you support nurses if they choose to go on strike?
Yes.

I think theirs, and other public sector workers good will has been exploited for too long. I know it potentially puts patients at risk but I wouldn't blame the health care professionals for that. It's the government that has allowed the situation to deteriorate to this degree and I would fully support health care professionals striking just to get what they deserve, they aren't even being greedy.

Shame on the government for exploiting their good will for this long, and shame on the government if they permit the strike action to go ahead rather than being fair to our public sector workers.
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Whiskey&Freedom
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I would support the instant sacking and withdrawal of professional membership of any striking nurse.

If you don't like the conditions or pay stop complainting and change jobs. Sell your labour to the highest bidder. It is called capitalism and it has made those who work hard rich.
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Trinculo
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(Original post by Smile88egc)
As a result of government austerity, nurses along with other public sector workers have experienced 5 years of a 1% cap on their pay rises. This followed 2 years of an absolute freeze with 0% rises.
The result is a 14% real terms pay cut over the last 7 years once the rising cost of living I taken into account.
1 in 9 nursing posts in the NHS is now vacant. The Royal College of Nursing have been leading protests against the pay cap, arguing it is harming recruitment and retention of nurses, and ultimately affecting how safe patients are in hospital with so many nurses absent.
It is likely the RCN will ballot nurses in the next few months on whether to take strike action.
Would you support nurses if they choose to go on strike?
Well, I mean don't mention their increments. Not like that's an important detail to miss out or anything.

Nurses aren't special. This whole "angels of the NHS" thing is a bunch of nonsense. If they don't like it, they can find another job. But why, I don't know. Nurses are paid pretty well - well enough that I'm confident the whole Jeremy Corbyn "nurses using foodbanks" thing is another load of old tosh.
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Smile88egc
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(Original post by Whiskey&Freedom)

If you don't like the conditions or pay stop complainting and change jobs. Sell your labour to the highest bidder. It is called capitalism and it has made those who work hard rich.
Well that's the point, huge numbers of nurses are leaving the profession, and where does that leave the NHS and it's patients?
And is that an appropriate use of the taxpayers money that funded their training?
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Whiskey&Freedom
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(Original post by Smile88egc)
Well that's the point, huge numbers of nurses are leaving the profession, and where does that leave the NHS and it's patients?
And is that an appropriate use of the taxpayers money that funded their training?
Your right the NHS is a huge waste of taxpayers money. That is why we need to privatise healthcare in the country.
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squeakysquirrel
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(Original post by Smile88egc)
As a result of government austerity, nurses along with other public sector workers have experienced 5 years of a 1% cap on their pay rises. This followed 2 years of an absolute freeze with 0% rises.
The result is a 14% real terms pay cut over the last 7 years once the rising cost of living I taken into account.
1 in 9 nursing posts in the NHS is now vacant. The Royal College of Nursing have been leading protests against the pay cap, arguing it is harming recruitment and retention of nurses, and ultimately affecting how safe patients are in hospital with so many nurses absent.
It is likely the RCN will ballot nurses in the next few months on whether to take strike action.
Would you support nurses if they choose to go on strike?
RCN also striking nurses off left right and centre -several a day.. Trouble is we don't make a profit and as a result we have no leverage.

Also todays nurses militant - degrees but no common sense - bring back the old style - train on the job
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the bear
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the NHS is the only thing holding this country together. we lose it at our peril.
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squeakysquirrel
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(Original post by Trinculo)
Well, I mean don't mention their increments. Not like that's an important detail to miss out or anything.

Nurses aren't special. This whole "angels of the NHS" thing is a bunch of nonsense. If they don't like it, they can find another job. But why, I don't know. Nurses are paid pretty well - well enough that I'm confident the whole Jeremy Corbyn "nurses using foodbanks" thing is another load of old tosh.
I am 33 years qualified - I have been a senior sister. I worked in intensive care for many years and last year saved the life of a skier in Italy..because of my training.... amongst other things. I work in central London now in oncology and on a daily basis face people with a cancer diagnosis. Tell me to my face that I am not special.......
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999tigger
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I would support their right to strike. but I wouldnt expect masses of public support because austerity happened for a reason. People in the private sector faced the same, pay freezes/cuts and lost their jobs over a lot longer period, so am not sure how much sympathy they would get. If they used the leverage they had and went on strike properly, then the government would have to pay.
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BigYoSpeck
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(Original post by squeakysquirrel)
Also todays nurses militant - degrees but no common sense - bring back the old style - train on the job
What do you actually know about nurse training?

Studen nurses do train on wards and with actual patients.

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...nurses-8279420
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squeakysquirrel
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(Original post by BigYoSpeck)
What do you actually know about nurse training?

Studen nurses do train on wards and with actual patients.

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...nurses-8279420
Yes I work with student nurses all the time. Most of them are gormless. I offer to take them to MDT meetings ( multidisciplinary team). The ones who are keen I mentor because it is such a big part of our job. I quiz all of them on anatomy and physiology. I ask about what they have learned. The majority are clock watching. `there are some gems - they will be the nurses of the future.
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PilgrimOfTruth
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(Original post by Smile88egc)
As a result of government austerity, nurses along with other public sector workers have experienced 5 years of a 1% cap on their pay rises. This followed 2 years of an absolute freeze with 0% rises.
Yeah and companies the country over have equally frozen people's salaraies for years or given them nothing but token bonus gestures. The majority of working people have effectively gone backwards. Why should we single out the NHS for special treatment, or the fire service or anyone else ?

We're all in this together are we not?
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squeakysquirrel
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(Original post by BigYoSpeck)
What do you actually know about nurse training?

Studen nurses do train on wards and with actual patients.

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...nurses-8279420
And to be honest your reaction to my post is a little bit arrogant - what do I know about nurse training _ I am a senior nurse. I have just recently done a masters (total waste of time - taught to harvard reference - which was compulsory otherwise I would not pass) Nursing is taught by the bedside not in the classroom. I mentor students every single week. I am allocated students from the university to take alongside me. I want them to to succeed, I want them to be good for the job because you will never be unemployed but some are just.... meh and I write honest reports
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BigYoSpeck
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(Original post by squeakysquirrel)
Yes I work with student nurses all the time. Most of them are gormless. I offer to take them to MDT meetings ( multidisciplinary team). The ones who are keen I mentor because it is such a big part of our job. I quiz all of them on anatomy and physiology. I ask about what they have learned. The majority are clock watching. `there are some gems - they will be the nurses of the future.
Well, I'm not ready to tar all nurses with the same brush based on a man on the street account of them.

The vast majority of nurses I've worked with have been highly intelligent and capable.

If there is a growing deficit in the competency of upcoming student nurses then that perhaps highlights how dangerous abandoning the bursaries combined with the declining pay and working conditions are in failing to attract the right calibre of people to the profession.
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BigYoSpeck
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(Original post by squeakysquirrel)
And to be honest your reaction to my post is a little bit arrogant - what do I know about nurse training _ I am a senior nurse. I have just recently done a masters (total waste of time - taught to harvard reference - which was compulsory otherwise I would not pass) Nursing is taught by the bedside not in the classroom. I mentor students every single week. I am allocated students from the university to take alongside me. I want them to to succeed, I want them to be good for the job because you will never be unemployed but some are just.... meh and I write honest reports
I can hold my hands up and accept I was ignorant of your experience and I welcome the correction on the matter.
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squeakysquirrel
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(Original post by BigYoSpeck)
Well, I'm not ready to tar all nurses with the same brush based on a man on the street account of them.

The vast majority of nurses I've worked with have been highly intelligent and capable.

If there is a growing deficit in the competency of upcoming student nurses then that perhaps highlights how dangerous abandoning the bursaries combined with the declining pay and working conditions are in failing to attract the right calibre of people to the profession.
It is nothing to do with bursaries - it is about recruiting nurses who are caring individuals. YOU DO NOT NEED A DEGREE TO DO THE JOB and I am sorry about shouting this out... sigh. I see these nurses who have degrees and three great A levels and all they want to do in management.

I work in a very niche area of the NHS - to continue in our job we have to do a course - and we have to pass it - and of we don't we get sacked. I am rubbish at exams - I am very old. I failed the first time and passed the second time. I am one of the best in the country at my job. I heard this week of another brilliant girl who failed her exam twice and will now be out of a job. This is not right,. We get no more money for doing our course and passing it. Nothing to do with bursaries - it is a caring profession - you do not learn that in a classroom
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BigYoSpeck
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(Original post by squeakysquirrel)
It is nothing to do with bursaries - it is about recruiting nurses who are caring individuals. YOU DO NOT NEED A DEGREE TO DO THE JOB and I am sorry about shouting this out... sigh. I see these nurses who have degrees and three great A levels and all they want to do in management.

I work in a very niche area of the NHS - to continue in our job we have to do a course - and we have to pass it - and of we don't we get sacked. I am rubbish at exams - I am very old. I failed the first time and passed the second time. I am one of the best in the country at my job. I heard this week of another brilliant girl who failed her exam twice and will now be out of a job. This is not right,. We get no more money for doing our course and passing it. Nothing to do with bursaries - it is a caring profession - you do not learn that in a classroom
Being caring is important to a degree, but competence is more important than compassion. A competitive, competent healthcare professional is just as capable of delivering adequate care to a person because of their wanting to win attitude as a person oozing compassion is. But being caring offers no guarantee of competence.

The recruitment of new nurses will suffer a blow in average competence levels with the declining pay and loss of the bursary, nearly 25% fewer people applied this year as a result, and while I obviously have no stats to back up my hypothesis, I would reasonably assume that the reduced attraction of the profession to highly competent individuals would be inevitable if the financial compensation is worse.

Good will can only be stretched so far.
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squeakysquirrel
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(Original post by BigYoSpeck)
Being caring is important to a degree, but competence is more important than compassion. A competitive, competent healthcare professional is just as capable of delivering adequate care to a person because of their wanting to win attitude as a person oozing compassion is. But being caring offers no guarantee of competence.

The recruitment of new nurses will suffer a blow in average competence levels with the declining pay and loss of the bursary, nearly 25% fewer people applied this year as a result, and while I obviously have no stats to back up my hypothesis, I would reasonably assume that the reduced attraction of the profession to highly competent individuals would be inevitable if the financial compensation is worse.

Good will can only be stretched so far.
100% disagree with you here. We are nurses - you are telling me competence is more important than compassion.

I go onto the wards and see nurses all the time noting things down on computers whilst patients sit in their own mess. What I want to see is the nurse who sits holding the old mans hand when he is having a crisis. What I want to see is the nurse who is looking at her patient and seeing the fear in his eyes instead of noting things down on a computer. They actually sit in the corridor typing.

We have been told that we have to enter stuff directly onto a database instead of talking to a patient and writing things down.
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